Previous in Forum: Python Resources on the Internet   Next in Forum: Tesla Dropping Prices
Close
Close
Close
16 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Guru

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7025
Good Answers: 207

LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 1:30 PM

http://ktla.com/category/news/local-news/

I think they'll have a hard time forcing Chinese shippers to pay to convert to electricity dockside.the majority of pollution happens during the hours spend idling at the dock

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#1

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 2:45 PM

What? Eh tu Fredski?

All of a sudden you care?

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7025
Good Answers: 207
#7
In reply to #1

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 6:20 PM

my perspective is from an economic hit standpoint. the carbon hoax is a sideshow to me

Register to Reply
Guru
Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Piping Design Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Richland, WA, USA
Posts: 21017
Good Answers: 795
#8
In reply to #7

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 8:41 PM

Oftentimes shore power is cheaper than self-generated, plus silence is golden in the engine room. The shore power isn't free of pollution somewhere, but it is normally cleaner than shipboard power.

__________________
In vino veritas; in cervisia carmen; in aqua E. coli.
Register to Reply
Guru
Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Piping Design Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Richland, WA, USA
Posts: 21017
Good Answers: 795
#9
In reply to #8

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/14/2016 4:21 AM

It can also be noted that some thousands of those containers (out of quite a few more thousands) might be refrigerated, with a total load exceeding shore power capacity. If so, that puts matters right back to shipboard power.

__________________
In vino veritas; in cervisia carmen; in aqua E. coli.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: South of Minot North Dakota
Posts: 8376
Good Answers: 775
#10
In reply to #7

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/14/2016 5:47 PM

Similar thoughts here inND as well.

California can shut down everything they want and we will be happy add more wind, coal and oil field based natural gas generating capacity to make up for it.

Register to Reply
Guru
Safety - Hazmat - New Member United States - US - Statue of Liberty - New Member Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - Old Hand

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lubbock, Texas
Posts: 14331
Good Answers: 162
#12
In reply to #10

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 4:40 PM

And the latest high capacity HVDC overhead lines to carry that juice to California at a premium price!

__________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just build a better one.
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Optical Engineering - Member Engineering Fields - Engineering Physics - Member Engineering Fields - Systems Engineering - Member

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Trantor
Posts: 5363
Good Answers: 647
#2

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 4:27 PM

They probably need to idle to run the power systems on the ship, shipboard electricity, HVAC, pumps, etc. Making them use CA-supplied electricity merely shifts the pollution somewhere else.

__________________
Whiskey, women -- and astrophysics. Because sometimes a problem can't be solved with just whiskey and women.
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Instrumentation Engineering - New Member Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Technical Fields - Education - New Member Fans of Old Computers - TRS-80 - New Member Hobbies - Musician - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 1331
Good Answers: 30
#3

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 4:30 PM

Make'em put a diaper on their smoke stacks (wink,wink)!

__________________
...and the Devil said: "...yes, but it's a DRY heat..!"
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: by the beach in Florida
Posts: 33392
Good Answers: 1817
#4

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 4:50 PM
__________________
All living things seek to control their own destiny....this is the purpose of life
Register to Reply
Guru
Safety - Hazmat - New Member United States - US - Statue of Liberty - New Member Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - Old Hand

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lubbock, Texas
Posts: 14331
Good Answers: 162
#5

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 4:58 PM

Container ships run on Bunker C. This is possibly the nastiest carbon fuel known to run in an ICE. Supposedly, when these transports come into harbor, they are supposed to switch to No.2 fuel oil (nearly diesel), or diesel. IF they would simply get the new and improved hydrogen on demand system (AC electrolysis of bicarbonate solution using iron electrodes (not steel)), they could reduce fuel consumption even while idling through much improved combustion progress each burn (i.e. the flame front keeps up with the cylinder, and there is a lot less left over fuel vapor and particulates). Less BTU's going up the stack translates into the same fuel burn producing more power, or same power, less fuel. Hydrogen has the highest burn velocity known in the combustion arena (other than brisant explosives). Hydrogen from the new system does not contain sufficient oxygen to produce an explosion hazard. Injection takes place at the point of air induction.

__________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just build a better one.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: by the beach in Florida
Posts: 33392
Good Answers: 1817
#6

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/13/2016 5:19 PM

I think they should go nuclear.....

Here's a nice study that was done on different methods of propulsion and the results...

http://www.raeng.org.uk/publications/reports/future-ship-powering-options

__________________
All living things seek to control their own destiny....this is the purpose of life
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#11

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 4:05 PM

Electric Refrigerated Container Racks: Technical Analysis - Massport

According to the above, diesel reefers cost 4X as much to run as electric reefers do.

Register to Reply
Guru
Safety - Hazmat - New Member United States - US - Statue of Liberty - New Member Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - Old Hand

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lubbock, Texas
Posts: 14331
Good Answers: 162
#13
In reply to #11

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 4:42 PM

Aren't the refrigerated containers electric powered on the container ships? Or are some diesel, so the truck can provide diesel pup engine from its own tanks overland?

__________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just build a better one.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#14
In reply to #13

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 4:57 PM

Electric powered? Yes. But what generates the electric power?

Probably the 86 KHP diesel engines.

Register to Reply
Guru
Safety - Hazmat - New Member United States - US - Statue of Liberty - New Member Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - Old Hand

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lubbock, Texas
Posts: 14331
Good Answers: 162
#15
In reply to #14

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 5:02 PM

Thanks. Have a great weekend! I am off this weekend, and back on my project.

__________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just build a better one.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#16
In reply to #15

Re: LA to Clean Harbor Air

07/15/2016 5:55 PM

Thanks!

I've been in Hot Springs all week with the boys fishing and playing.

Back home last night.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 16 comments
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

70AARCuda (1); Fredski (1); James Stewart (4); lyn (4); SolarEagle (2); tcmtech (1); Tornado (2); Usbport (1)

Previous in Forum: Python Resources on the Internet   Next in Forum: Tesla Dropping Prices

Advertisement