Running a 380V 50Hz Machine on 380V 60Hz

What type of machine?

1. Electrically: The V/f is supposed to be maintained constant for the proper magnetic field - for you it will go down from 7.6 to 6.33.

That means no problem with saturation, but power transfer efficiency will go down.

2. More Hz means more RPM (if any motors are there) - that is likely to create a problem.

In case it is a complicated machine, the problems will be much more (eg if it has a hydraulic pump- the Q will change, the increased flow will create all sort of problems in orifices and clearances

The best is to contact the manufacturer and ask for his advice.

The frequency converters are available, but that is depending on the KVA ratings.

Why do you want another extra component and hence reliability problem? check whether the manufacturer is ready to do some modifications, change the motors etc and bring the machine to 60Hz configuration.

Some of the selections available on the topic by typing 50/60 Hz into

Re: 50 Hz & 60 Hz from THREAD 50 Hz & 60 Hz posted in Electrical Engineering Pathfinder Tags: 50 Hz 60 Hz motors	03/01/2007 10:52 PM by Guest	517
		50 Hz & 60 Hz posted in Electrical Engineering Pathfinder Tags: 50 Hz 60 Hz motors	02/14/2007 10:33 PM by Guest	408
		Re: machine to drive 50hz to 60 hz from THREAD machine to drive 50hz to 60 hz posted in Electrical Engineering	09/27/2009 5:41 PM by lynlynch	378
		Re: POWER FACTOR. from THREAD POWER FACTOR. posted in Electrical Engineering	05/19/2008 5:53 AM by chhotu1990	371
		Re: transmission lines from THREAD transmission lines posted in Electrical Engineering	06/27/2007 3:52 PM by Haajee	256
		Re: Syn . machine running at 50hz to 60 hz from THREAD Synchronous Machine - 50Hz to 60Hz posted in Electrical Engineering	10/16/2009 2:04 AM by lynlynch	192
		Re: difference of 50 hz and 60 hz machines from THREAD difference of 50 hz and 60 hz machines Your machine will run at 6/5 speed and produce less power.

The unusual issue here, which unfortunately does not end up being discussed in the other threads, is that 380V 60Hz is so uncommon I was not aware any country used it. Where are you? (by the way, registering would have been nice.)

So for you, you will either need to increase your voltage (via a transformer) to 460V so the V/Hz ratio stays the same but live with the 20% increase in speed, or buy VFDs for the input to all of the AC motors and program them to put out 60Hz at 380V. You really do not have any other choices. If you go the VFD route, you must also check out the control voltages used. If the machine uses something like 24VDC that comes from a Power Supply, you are probably fine. But if it uses AC control voltages, i.e. 220V coils by tapping from phase to neutral (common on 380V 50Hz systems) then you must check each and every coil to make sure it can accept 60Hz. If not explicitly stated, they cannot and will suffer premature failure if you do not replace them.

Aha, are you in Brazil, Bahrain or Barbuda? Those are the only countries I could find that use 380 (400)V 60Hz power.

Interesting that those 3 countries all start with "B".

why did your factory order at 50Hz machine, when you have a 60Hz supply? what application are you using it?

My advise is order the right machine 380v 60hz, otherwise it will cost you alot for modification or repair if you use 380v 60hz on that machine

you need not to worry about , converters are available in market which can help in this regard.

But for this you need to findout how much kva is required for running and for starting ,since converter has to be designed considering total kva out and max kva out .

also please elobarate on application this will help in findingout if it will create any problem for converter or not.

Regards

In Saudi Arabia also Voltage system is 3 phase 380V, 60Hz. And since the Country is importing machines from all over the world, there are always many motors comes in 50Hz (and running on 60Hz without much problems!) The motors for Gear drives etc which not normally run on full load capacity, they can absorb or have allowance for the increased ampere due to 20% high speed. Problems are only noticed with Pumps, Blowers, Fans etc which mostly runs to their full load and increased speed cause higher ampere up to 18 -22% (without having any VFD's). So, many manufacturer's support running 50Hz on 60 Hz. But again, the load which is coupled to the motor really decides the actual result. If it is a gear drive or something which has an allowance, no need to worry. Otherwise as advised by the experts, indicated above Change the motor to 60Hz Add a VFD or if is also not possible, try to reduce the load (if possible ; mechanically controlling the valves, fan shutters….many options). The motor bearings may be needed to replace before 2 years earlier than its standard life time, but still you can easily go for 5 – 6 years. No Problem. There is no problem to try. Install the motor, connect and run, observe the ampere and temperature rise; If everything is at allowable range and ensure the load out put side has no bad effects, then leave it to face the challenge..it will not let you down) Good Luck! Hari

speak with your vendor. admit your mistake, and ask them to help you. there could be a differential cost for getting a replacement, but it will cost lesser, and be safer than getting some extra equipment or fixtures to allow the machine to run at a different frequency.

Not to worry, most of the manufactures are making the machines / Alternators, which is compatible for 50Hz and aswell as 60Hz. Some manufactures are mentioning the same in Name plate itself.

So, Please recheck the name plate details and technical manual of your machine.

You can use the machine with 60Hz power supply. Just you need to set 60Hz in the control unit for protection device

You can run the 380v/50Hz machine on 380v/60Hz,but the inductive reactance of your motor will increase and this will also increase your motor current than normal.So to keep the motor current at normal,voltage must be increased correspondingly.

However,your motor is not rated for higher voltages,but if the current can be kept at some reasonable acceptable value by raising the voltage from 380v to 415v,then u could run the machine on yr system.

But above all,it is much more better to use the right voltage and frequency as rated.U may also get a frequency converter if u can afford it for now.Can those u bought it from replace it with yr source supply(ie 380v/50Hz),that would be the best option.

Patrick Whowha

I am not an electrical engineer, am chemical engineer, but as I have been using such things in the past, I think there would be possibility of using frequency converters like Telemecanique and set the high speed frequency on 50 as I have used it for running 380 50 HZ rated motors on a lower spped as 45 HZ. I think the output voltage will be lower than 380 at this point, but I think there is possibility to adjust it. you need to consult the manufacturer.

if you use 60 HZ power supply, I think electrical motors will turn much faster and it may cause some mechanical problems as the internal parts have been designed for lower speeds and other possible problems, so I don't suggest to do so.

anyhow, the price depends on the rating, for a 110 KW FC you may need to spend about 10K $.

I hope these information may help you.

I am not an electrical engineer, am chemical engineer, but as I have been using such things in the past, I think there would be possibility of using frequency converters like Telemecanique and set the high speed frequency on 50 as I have used it for running 380 50 HZ rated motors on a lower spped as 45 HZ. I think the output voltage will be lower than 380 at this point, but I think there is possibility to adjust it. you need to consult the manufacturer.

if you use 60 HZ power supply, I think electrical motors will turn much faster and it may cause some mechanical problems as the internal parts have been designed for lower speeds and other possible problems, so I don't suggest to do so.

anyhow, the price depends on the rating, for a 110 KW FC you may need to spend about 10K $.

I hope these information may help you.