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The New Windy City

Posted August 21, 2008 2:22 PM by Shawn
Pathfinder Tags: new windy city wind turbines

The energy crisis is far from over. We are as dependent on foreign oil today as we were yesterday. In what will hopefully pan out to be more than a political uprising, Mayor Michael Bloomberg of New York City has proposed investing in wind turbines. Does the loud picture of a turbine mounted to the Empire State Building seam surreal? Is this the beginning of a new era - and possible energy revolution - that could lead to our energy independence?

I would suggest that the promotion of wind energy by building turbines on the infrastructure in New York City is a lost effort. The skyline is beautiful and turbines would become mired in debate - as has been the case in the Adirondacks in Upstate New York - that they destroy the scenery. Also, is it safe to put large rotating turbines so close to a densely-populated metropolitan district?

If you read the recent article published by the New York Post, you may begin to feel hope and excitement about a public statement from a governing body that realizes the need for a multi-pronged approach to help fix our energy crisis. Maybe building a wind farm not within the city itself (but a few miles off shore) would be a huge step in the right direction. When all is said and done, and any action to implement new energy sources has been taken, I would be more than happy to re-live the slogan "I Love NY!"

Resources:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/08202008/news/regionalnews/breezy_does_it__hizzoner_125263.htm

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/08/20/tech/main4365799.shtml

http://www.adirondackcouncil.org/Adirondack%20groups%20oppose%20windmills.pdf

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#1

Re: The New Windy City

08/21/2008 11:04 PM

Did you hear recent lecture by Al Gore (18th July 2008)?

If not, I can send post it.

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#2

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 12:34 AM

Am I the only one with a solution?

oh well.. it will have to wait

....the new windy city? new york only wishes it had what chicago does!

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#3

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 4:02 AM

Oil is over.

Will someone please tell the Americans?

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 9:48 AM

ok.. YOU stop using it.

send your 'leftovers' to me.. I will find a use

you are uninformed

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#10
In reply to #3

Re: The New Windy City

08/23/2008 10:05 AM

"What were you driving as the oil ran out ?"

Job done.

Oops, opposites attract.

I suspect I may have failed. We'll know it's desparate when they start drilling Florida full of holes - a rich person somewhere needs that humvee.

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: The New Windy City

08/25/2008 12:18 PM

Florida's already full of holes - check out this:

< http://www.dep.state.fl.us/geology/feedback/faq.htm >

In my observations, the only off-road driving a Hummer gets is in the mall parking lot. People who can afford them can afford all the gas in Saudi Arabia, more's the pity.

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: The New Windy City

08/26/2008 3:22 AM

Cool link.

Your Hummer observations are corect, but don't forget the compulsion some people have to drive their kids to school in an 8 seat people-carier or similar. No wonder we all have so many fat kids. At a local School, the parents won't even use the car park 200 yards away -they jocky for position at the gates.

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: The New Windy City

08/26/2008 7:29 AM

8 seats, 3 kids, and the damn van is full to capacity - wot a problem!

Welcome back - Board of Director duties have you tied up, or summat?

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#15
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Re: The New Windy City

08/26/2008 11:10 AM

Tee-hee ! Even us Skwirrels get tied up occasionally. The Hummer is also great for taking a sack of cans down to the recycling plant. For reasons of hygeine, this must be done as a totally separate trip to dropping the sprog off at school. They're also invaluable for driving the dog to a nice place for it to walk ( again, this must be a separate trip).

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: The New Windy City

08/26/2008 1:31 PM

"Even us Skwirrels get tied up occasionally."

I can send someone 'round to help wi' that if y'like...

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#17
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Re: The New Windy City

08/27/2008 2:45 AM

yes, YES, YES !

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#12
In reply to #3

Re: The New Windy City

08/25/2008 1:50 PM

Speak for yourself John!

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#4

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 9:34 AM

Oil is no more over in the world as is CO2 decreasing in atmospheric concentration. Again and again it seems as if economics have influenced society to not change until we are forced to. Cost of infrastructure and raw materials outweighs short term benefits.

In so, every favorable idea that gets presented to solve the energy crisis is depicted as a rash decision with unforeseen repercussions. You might want to ask yourself how much longer until ethanol is in short supply? Would Exxon build wind turbines with its record year after year profits, or will they support new gas turbines and fluidized bed combustion systems?

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#6
In reply to #4

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 11:15 AM

"...a rash decision with unforeseen repercussions..."

Pretty much describes our reliance on petroleum doesn't it? Reminds me of that old song by Jerry Reed:

Well, if you're one of the millions who own one of them gas-drinking, piston-clinking, air-polluting, smoke-belching, four-wheeled buggies from Detroit City, then pay attention. I'm about to sing your song son.

Well, I'm not a man appointed judge
To bear ill-will and hold a grudge
But I think it's time I said me a few choice words
All about that demon automobile
A metal box with the polyglass wheel
The end result to a dream of Henry Ford
Well I've got a car that's mine alone
That me and the finance company own
A ready-made pile of manufactured grief
And if I ain't out of gas in the pouring rain
I'm a-changin' a flat in a hurricane
I once spent three days lost on a cloverleaf
Well it ain't just the smoke and the traffic jam
That makes me the bitter fool I am
But this four-wheel buggy is
A-dollaring me to death
For gas and oils and fluids and grease
And wires and tires and anti freeze
And them accessories
Well honey, that's something else
Well you can get a stereo tape and a color TV
Get a back-seat bar and reclining seats
And just pay once a month, like you do your rent
Well I figured it up and over a period of time
This four thousand dollar car of mine
Costs fourteen thousand dollars
And ninety-nine cents, well now

{Chorus}:
Lord Mr. Ford, I just wish that you could see
What your simple horseless carriage has become
Well it seems your contribution to man
To say the least, got a little out of hand
Well Lord Mr. Ford what have you done

Now the average American father and mother
Own one whole car and half another
And I bet that half a car is a
Trick to buy, don't you
But the thing that amazes me, I guess
Is the way we measure a man's success
By the kind of automobile he can afford to buy
Well now, red light, green light, traffic cop
Right turn, no turn, must turn, stop
Get out the credit card honey, we're out of gas
Well now, all the cars placed end to end
Would reach to the moon and back again
And there'd probably be some
Fool pull out to pass
Well now, how I yearn for the good old days
Without that carbon monoxide haze
A-hanging over the roar of the interstate
Well if the Lord that made the moon and stars
Would have meant for me and you to have cars
He'd have seen that we was all born
With a parking space

{Chorus}

Come away with me Lucille
In my smoking, choking automobile

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 11:48 AM

So?? get a horse!

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#8
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Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 11:54 AM

Mules are more reliable...

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#9

Re: The New Windy City

08/22/2008 4:57 PM

Hi Shawn -

I agree with you: The time for windmills on Manhattan Island should have ended with the British takeover from the Dutch. :)

Aesthetically, it doesn't make sense to me, and I can't think of any other major world city that cares about its skyline that would have towering windmills to disrupt expensive, well-thought-out views. I've been there multiple times (last time in 2003), and have never seen windmills in the style of GE Wind Turbines (like your picture above) in the metro Toronto area.

However, while travelling along the highway from Hannover Germany to Friesland, Northern Holland in 1997, I couldn't help but be impressed by the aesthetic beauty of the wind turbines installed along the highway, near to agricultural land and the north sea coast. Even though more recently I found out that it was Enron that had installed them, that fact doesn't take anything away for me from my feeling of how well they fit into that specific landscape.

To me, what makes more sense for metro-NYC is harnessing the power of the Hudson or East Rivers. A friend of mine (a mechanical engineer) was working recently on a demonstration project for an underwater turbine at a company called Verdant, http://www.verdantpower.com/, but the company stumbled a bit and I'm not sure if Verdant will be continuing with this work.

So I guess it's all about context, context, context, and installing the right technology in the right place.

-april05

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#18

Re: The New Windy City

09/12/2008 11:51 AM

It seems odd to me that people would prefer wind turbines in uninhabited areas so as not to spoil a man made view. People will have complained about the building of every part of the New York sky line and this could simply enhance it, is there another alternative? Well maybe. I was speaking to a friend of mine recently who pointed out something really quite obvious, the humble automobile charges a battery through the use of an alternator. What happens when the battery is full? well it carries on getting charged. His answer is simple, people will always want to use their cars and major cities seem to like the traffic jams, so why not charge more than one battery, this is an easy alteration. Then when you park your car, you plug that battery in and allow it to feed into the electricity grid. This is not a wondeful lets clean up the planet answer, but would help to offset the carbon footprint of cars, and take a little of the burden off the electricity generating companies. A fee system could be brought into operation and people could be paid in credits off their own electricity bill. Simple isn't it, not a big idea but one that has some merit

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#19
In reply to #18

Re: The New Windy City

09/12/2008 12:14 PM

If you've read much on this forum you should know that not many are interested in incremental steps to sanity. They want it all right now and it better not be what they consider to be an eyesore.

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#20
In reply to #19

Re: The New Windy City

09/12/2008 1:17 PM

Isn't the consensus that the public really wants to see alternative energy infrastructure. It doesn't have to take over existing infrastructure but it does need to be more than a speach, research or system that is dependent on gas turbines and coal fired plants.

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