MP3 Players in the Industrial Work Place

Ageed.
Audio jamming as I call it should be discouraged.
On the factory floor they have a radio on, drives me nuts, can't hear myself think.
Del

OSH, should write a standard for this application, but those guys cant see the wood for the trees, can they.

They would perfer you to spend thousands of your dollars, to modify a machine to circumvent this problem, and then their solution wont work in any or all applications.

Cheers

Joe.

It's equivalent to employing a deaf person in the workplace. Carry out a formal risk assessment of the concept as is required by currently-applicable local Health & Safety legislation. If the risk is unacceptably high, take steps to reduce it.

Sparky you may have answered your own question. If you feel they may cause a hazard then under OSHA you need to address it. If in your work environment there is a need for hearing protection PPE. These do not replace that. In fact they increase the dangers of hearing damage to those that would use them in a noisy environment. The cost of the hearing loss could be on the company. They could argue that it's work related. You allowed the use of the MP3 in the work environment. Even if it's not a noisy environment there is no way to establish what damage one could be doing to their hearing on company time. You could be held accountable for that.

We need all our senses to warn us of pending accidents. If one is curtailed it may mean life or death.

GA I feel the same way. It should be up to the employer not the federal government. If it is a boring tidiest job, having some music to listen to helps the time go quicker.

Hey!.....Your hand is in...."Whaaat?".....Clang!

This is a great idea! I hope it will work out and people in the community
will not get frustrated if their question isn't answered right away. I am sure it is going to take time to get used to. I guess this is why it is an experiment.

regards

BTW 'electrician Houston' - welcome to CR4 - enjoy!

When I'm on the workshop bench building or repairing something, there is nothing better to have some background 'muzak' or 'talk radio forums' in the background. It helps my mind concentrate, not on the what is being played, but on keeping on being involved on the task at hand. (instead of the constant white noise of pumps and fans cycling on and off).

Mind you, when we have our coffee breaks, the radio goes off, so we can have rational or otherwise socially interactional discussions about this or that (about discussing the jobs to be progress reported upon, new jobs coming up, or otherwise [rumours, news, weather, sports, jokes, family, life experience etc.]).

GA's to kramarat and mrclean - it totally depends on the worksite environment, and should be observed and reviewed and mandated by the HS&E rep. - Loupy.

Yes. Such low quality stuff should be banned from the workplace in favor of a full blown stereo system with high quality headphones.

Agreed!

Well, except for one minor quibble - "which we as a tax payer will eventually have to pay for."

I'm not sure why that would necessarily be the case. But even if it is, there are countless other recreational activities which are far more certain to be detrimental and at a far greater cost (both physically and financially).

Not disagreeing with your central point - wearing those things at work is plain stupid for a dozen solid reasons. Not sure raising the tax spectre is pertinent though.

"wearing those things at work is plain stupid "

How is it stupid to listen to Mp players at work? Not all jobs are on the floor with dangerous machines. Some people have easy desk jobs with no immediate danger to them or anyone around them. You can't generalize this as being stupid for all jobs, you have to look at each individual job environment to decide which ones it should be allowed and which ones it shouldn't be. Here again this is an area that should be left up to each individual employer, on whether or not to allow their employees to listen to Mp players on the job, not the government. Our government regulates enough in our lives and I for one don't want to give them a reason to add something else to their list to regulate. I don't want to slowly give up my freedoms to make decisions on my own without the government sticking their noses in it.

I thought the meaning here was clear, but apparently not. Let me expand:

The OP's statement was: "With these devices on, it is almost impossible to hear any other instruction from any party."

This is what I agreed with and still do. It doesn't matter if the situation has the potential for physical harm or not. It is also stupid to wear one if it interferes with hearing the boss tell you to do something, the phone ringing, etc.

You must be confused.

In the OP he mentioned "My Opinion is these things are a hazard, and should be banned."

So let me expand. This is what I don't agree with and why it is stupid to imply it should be banned from all jobs and that it interferes with work and hearing. This is what I agree with and stick to, employers should determine whether or not their employees wear these or not. It doesn't matter what you or I think and shouldn't matter what the government thinks either. This is a matter to be handled by the employer and their insurance company and that's the way it should stay.

Sorry, when i said "should be banned"

this was probably a bit harsh, but it is not just the harm that happen to the person using the MP3 player, it is the harm he could do to his fellow workers.

Govt legislation is not really the correct way to go, I would have to agree with that.

But some organisation should at least warn of the dangers of using these devices when in the workplace.

Saying that, the problem is not just confined to the work place, accidents can happen outside the workplace, for instance it would be possible that a pedestrian crossing the road at a controlled intersection may not hear the siren of and emergency vehicle rushing to an emergency response, and get run over.

I know that i am being a little over the top about this subject, but when you a listening to your favorite music at full tit, you loose more than just the senses of hearing, you seem to forget about using you other senses like looking to ensure things are safe before moving across the road, people using MP3's seem to be in their own little world.

This posting was only meant as a discussion document, but also to make people aware of the dangers, it is not intended to stop peoples enjoyment of using these devices, in the right place and time.

Cheers

Joe

There was that woman recently 'round Melbourne (OZ) raped in front of her home. She probably did not hear the guy coming while listening to her music from the MP3 player.

when you a listening to your favorite music at full tit

If this were possible, I would never stop using them.

That would be a great way to listen to music.

Saying that, the problem is not just confined to the work place, accidents can happen outside the workplace, for instance it would be possible that a pedestrian crossing the road at a controlled intersection may not hear the siren of and emergency vehicle rushing to an emergency response, and get run over.

Sadly this is happening more and more often. A number of deaths have been attributed to this. I have personally seen a few near misses locally.

Mind you I have also seen near misses by people not wearing headphones. What, you cannot bother to look when you cross the road!

Makes you think when you personally almost run someone over this way.

Additionally I read an article that showed a disturbing trend towards hearing damage of people using these things, manufacturers were even looking at limiting the volume below that which could cause hearing damage. I personally witnessed someone listening to an MP3 player so loud that I could hear the song lyrics from 1m away, so don't tell me people will use common sense and use the mp3 player volume control responsibly.

Semantics is an interesting thing.

We're not talking about MP3 players here, we're talking about employees consciously restricting their ability to hear external noises which may be hazardous to the user of the device, in an industrial setting. I can't think of a single instance where they would be allowed by an employer, or more importantly, an insurer.

The only exception to this is the use of active noise canceling headsets such as those used by pilots to allow them to hear ATC and other communications from fellow pilots. While music can be played through these, with enhanced clarity, it is not suitable for the workplace.

OSHA probably could make a case against them almost everywhere they have authority to do so.

There are exceptions to this, I'm sure.

That's my opinion.

At my previous place of employment the CAD (PCB, Mech, Optical) group used was located in a single large (acoustically HARD) room. These people would spend long hours in front of their huge displays. They were allowed to wear small headphones or earbuds to listen to music. The volume was always low (so others couldn't hear the music) and they could easily hear verbal queries and incoming phone calls. In no way did this hinder or impede work, safety, or communication.

The factory assemblers could also use them if they were not working near any moving machinery. For obvious safety reasons, music was not allowed for anyone working on or near the large pick & place machines. For non-hazardous work areas, this topic needs to be evaluated by the EMPLOYER and the EMPLOYEES.

The people who are going to BLAST the music loud enough to cause hearing damage will do the same outside of work.

Very well put. That's the same point I was trying to make, but you did it so much better. Thanks.

Company Policy, yes

Government regulation, no

Code of law, HELL NO.

Sorry did you guys say something? I was listening to my ........

Can you please repeat everything you all just said?

As others have said, it depends on the work being done. In NZ use of stereos and mp3 players (or any Walkman or ipod style apparatus) in the workplace may not be covered by OSH specifically (lets face it they cannot cover every specific hazard and eventuality) but they can be covered and justified by workplace policy backed up by a safety hazard review (if necessary).

My personal opinion is that although stereos are generally ok for factory workers, they are a lot different to mp3 players fitted with personal headphones in that an mp3 player can partially or completely mask external audible warnings (shouted warnings, fire alarm, sound of failing equipment, vehicle horn, lunch bell, etc).

I would personally say no to mp3 players in applications where reduced situational awareness could result in a hazard (and most manufacturing management would agree with me) due to safety concerns. This includes staff working on or near vehicles (eg- warehouse staff). I would also say no for electricians or other electrical workers working on live circuits.

Lets put it another way, if there were an accident and an mp3 player was involved (even in some small way), OSH would jump all over management for failing to assess and address this as a safety hazard.

_{Jack - Still in NZ this morning, but not for long.}

Here here I concur.

Unless you are working at a hazardous job or somewhere where allot of verbal messages are relayed all day long or working with the public I see no reason why an employee shouldn't be allowed to listen to a Mp3 player. If you have ever even listened to a Mp3 player, Walkman or anything you use ear-buds or earphones with you know that if you keep it at a reasonable volume you can still hear people talking to you along with other sounds around you. If you use them responsibly and your employer permits it I see no problem with it. There is the kicker. It should be left up to the employer to determine whether or not Mp3's are permitted in the work place. If the employer has a problem with it that's their rite to disallow their use.

It's a pretty simple answer. If the employer allows it ok, if not that's their choice and that's where the decision should remain not in the hands of the government.

As far as being banned, well that is just crazy. Yes there are certain instances where they can be a hazard, but there are also allot of instances where they are not. There are allot of hazardous things, too many to mention that could cause harm but we don't think about banning them. A few examples are automobiles, cell phones, microwave ovens and hair dryers, but we don't consider banning them. Let's keep some of our freedom to make decisions on our own and leave it up to individual employers do say yes or no on Mp3 usage in the work place.

I agree with the comments that say it should not be regulated by the government and depends on the job or workplace. You mentioned the "Industrial Work Place" where there could be dangerous machinery. In another setting it would be just fine, unless of course you are driving in your mobile office, then it is very dangerous.

The only problem I have with listening to music in a workplace is that sometimes the one listening has the music is too loud and the rest of us have to listen to a tinny noise coming out of the headphones. Very distracting and annoying. That's when I have to put my headphones on!

well,I think it depends.Sometimes we really need some music to refresh ourshelves,but in terms of its harm,the government should take some measures.

Anything

I feel it is the content that should be regulated, with everyone on the same program of audio input designed to allow the conformal conditioning of the individual into the pattern of increased output and acceptance of particular edicts issued by management, that would otherwise be rejected.

Just sayin...