Effect of Hydrogen Sulfide on OH Bare Aerial Conductor (AL)

Why not ask the people who make it?

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I've asked Olex and General Cable in Australia for recommended OH cables to suit steam field environment containing hydrogen sulfide (H2S).

Thought I'd read/learn a bit more on the effects of H2S on OH bare aerial conductors.

Thanks,

Ron

http://www.coleparmer.co.uk/Chemical-Resistance

Nice link PW, thanks!

Hi PWSlack,

Yes, great link, thank you, very helpful to search.

Thanks,

Ron

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023%2FA%3A1012819730798#page-1

Hi DJ,

Yap it's nasty stuff alright.

It would be interesting to know the level of H2S corrosion that would potentially cause an "arc flash," or "flash over" on OH bare AL conductors. If the relationship of H2S corrosion and "flash over" dose exist.

Thanks,

Ron

When I was working HVAC at the geysers project in Northern California, the biggest complaint was metallic salts suspended in solution and condensing on the HV insulators causing arc flash, and it wasn't just limited to HV insulators.

Hi dj95401,

Yes, we've had reported flash-overs on HV Insulators here to. Especially on lines that run near and across steam fields.

Which has triggered the conversion of Bare Aerial Conductor to CCT (Covered Conductor Thick).

Regards,

Ron

Why did you make the leap from H₂S (hydrogen sulfide - gas at RT) to sulfuric acid?

Sulfuric acid is formed by dissolving SO₃ in water.

From WIKI:

Dissolved in water, hydrogen sulfide is known as hydrosulfuric acid or sulfhydric acid, a weak acid.

My post #5 was based on my personal experience while working at the "Geyser's Project" in Northern California. And, while working around cooling towers, it wasn't no mild acid raining down on me and my equipment. I will admit that my laundry drying time was cut ½, as there wasn't much left after the second wash of my work clothes. There's a whole lot more than H2S that comes out those holes in the ground. In fact the only thing green about geothermal power production is the algae that can tolerate the acidity of the run-off water. And with Mercury and inorganic arsenic flowing in the same streams isn't exactly clean either

Why not use insulated conductors?

Hi Tornado,

Yap...I'm looking at CC (covered conductor) & CCT (covered conductor thick) OH conductors to replace an existing circuit of ^120mm2 ACSR (cherry).

The existing circuit is exposed to pressurised steam containing H₂S released from geothermal steam lines.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks,

Ron

I'm not really a power transmission guy, so my question was along the lines of brainstorming. Insulated cable might allow simpler insulators at towers, somewhat compensating for the extra expense.

I wonder about the possibility of underground cable. That's just another idea whose feasibility I don't know.

GA. Surprised no-one mentioned underground earlier...

Hi Hilton,

Underground will be quite expensive, and also the steam fields here were determined by studies to be seismic.

Thanks,

Ron

OK, I have to say this is out of my normal field of experience, but I sense that there is enough steam/ moisture in the atmosphere to form acid with the H2S [Sorry, no formulae..I was never much good at chemistry, but there are readers and members

What a nasty environment to work in! Are there serpents and demons on the payroll as well?

"Are there serpents and demons on the payroll as well?" Yup, they're called "Board Members"

Hi

I suggest you contact Transpower and Mighty River Power as asset owners and operators of aerial conductors from geothermal plants. Or even talk to the New Zealand sales/technical support of General Cable and Olex. I will try and find contacts for you.

Cheers

Hi Cristle,

Oh yeah, please pass me contact emails if you can. Would appreciate to get sales and technical support from Zealand.

General Cable in Australia replied saying they don't make 11KV Covered Cable. Olex dose, will see what they'd say.

A college of mine once worked for transpower. He said H2S can cause "arc flashes" besides corrosion.

Would like to learn a bit more on the level of H2S corrosion on OH bare AL conductors that would potential cause an "arc flah" or "flash over"

Thanks,

Ron

2Al + 3H₂S→ Al₂S₃ +3 H₂ only happens at 600~1000⁰C , you might need electric arc (kick starT)first to see this reaction happens.

Most unlikely to happen at high levels of H₂S, compact solid Al and gaseous H₂S does not readily mixed. Recall chemistry.

There's probably corrosion to happen but at slower phase since activation energy that the two reactants react needs enormous energy raising normal ambient temperature to 600~1000 centigrade

Somebody must make covered 11kV as I have seen it in Tonga. And the lines were not very old.

Hi Ron, I actually have had more work than i wanted around very dangerous levels of H2S. A good place to start if you havent already is a simple Wikipedia page as they do get into quite a good amount of depth. H2S is a Deadly Poisonous, Acidic, Flammable gas that is widely believed to be the second most common cause of Death worldwide behind smoking. So please sir be careful and always wear your PPE!!..That being said depending on the ppm concentration of the gas would almost dictate the process needed. In the US, under 10ppm is ok in a 40 hour work week, the STEL is 20ppm and at 100ppm it is condidered any immediate threat to your life. At 925ppm H2S will kill you in a single breath! Tornado had a good idea in simply use isulated material. H2S is very difficult to keep out of darn near anything and Aluminum is extremely corroded by H2S as are most any conductors or most anything on this planet. That is one nasty gas!! Another gentleman mentioned metallic salts which is a definite issue as well as electrolysis. Please keep in mind that these are all issues that with H2S imagine the worst case scenario then thats maybe a start. Tornado gets my vote and what i would suggest. Make certain that it is a complete seal and preferably plastic in nature as most other compounds are useless. I have a few patents regarding complete H2S remediation but they are for petroleum and wastewater applications though i can possibly see a geothermal application with one or two. Please feel free to email me at (email removed - CR4 Admin) and i can help more than i can type. I also have a minority owner of my company that lives in Auckland, NZ that could possibly help you in person. This site has certain rules and i dont want to violate them and hopefully have not. Also, depending on the H2S levels Arcing is not good due to the Extremely Flammable nature of the gas!!..I hope something here was of assistance and i look forward to possibly being able to assist further. Have a nice day! Paul

Hi PaulAG,

Thank you for a the insight, much appreciated.

Regards.

Ron, Apologies as i just saw that you were in New Guinea. My partner owns a company based in Paupau New Guinea and spends a great deal of time there. I do believe that he can be of tremendous assistance to you and he can relay pertinent info to our R&D Facilities here in SC / USA. We conduct free R&D on subjects that we have s great deal of experience in dealing with already. H2S definitely being one of the tops on our list look forward to hearing from you sir! Paul ( Then sharing the answers with the group!)

Jason Sewell

Product Engineering Manager

General Cables

Christchurch

New Zealand

Email Removed - Cr4 Admin

Hi cristle,

Thank, I'll get in touch Jason.

Regards,

Ron