Junk Yard Battery Contest

Whoops..rule 1 should read...

1. One cell.

Damn, I've lost precious time, back to the Cat Lab...

<I'm going to splash out on something!>

The splash needs to be on two dissimilar metals in order to make a cell......

So a big fat tank in the loft and a micro pump-turbine would be disqualified?

Why would you have a tank of fat up there? To cook the old chish n fips?

Errr Dunno, on second thuoghts it needs to be something with higher specific gravity and less viscosity. oh and low cost and environmentally friendly.

just can't think.........

Does this help ? I think some kind of carbon offset should be allowed here. It's not fair to folk in damp climates who want to go Green.

Kris.. don't be a lemon...although on second thoughts....

I'm stuck at work...I wanna go home and try by bleach/cat piss electrolyte..or maybe lemonade? This is going to be fun.

But how to I connect a wire to an alluminium beer can?

Who will be the first to produce a voltage of some sort?

Del

Or put a terminal on the wire and pop-rivit it to the can???

Either way yo've probably created yet another battery - they might now be in opposition.

Brings a thought to mind, what is the difference between a battery and a thermocouple?

Good idea for "the professor" on Gilligan's Island, who just needs the battery to work for a few minutes so he can transmit to that plane approaching the isle.

If the can/connection gets immersed in the electrolyte (typical), then corrosion between the connection itself will become a high-resistance connection in short order.

Nonetheless ~ it's an option ! (just keep the top/connection in-the-dry)

Results....I'm putting down a marker here!

Beer can, copper pipe, domestic bleach with a good bit of common salt.

About 500mv initially dropping to about 280mv.

I happened to have a battery charger to hand so I stuck some juice into it for a few seconds... mmm nice fizzing, removed charger. 600mv ! rapidly dropped back to 280mv.

I realise that some of you may find the precision of this experiment a bit daunting to live up to, but come on who can beat my 280mv... I've still got the cat pee in reserve!

As a consolation prize, Al Gore says he'll do a lap dance for anyone over your 280mv.

There is a young boy walking with his grandfather. Both are chewing gum. If the boy gives his gum to his grandfather and he chews it, does the grandfather win?

See http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/3572/Of-Gum-and-Wrappers-Newsletter-Challenge-10-16-07

If I feed them amphetamines daily I can get 4 to 5.2 megawatts a year.

While doing some research on Batteries, I came across this web site! Please take a wander through this wonderful array of inventions, I'm sure you'll understand where I'm coming from on this one! Wonders never cease!

And let me guess.....you bought the complete package and are now running your car/home/everything else on water alone (Hydrogen), right? and all for the small price of 300$!!!

The funny (very sad, really) thing about this is that although the "secrets" won't work, the scam surely does and I am sure they are making lots of money from this.

At the moment Rick, I am one step ahead! Due to my flamboient lifestyle, I now find it necessary to run my car/home/everything else on thin air! Maybe this would sell! Give me all your cash and you too could run on thin air!

You seem to be doing quite well, despite the paucity of hair !

It's a solar panel for a sex machine!

SHHHHHH! _{just tell me where to send the money}

Is that air or hair?

OK. I'll bite. What's the difference between "air" and "thin air"? Does this mean that you have to do the experiment in the high mountains? More ions per sq m? Less back pressure? (Just pulling yer chain).

Just checked my 'battery' it's 400mv tonight!!! I havn't done anything to it!

According to the Persian dictionary, I can gooz by eating beans

Are the cards scratch n sniff? oh well, back to the beer cans and brazing

OK, I haven't read all other posts, so I will assume that this is the first challenge question to your rules: Does this HAVE to be a rechargeable battery or can it be a disposable battery?

I don't think you're clear on this point.

Rechargeable....

but anything will be of interest, especially if it is made of junk.

Marks awarded for action, entusiasm,originality,creativity....I'm just hoping maybe we find something new.

I know this is highly unlikely as it's doubtless how the pioneers started...but we won't find 'owt if we don't try.

It's fun with a serious twist....look upon it as a Gin and Toinc!

UNFAIR!!! FOUL!!! DISCRIMINATION!!!!

OK OK ...

whatever... just make something for pity's sake and you can have a GOOZ card.. and a smiley face.

But seriously..how the heck do you know if it's rechrgeable to you build the darned thing?

Well if stuff gets eaten up while discharging, I'd say that would be a strong indication that it was disposable.

By the way, have I got one planned for you!!!

OK somebody tell me what a GOOZ card is

Shhhh don't tell but_...

_{A GOOZ card is a running joke started by HENDRIK it's a 'Get Out Of Zimbabwe' card..}

Shhhhhhh.

Ahhh, Thanks I'm no longer confused -- I gotta get some, maybe I'll need 'em some day. I kinda doubt it, but I'm one of those folks who save things just in case I might need them.

OK. Del, help me out with this one. I went to Wikipedia, to find out more about the basics of batteries. It shows a nice diagram of a zinc/coper cell made of two half cells separated by a "porous disk." However, no matter how hard I dig, I can't find any information on that damn porous disk and what it's made out of!!!

Any knowledge or place you can point me to?! ^"HELP!!!"

Verm, I would point you to the rubbish bin...

won't cardboard be suitably porous? Blotting paper (do they still make that stuff)?

Coffee filter paper. Piece of old knickers. carpet underlay. packing foam...?

This is a 'junk yard' battery the clue is in the name!

Well may your emoticon blush...shame on him...send him out scavenging immediately until he returns smiling!

No, not the knickers, they're absolutely essential for filling the holes in the garage/loft/under-eaves cupboard and other places of draught entry too numerous to mention. Sox too (not the cat).

search for pellon paper (used in many dry cells)

My beer can in the shed is still giving ~ 400mv I tried short circuit current ...

1.7mA not quite enough to start your car...!

Is this beer can full or empty? It would be a shame to waste a can of beer --- if it's full there is a violation of the rules, 'cause beer isn't JUNK.

I haven't been following this very closely. How's it going? Anyone up for a summation of projects underway?

That would tip off the competition!

Summation today 11/24/07: I put a commercial 9 volt battery in my Sperry Multimeter and poured vinegar, or ascedic acid, stop bath dilutions, or salt water, on strips of copper in glass or plastic jars or bottles this afternoon.

At first pours I got .431 as highest read on the hand held test to the meter on the copper ascetic acid bowl, which was the third construction.

Made variations using aluminum and copper. Using same for anode and cathode in every solution. Let all sit for a few hours after initial meter tests and at last test got nearly 2 volts from 5 cells.

I am turning towards more and more common wires and connectors. My next set of experiments will use zip cord, or lamp cords and beercans and copper.

I truly am interested in wiring up toilets to see what we can get out of them.

The Potato set of stab wires I left at my brothers house where they were drinking beer and watching the fire had only got to .016 by the time I got it there.

Some of the great devices around really do run off of really low power as far as I know and having electrode and cathode stab sticks to stick into the walls around to run what ever you have to, might be fun and possible.

That Electrochem Company and Exide and Ray O Vac, are far beyond my re-inventions. But I hope to catch up and surpass them at least as far as low tech and systems go.

2. must be made of household / easily available materials.

Dig through that pile of old computers and find the biggest capacitor you can. Put it on the window sill in the sun for a while (chase Del off the window sill if you have to, he'll understand). Caution: DO NOT TOUCH (OR LICK) THE TERMINALS

My bit of copper pipe in the beercan full of bleach/salt has some nice pretty greeny/blue stuff around the end of it now! But is still sitting at ~400mv. Once someone raises the bar I shall try some other stuff and see if I can compete... (my jar of cat pee is filling up nicely now )

It took me some time to twig what you were on about! So another thread branches off at high speed.......Go mango!

Stoooooooop, We seem to be heading in a downward direction very quickly! Only one thing can save us!.....A sensible question! Any takers on 'The electrolyte best suited for a battery and why!' or 'The best metals suited for the anode and cathode!'

Dels piss is getting ready to show us all up and we haven't got a contender so I will take it upon myself to go to the kitchen and make a battery now!

As promised, 510mv at the moment!

electrolite-vinigar

electrodes- copper and steel

All in less then a minuit! Come on guys and gals! Rememeber the 'Piss'

Hey, brilliant!

I shall go and tinker tonight see if I wind up the power Igor!

To the cat shed!

Wait, I have an update! I played with the electrolite, put washing up liquid and water aswell, spaced the thing out abit and now have 0.92V! Going to experiment with more things now, so good hunting young man!

Blimey you are raising the bar and pushing the envelope here!

If I'm to compete I may have to secure funding for another can of beer! I must draw up an action plan and timescale...better do the risk analysis first too!

Nah... I'll go in the shed an pee in the beer can!

Ha, Pee in a beer can eh! Well I have salted my solution and changed the steel to zinc! The steel nut has lost it's zinc coating, so I've gone for a zinc pencil sharpener! (Not zinc, but magnesium I think!)

Washing-up liquid?????? No! Must've at least been Palmolive!

Seriously. what benefit I wonder hase the Pal... I mean washing-up liquid brought? Better wetting of the electrodes?

You never know until you try! What is your battery up to?

I've gone on to bleach, and the numbers are climbing! 0.6v after 20secs, 0.72v after 20 more secs.....looking gooood

Still at work .(but no working too hard )

A quick 7 holes of golf after work before it gets too dark. Home to cook the dinner (strir fry). Then out to the Cat shed !....

The washing up liquid will increase the conductivity of the electrolyte....

(At work we measure detergent concentration in comercial dishwashers using conductivity probes. )

You only do 3 days a week! Lots of time to experiment!

By the way, 0.84v after 3mins

Dratt & damn your hide you seem to be winning the race! But you havn't seen the last of me! I shall try a squeeze of Lemming !

Del

Update.

My beer can is steel.

I tried an Ali' can and it does seem to be insulated, as suggested by Wrenched.

I tried some lemon juice...but it got diluted with unmentionable fluids before I realised the Ali can was insulated.

I reverted to the steel can and found the Zinc plated screw gave a better result as per Mr Truman B.

Still couldn't get upto his high voltage....grrrr...I got about 0.5v

My original battery was pretty flat but had made some nice copper salts!

More play another day.

Del

It's settled at 0.66v now for the last few hours! The pencil sharpener is really black! I may try to catch the gas that comes off! This could be used for something!

That's it, It's dropped down to 0.12v! Bring out the next idea! Looking at lead tubing and copper tubing at the moment, all inside plastic tubing! Any suggestions on an electrolite?

That is the kind of input we need here! Lets cut down on the banter and try to do something positive! Cheers ndt-tom, nice bit of info!

Hey , you been a dooin' that thar new fangled reeedin' an' lookin' at that intynet...

We call that cheatin' in these 'ere parts.

But seriously... actually thinking is the next step...I was initally just trying to drum up some interest.

Mind it's still a 'junk yard' battery we are after not a copy of mr Duracell's best.

PS.

[[ Not to burst anyone's bubble in-any-way-to-any-degree ... but please do realize that most ANYTHING that any of us was to attempt has already been tried by those who are either in-the-business ... or college chemistry class "wanna-beez".]]

We know this but ..if enough people play we may find something new...on the Monkey and Typewriter principal. (Now where did I put that monkey? ...maybe Monkey pee is better?)

I've been hunting all day for stuff and all I have found is a bit of copper tube and a bit of steel tube! Time to experiment again! The monkey piss will be a bit difficult to come by here so I've been feeding my dog bananas! Hope to get the same result though!

"Guilty", insofar as seeking a (good) link to battery construction... but, having already known all this since my corrosion training began (at an extension of Amarillo College ten years ago), my posts have simply divulged material that I have taken for granted for many years ... thinking it to be, perhaps "phorgotten phenomena" to all of our esteemed gradumatates herein.

The "10,000 monkeys at 10,000 typewriters" principle is what encouraged me to insert the disclaimer as I did... most certainly someone could arrive at a "Eureka!" moment. {I truly hope that someone does!}

Meanwhile, I would hope to see more real ..."let's not all rotate turns reinventing-the-wheel"... INPUT. Personally, I'd like nothing more than to see something GOOD come of all this. IF NOTHING ELSE ~ as one of my previous posts hinted at ~ the U.S. uses a sinful amount of electricity to turn bauxite into (pure) aluminum. And in all-too-many locales (including Lousyanna) people are encouraged to NOT recycle, even though it would save us TONS of cash every day! "Lez jist berry all dat crud... ain't no poynt whazzoever in tryin to sort it out!"

If a truly useful "BackYard-Battery" were invented that actually made USE of all that free energy locked-up in the aluminum, gazillions of beer cans would be heading to the backyard, instead of the highway medians!!!!!