science fair question?

How do you know you can?

Did you try this?

What are your data?

In the assumption that he is right(we do not know if it is so or not) and there is a difference can you find an explanation or can you show that it is not the case?

That's not my problem. I'm only an engineer, Captain; I canna work without data.

Can you not put yourself a question? How do engineers develop new products which are not yet available?

If not let me put the question:

Could it be possible to throw in the air a golf ball higher than a baseball one?

It is in fact a very interesting question since it is related to shock energy transmission and free dynamics in air. It is also related to the impact direction and I have the feeling that this could be the main factor.

Hello Guest,
Please reply, with

Kind Regards....

I have a golf ball ... I do not have a baseball therefore your assertion is false.

Even if I did have, I would argue that it's a matter of power matching the projectile to the individual...I don't have a fast arm, but I have a reasonable amount of power so I find it easier to throw a relatively heavy projectile....
If I try and throw something too light I'm likely to strain my triceps
This could of course be complete hogwash
Del

Hello again, Guest.

I apologise for not correctly reading your Question, as you wrote it, before my earlier reply.

Quote:

<"why can you throw a golfball higher in the air then a baseball?">

1. Please advise why the golfball must be thrown first, to achieve the superior elevation?
2. There is another problem, as I possess neither golfball nor baseball, thus I can throw neither, and as pointed out by Del the cat in his perspicacious Post above, your assumption is null and void.

Looking forward to your reply, with

Kind Regards....

why can you throw a golfball higher in the air then a baseball?

Baseball weight 142g
Golfball weight 45.9g

If it is true then maybe it's just 'cos it weight less and has less wind resistance (smaller cross sectional area)

Del

If both balls are thrown at the same initial speed the baseball will slow down faster because of the drag introduced by the stitches and softer skin.

I don't know much about baseball but in cricket the one side of the ball is polished while the other is rouged to introduce uneven drag.

Whoa! In American baseball, we spit on the ball to get that effect and it's considered illegal.

In cricket you also cannot spit on it (I think) but there is noting against a quick wipe against your hair or arm pits.

In cricket you are bowling with a straight elbow and can therefore not get that fast elbow whip throw effect.

What is the fastest pitching speed?

This is easy to answer and it bothers me that experienced engineers can't answer it. With a throw you can give both balls the same amount of energy(kinetic that is).

The mechanic energy is concerved so in the highest point when the kinetic energy is 0 and the potential energy is at its most all of the kinetic energi has gone over to potential.

kinetic energy= 0,5 * mass * velocity *velocity

potential energy=mass * 9,81 m/s^2 * hight

As you can see out of the equations hight=velocity*velocity/(2*9,81)

Here velocity is that velocity you give it at the start.

Lets looks at the first equation again: kinetic energy= 0,5 * mass * velocity *velocity

Since the kinetic energy is the same for the golfball and the baseball, the golfball get a bigger velocity and can go higher up.

This is easy to answer and it bothers me that experienced engineers can't answer it.

Oooooh, But your second statement isn't necessarilly true. (Read #3.)

With a throw you can give both balls the same amount of energy(kinetic that is).

If you insist on being simplistic the simple answer would be, 'because the golf ball is lighter'

But have you ever tried throwing a shuttlecock?
It strikes me you have the cockiness of maybe an accountant? or Lawyer?

Del

Ooops, didn't see your comment. You beat me to it.

The weight difference is minimal and the velocity of both balls will be the same because it will be determined by the speed of the thrower.

From school athletics when was 16 I did a better distance with the under 19 shot put than with the under 17 one. I had the angles wrong with the lighter weight.

it bothers me that experienced engineers can't answer it.
???
Experienced Engineers know better than to 'explain things' which they have no actual evidence of!

We don't know that one can throw a golf ball higher than a baseball...that's why we won't 'explain' it.

Any fool can go around 'believing' stuff, science and engineering require a little more rigour!

"This is easy to answer and it bothers me that experienced engineers can't answer it. With a throw you can give both balls the same amount of energy(kinetic that is)."

Wal, I'm a fairly experienced engineer and I can't answer it 'cause I don't know yet if it's true or not. If I were to follow your reasoning, then I could throw a ping-pong ball much farther than I can throw a football (that's American football - we're allowed to touch it), yet I know that is not true.

I suspect there is a strong component of what would be called impedance mismatch if we were talking electrical rather than mechanical. Try throwing an imaginary baseball really, really hard and see what the "reflected wave" does to your muscles or indeed to your arm bone. But, again, it is foolish to speculate until we actually see some data that a person can throw a golfball higher than he can throw a baseball.

You are right but only in vacuum the question considered movement in air

In air the ball will encounter a second resistance which roughly proportional to the square of the velocity and a drag coefficient depending on their speed and surface structure.

Let us assume that we have only a vertical ascending motion with same initial velocity, the difference will be given by a factor = M/(A*ξ) where M is the ball mass i.e. its capacity to accumulate energy, A the area = π*d^2/4 and ξ the drag coefficient. A golf ball has a mass of 45.9 g and a diameter of 1.68"(in the US) or 1.62" (UK), the other has M=142g and diameters between 2 7/8" and 3". If we assume same ξ then the ratio M/d^2 will indicate which one goes higher: the higher the ratio the higher it can go.

Golf 1.68" ratio = 0.0252 g/mm^2

Golf 1.62" ratio = 0.0271 g/mm^2

Baseball 2 7/8" ratio = 0.02665 g/mm^2

Baseball 3" ratio = 0.02446 g/mm^2

If what was mentioned some time ago that the golf ball surface structure leads to a lower drag then the golf ball can go higher and the UK type will go the highest.

It is of course only an approximation since the differential equation is a non linear one and I did not bother with the exact solution.

The question is about the difference when throwing the balls and not spring loaded shooting,

Therefore the weight of the arm (or inertia) and the power and flexibility of the muscle should be brought in contention as well.

The difference is then minimal. The limiting factor is actually the speed of the arm. (more or less constant)

I actually went outside and tried it, A reached the highest height

with a cricket ball because:

I could use at least 2 fingers to give it a final flip.

The golf ball slipped out of my hand (I have a broken window to prove it)

I was going to try it with a marble but decided against that.

CONCLUSION - I (the you in your question) can throw a bigger ball higher.

Now there's a real engineer. He actually tries stuff rather than theorizing.

Congratulations ! as for the comment coming next to your experiment I dare say that theory is condensed practice so there is no contradiction and engineers at least to day do not rely only upon practice.

With resoect to your experiment are youu sure to have same speed for the ball when it leaves your hand?

Any way I am very glad that throwing the question such an interest appeared. In fact I did not expect it.

Aha, you readers, you misread the question as I did on my first reply.

If you go to the question and read correctly, instead of assuming what you see, you should notice that our Guest question poser did not say than, but then.

I realised that, and responded correctly to the question, in my second Post here: http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/204422/Re-science-fair-question

We are of the Engineers Fraternity, are we not, and surely we do not add misread assumptions into the Specifications.

Kind Regards....

Sparky,

Ya gotta get out of New Zealand - all the blood is rushing to your head being upside down like that.

Jesusmotherfu*****christ Sparkstation! What is it with the spellingshit? Go do english grammar if you can't do engineering!

Hello Guest,

By your vituperative remarks about me, perhaps you are the same person who typed out the original Topic Question.

We should not assume the question asker has made a spelling mistake.

I don't remember either of my grammars, except as very frail old ladies, and they both died when I was rather small.

Kind Regards, from far away....

All you do is bash others spelling! I mean what the fu** makes you do that shit all the time??

Spellin? We dont need no stinking spellin..We got more emportant stuff than spellin. I don't like people that point out my bad spelling. Reminds me of an X-wife or tew.

Guest can you extend the question to include a Beach ball, soccer ball, bowls ball, marble and a ball bearing?

By the way, where did the OP go? That's the trouble with a Guest asking a question - they go away and nobody knows who the heck we were talking to. But, Guest, if you're out there somewhere, did you get your answer?