-86 Freezer Gas Charging

Favor hablar inglés.

equipment supplier. Simple.

http://www.refrigerants.com/pdf/R404A_LINK.pdf

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/19752/Is-Ethane-Propane-necessary-with-R-508B-in-low-stage-of-refrigeration-system

http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?137732-R508B-and-oil-return

You putta de vacuum on both compressor? Did you pick up much lint?

404 a (a = atmospheres??) stage 1

290+ 508 b (b= barg??) stage 2

so you now have 798 barg output?? That is pretty high even for the meanest industrial compressor? Are you working in a liquid air plant?

Are you saying you have not studied the HX temperature, or are you trying to say the HX temperature is not steady?

Please go find an interpreter.

Hii

404a gas name also 290 and 508b gas.

1 stage using 404a gas

2nd stage using 290+508b gas

Under ASHRAE designations:

404a is R-125/143a/134a (44.0/52.0/4.0)

290 is propane

508b is R-23/116 (46.0/54.0)

Obviously, this is for a very cold operating system, and I suspect this probably a cold storage facility, right?

You indicated -89 freezer in the title line, so this must be:

Are you referring to -85 C ultra cold lab and pharmaceutical storage?

Somehow that is less re-assuring than becoming "vacuum", the sucker of worlds.

Never meet Vishnu in a dark alley - I hear he/she works for the Defense Department of the USA these days.

Oh look! I got an OT! My work here is done.

ahhh, come on Death, don't go, we all know its best out of 3

I gave you one also, so you don't feel neglected.

There, there. Only two more days til the weekend. Here, have a donut.

Gee thanks for the poison tipped poison. I love donuts, but the feeling is not mutual.

I just did also,... but I only did it because I enjoy being a bastard today.

I know the feeling. Too bad you can only give me one, because I gave James your donut.

...and so the infighting begins. Don't worry, phoenix, ol' buddy, I have saved it in a wrapper (left over paper towel from break room), and put it in the refrigerator with my lab standards. It should be freeze dried in a few weeks.

ahhhh,... I think I threw that donut out last week.... I recognized the sprinkle dispersion pattern... ok, ok,... they're not called sprinkles they're called jimmy's.

but I'm calling them sprinkles as to not to confuse you...

Bird sing only for Jane....Oh Tarzan you know that's only the Kookyberra laughing at your attempt at speaking English....We have Kookyberra dinner tonight....Tarzan laugh last...

Speaking of the DoD, J. Robert Oppenheimer uttered those words after they lit off the first nuke at Trinity. Also interesting is that the Trinity site itself is located in a valley called the Jornada del Muerto - Dead Man's Route.

True, very true indeed, also the subject of one of Larry McMurtry's books: "Dead Man's Walk"

Journey of the Dead Man

The Jornada del Muerto (as Larry McMurtry translates it, Dead Man's Walk) gets its name from the fate of one Bernardo Gruber, a trader at Quarai Pueblo in New Mexico, who was called El Aleman (the German) by his friends. El Aleman was not the first to die in this terrible desert crossing, and he would certainly not be the last. But it was his death that would give this trail (and the desert it crossed) its grim name. Nobody knows how many people died along the Jornada del Muerto, although it probably numbered into the dozens, if not hundreds.
Gruber became drunk on Christmas Eve in 1666 and during midnight mass bragged to some friends about a spell he had learned. Word got back to the Inquisition's agent at Santa Fe, and Gruber was arrested for witchcraft. After several years imprisoned in a makeshift cell at an estancia near present-day Albuquerque, Gruber made a daring escape and fled southward on the Camino Real with his Apache servant, Atanasio. They headed through Lava Gate and across the desert. After a harrowing ride, Gruber, parched and exhausted, halted at a place called Las Penuelas and sent Atanasio ahead for water. The servant rode like the wind, filled up a gourd, and flew back -- only to break the gourd in his haste. He returned to the water and, with nothing else to carry it with, soaked a saddle blanket. When he got back to where he had left El Aleman, the man had taken a horse and disappeared.
A month later, travelers across the desert found Gruber's horse tied to a bush, dead. Nearby was a mass of human hair, a skull, and a few gnawed bones. They gathered the pathetic remains for burial and erected a cross, which stood for many years, becoming a well-known landmark known as La Cruz del Aleman, the Cross of the German.

I thought that make a fitting end to this dead thread, since nothing can be worse than dying in a cold, waterless place, unless it might be a hot one.

Ooooh the Bhagavad-Gita! That's a great song.

.

"I'm the Bhagavad-Gita baby...."

your English is difficult... so I'm going to try to dissect ^{(but I'm the best one to try this)}

I am vaccume both compressor. ==> you have vacuum on two compressures

and your asking how much pressure can be applied?

you state that

1st stage is 404a and 2nd stage 290 +508b. ==> what are these numbers?

Because we put the pressure in system but hx temp not study.

I tried, but it is very difficult to put together your post in English that is understandable.

I think the problem here is that he is recharging a 2-stage system after some work has been done...He has evacuated the system but is not getting the temperature drop required, and is unsure of the pressure readings he's getting....on something like this a dial-a-charge or some other metered charging method would be the way to go....then monitor condenser temperature rise and sight glass...

http://inspectapedia.com/aircond/Refrigerant_Charging_Procedure.php

2 stage or cascade? - Auto-cascade?. I do so little of this extra low stuff, we always call the mfg to get their particular charging procedure. This ain't a residential split system you can wing it on. - JHF

I suspect this is an auto-cascading reefer designed to store ice cream in the middle of the Sa-hell.

equipment manufacturer. Get help there.

"I am vaccume"

Whatever you do, don't go for a walk in the woods tonight because we all know that: "nature abhors a vacuum".

I hope she abhors a "vaccume" even more.

Especially at night, when the spelling changes.

Hello!

Make sure the freezer is on and running. Check your Freezer Amperes located on the machine or manual. Place an Ampmeter on the power wire from the board (not the main wire) Note and watch this as you add.... (without freon, the Amps will read very low) and start by charging the high stage (H) #1 with the 404a. Your manual should state how many grams of freon to add. Normally more on the 1st stage than 2nd, so in my case I need to add 600g 404a. I have my 404a in a 1kg container and I begin adding (either by feel or by using a scale) and calculating the amount added. You can also use a best guess method based on the amount left in the tank. The amps should go up but not all the way to the machine's requirements at this point. Your meter should read that the pressure inside is still negative (positive pressure with the machine running will raise the temperature of the freon, making it ineffective for cascade).

Next, move on to adding R23 or R508B to the LOW stage (#2): Slowly start adding, but make sure you do not overcharge the freon and add to much pressure, or the Low stage compressor will shut down. Watch the amps and try to adjust the amps of the machine (via the same ampmeter) to its requirements. When the amps are the same as stated on the machine, it should be fully charged and ready to go.

The hardest thing I've found is determining the amount of R23 or 508B as I charge using a 9kg tank with a lot of pressure, so it easily adds too much and shuts down the compressor if not done slowly and correctly.

If you don't have an ampmeter, it will be very tough to get it right... so borrow or buy one.

Good luck!

Anyone else have a constructive suggestion? Thank you

Please note: on a Sanyo VIP Series, the power wire to place the Clamp Ampere Meter around is the (black) power wire from the socket, right before it enters the noise suppressor...

Add slowly to the Low Stage so the Amps are relatively near the machine's specs. After getting the machine to -55C and the temp goes no lower; Slowly add the R508B or R23 in a manner of 1 full air-hose worth (about 1 meter), and then let the machine run with that for a couple hrs before adding more.