Fission Waste Disposal

I have been on several SGRs and the SGs have all been hot. DC Cook had the least radiation but the plant had been off line for several years.

The Radiation is on the hot side of the generator, the inside of the tubes and the bottom head. Most of the radiation is in the corrosion and by certain chemical treatments this can be, for the most part, removed.

The radiation may not be real high but once you climb over the bio-wall you must have dosimetry. When the old generators are stored, they are put in a concrete vault, and stored forever - well for a long long time anyway.

Bowl jumpers - the poor guys that go into the bottom head to do tube inspection can reach a years maximum dose in moments.

After the new SGRs are in place the dose is almost nothing. As long as the fuel is either been removed or the pool has been flooded.

The last several years the plants have been much better about using chemical cleaning, but it does not remove it all.

...in a concrete vault, and stored forever...

Concrete is likely to fissure, or atleast crack, when unevenly heated (in and out are of different temps)

The oldest man made structures on earth are the pyramids at Giza. These were designed to last for eternity and be impenetrable and completely secure. They have been looted, completely cleaned out and have suffered serious damage.

An that's after less than 3% of the sort of time scales we are talking about here.

We need to be realistic here, we have about as much chance of ensuring the security and safety of nuclear waste, for the periods needed, as a politician or lawyer has, of telling the truth.

Realistically, sooner or later this stuff is going to escape and end up in the biosphere.

the damage was originally caused by the goddess isis,with energy weapons.. so the exterior of shining limestone was actively destroyed, in an attempt to kill Ra, who had killed her husband, and cut him into 14 pieces. She eventually found almost all his parts, except the penis, and put him back together, and breathed life into him.

I know that sounds wacky, but it is a story that comes from clay tablets found in the library of Ashurbanipal, so it is the historical record.

As to being looted, and cleaned out, yell, it was broken into in 800 ad, 10000 years after it was originally constructed, mostly because the gods had left 1000 years before... would we do that with nuclear piles?

And lastly, the things in the pyramid would not have been of any value to humans.. so they have on occasion been found. There were stacks of helmholtz resonators, and possibly large crystals placed in the grand gallery. The grand gallery was a large precisely tuned Laser chamber. Popular theory is that it was a hydrogen laser, where a moat surrouned the pyramid, and the electricity from the piezoelectric action of 2000000 tons of limestone produced a current large enough to electrolyze water into its components....etc. (sorry, a favourite subject of mine)

The idea of stroring nuclear fuel in water is excellent, and as suggested by gwen, the water would have to be ultrapurified. It would be impossible to have perfectly pure water, and so as with every strategy, it would require active defenses... in this case, purification systems... so that contaminants do not stay in the water, but are processed out, repackaged, and stored with the rest.

Chris

"As to being looted, and cleaned out, yell, it was broken into in 800 ad, 10000 years after it was originally constructed, mostly because the gods had left 1000 years before... would we do that with nuclear piles?"

I can absolutely, categorically, guarantee, if you bury something hyper dangerous, with signage in every possible language known, unknown, imagined or otherwise, indicating that digging it up will be fatal, some amoeba brained moron, will dig it up the instant you are out of sight.

The water in direct contact would need to be ultra pure.

You also need natural convection to keep the cooling optimal, as a pump would need maintenance, exactly what we don't want to have. It must work for the time that the energy can be used. (+1000 years)

After all: the system would never be made, it would be very expensive and the public would never understand the benefit of using the free energy for something useful.

Gwen

I think it likely that the pyramid complex at Teotihuacan are older than Giza. based on data from Zecharia Sitchin. The pyramid of the sun has an identical footprint to the great pyramid of giza.. interesting point. part of the evidential record showing that the intelligence that built these sites had a common knowledge base.

Chris

PS. sorry for deviating.

...PS. sorry for deviating...

Why should you be?

This is to widen the thread's factorial-base, and it's never a bad thing, always welcome, either to support or disapprove, this or that claim.

I'm not convinced about 'identical' Chris.

Giza was 231m before stripping and erosion , Teotichuan is 224 m after later development. I'll stand ready to be corrected , since I haven't cross checked my references . If an early civilization wants to build high , it seems to me they will end up with a Pyramid shape . Convergent evolution perhaps ? I'm not a myth/history de-bunker , but I notice in my own pursuits that if I look for a pattern coincidences can be easily mis-interpreted. I'm aware of world wide Pyramid building and similarities , but remain sceptical. Interesting subject though.

Kris

...If an early civilization wants to build high , it seems to me they will end up with a Pyramid shape...

This would make a lot of sense.

But, is a pyramid the only feasible way? Look at some early Babyl towers, although wider at the base, to approve of your claim, also with their spiralling catwalk on the rim. Ancients tried whichever worked for their given knowledge.

I think I understand the type of structure you mean - a frustrum type thing ? If so , well OK there are exceptions , but I think planer sides would evolve as the more practicable ( this may sound flippant , but astronomical alignment, rolling bodies down etc). I'll make a note to look the topic up , but defer to your knowledge for now given that you're a lot closer to pyramids than I am. An interesting point -you have made me think about is why NW Europe evolved standing stones with such importance , yet pyramids predominate in the rest of the world. An archaeologist would probably walk all over my ignorance , but the beauty of cr4 is that you can learn about areas outside your own field. I can never resist a laugh - the thread has achieved fission !

...planer sides would evolve as the more practicable...

The earliest Pyramids were found in the Nubian (south Egypt)desert, and looked a lot like the South American ones, with their stepped slopes.

Later, as Nubian early kingdoms moved north by conquest, and established the later known Egyptian Dynasties, they evolved this ancestral legacy into the marvels we know today.

The thought-to-be earliest of all, is actually a table-mountain, manually carved into a rough shaped pyramid, i.e, they used a given natural structure, as a base to their creation.

In essence, you seem to be right, but given examples are full of exceptions.

Hi Yuval,

You might be interested in a discussion we had shortly you joined CR4, titled "Concrete Blocks used in Great Pyramids Construction". It appears that there is a reasonable chance that the Egyptians were a little bit more advanced that previously thought and may have had concrete technology.

If they did have concrete or something similar, it would certainly make the pyramids considerably easier to construct.

...Egyptians were a little bit more advanced that previously thought...

I wouldn't be terribly surprised:

Ancient concrete, made of gypsum, lime, and pumice (volcanic porous soft-stone), was used to underwater cast the harbour of Cesaria (Israel's west coast) by Hordos (Herod),the Jew king appointed by the Romans. The Roman Colosseum, is a cast of concrete.

It is not unlikely however, given that romans are known for adopting their conquest's technologies, took it from the greatest builders of their time, the Egyptians.

The Egyptians used cast bricks of several compounds, possibly concrete being one.

...considerably easier to construct...

No one yet made known assumptions, of a binding agent (if any) applied between layers of giant stone bricks there.

Some massive earthquakes However, ruined massive monuments in the area documented during Roman rule, none effected even the lightest Egyptian structures, including the "tiny" Sphinx.

Egypt was way ahead of its time. For instance, the photo below was unearthed from the remains of the Great Library at Alexandria. The truck is clearly egyptian and predates Roman Ready-Mix trucks by about a thousand years. The rusted-out shell of a mixer was also found near Hadrian's Wall, suggesting that the Romans did indeed adopt this technology. However, unreliable sources of petrol in ancient times spelled doom for the nascent industry because then, as now, Egypt and other ancient Middle Eastern countries formed a precursor to what is known today as OPEC. That's why Rome invaded. You don't think they were simply bent on world conquest, do you?

I think you better stick to your normal day time work, ...

I'm trying, but I'm still trying to figure out what that is...

Welcome back you goblin. I thought they snatched you for participation in the fission crap, which evidently turned into what you witness now: half witted niceties about the mighty romans and their glorious legacies...

Just think how bad my niceties would be if they were full-witted. Consider yourself blessed.

I got nearly used to it by now. It's "they" who should dread: you may even make some sense talking shee... Now, that, would be too much, see?

As long as it's common agreement you may blabber all you want. Once it got into ridiculous truths, it's a nasty nono

That's a cracker ! A few years ago somebody took me to see the sight where Athelred unified the warring British tribes (somewhere in Cumbria) . A fantastic , little known , geographic location . Standing stones and all that . Guess what ? The silly buggers built it right next to a motorway !

...Guess what ? The silly buggers built it right next to a motorway !...

Visionaries they weren't, you say ...

You said it ! I may have spelt the kings name wrong , but it's a fact . This was the dude who truly united the people of Britain (forget the Normans and all that ) . No wonder we ended up with the 'Millennium Dome ' . GB's contribution for 2000 years AD - A big tent , over budget and over schedule. Tony , your memorial is there already.

I saw a film about this Bodika gal.

Hey, you have to do some planning.

We planned the battle of waterloo so that you just can see the lion from the motorway, but you have to leave it to have it in full glory.

That is what I call ancient history site planning.

ROFLMAO. Stop it! Stop it Stop it!

As I told you before, better stick to your day time job.

I work at night. What does that tell you?

-e

......

Don't cheat: This is wacko's makeup facility in the rockies

Admit it!

No. No. No! That's Jimmy Hoffa's makeup facility. Why do you think he always looks like Tammy Faye Bakker?

Before:

After:

-e

Concrete makeup?

Look closely: lime,Gypsum, & Pumice

Lime, Gypsum & Pumice were her backup singers from their rock phase.

Serves me right. "...Seek and you shall receive..."

Modding a geographical feature sounds familiar (I think I caught the end of a TV programme on Chinese structures that did so ) , but I wonder if that would be a first step . Part of a buildings meaning (like a hand-print) is saying I was here. We may never know the answer , but recent science proves the probability of convergent thinking (ie 2 people developing the same idea in tandem). Being a sceptic , I feel that people trying to make a historical time-line often have another agenda . Not always so , but it blurs the tracks if not published as fact . The Internet makes the prevalence of opinion a dangerous thing . Sifting for fact becomes harder , not easier.

I saw a program recently that compared the sphinx to a naturally occurring rocky outcrop that is common in North African deserts. The rough outline is remarkably similar and it would not take a great deal of modification to turn one into a sphinx.

Good point - you can create by adding to , or taking away from . There is a different logic (glass half empty/glass half full maybe) . Is Mount Rushmore that different to the Sphynx ? Not as pretty , and probably not as enduring .What wouldn't you give to know what people will see in a couple of thousand years. I think native Australians have it sussed in Ayres rock (no , I'm not baiting you but it sounds like a very contentious issue there )

...Is Mount Rushmore that different to the Sphynx...

After carving the Sphinx was mortared tiled and polished, and today, refurnished by experts, to resume past glory

Those lovely white Greek statues in museums - forget it . Covered in tacky colours in their prime. Doesn't history say that Napoleons men 'mortared' it ?

...Covered in tacky colours in their prime...

We, with our modern taste, call it "tacky", but it's not a museum fad, these were covered in colour in ancient times. They also played the Olympics in nudity, not just the competitors, the crowd too. It was a nudist celebration of sports. It was their world, not ours today.

Very true . I speak from my own perspective . My point was that many people are given the impression of a Hollywood film - nymphs fluttering around pristine white statues etc.I am conditioned to think gaudy colours would look tacky , an ancient Greek would be equally askance at my preference.

...fluttering around pristine white statues...

Napoleon's conquests, prompted a lot of 19th century renewed interest in both classical Greece and Roman cultures. The "white" sculptures were mostly found as-are after a forgotten burial or neglect for several centuries.

When restored fame posed them in museums, they were not displayed for the public eye as found, but instead, had plaster or gypsum copies made of them, and so displayed for the public to marvel.

Only at the beginning of the last century, around 1920, and as a result of Schliemann's early and later excavation of Troy in Anatolia,Turkey, did modern archaeologists come to the not-so-surprising resolution, that ancient sculptures, were realistically painted in their time.

Their "hideous" cover in today's museums, may be a sour sight to a modern man, used to the fantastics of CGI natural-colouring used in video these days.

"They also played the Olympics in nudity, not just the competitors, the crowd too. It was a nudist celebration of sports. It was their world, not ours today."

-----

An ancestor of mine made his fortune selling sunscreen at those events. And Smirnoff coolers.

Are you insane?

Smirnoffs were never intended as coolers.

Serve a purpose maybe, but coolers? In Moscow they may drink radiator coolant as if it was Smirnoff, but not the other way around

In MiG Pilot: The Final Escape of Lt. Belenko, half the aircraft were down at any given time because the mechs would drink the-radar transmitter coolant. Your basic Siberian equivalent of Everclear.

Have you heard of the wood-alcohol Scandinavians make from trees . Probably explains why the outside world doesn't hear much about them . ABBA was just a diversion. Probably explains why the 'hill-billy' stereotype still live - They have some braincells left.

Jim-Bob , shut up and get back in bed with your sister...

(don't bother e , just mixing the brew here ! Believe me , if you lived in a place run by Tony you'd want the wood stuff)

...still live - They have some braincells...

Their braincell population count is fine. It's just not connected synapse-to-synapse by means of calcium ions, but instead, it's a loose radio-inspired colony.

Have you ever been exposed to Don Martin's creatures?, or in other words: Are You Experienced?

With horns like mine ? You gotta be kiddin' .Some creatures have Ivory , mine are just full on hair. Damn that rain.

ps - sorry to all Scandinavians ( a joke has to target some body ). IT WAS THE RUSSIANS. Ooops , sorry Ivor , it was ............

We may be so friggin' off-topic here that maybe we'll never get back. But for me, at least, this thread has been refreshingly funny and original today. I really, really needed this!

Thanks, guys!

-e

On one of the "How Do I?" usenet groups years ago someone asked the forum how to remove the skunks from under his pier-and-beam-constructed house. One responder suggested the poor sod throw some lutefisk under the house. Lutefisk made with cod worked the best and would send the skunks scampering, he promised. However, the responder went on to express his concerns about how the OP was subsequently gonna remove the Swedes from under his house! (With apologies to my delightful friends Stephen and Maria Stahlberg!)

-e

What Is the translation of lutefisk , I'm intrigued. If Stephen and Maria are viewing , please accept my deepest apologies- My joke about Swedes elsewhere is easily translatable to other languages ( who could knock the good folk who gave us Bluetooth , oh no you'll probably kill me again saying it was a Norwegian or something!). Excuse me, I have to pick up the pawn shells festering under my desk .

Lutefisk is not yet in my repertoire but I have a feeling it should be .

...also played the Olympics in nudity...

Is this an interlude to a lengthy flogging session?

A possible solution to the op ?

Strange but true.

...possible solution to the op...

Yeah... We deviated quite a lot, maybe the subject exhausted our vigor or interest. But, O.K, as long as it remains interesting, I'm a sucker for it. I'm hooked on interest, and easily led.

Likewise.

Scenic route or gridlocked motorway . No contest.

What does the Stupid Woman's Guide to Atomic Radiation look like?

...compared the sphinx to a naturally occurring...

Right

I was always taught that a sphinx was an anatomical feature. Oh, wait a minute. Did you mean those stone thingies?

I just love these fission threads.

...Sifting for fact becomes harder , not easier...

This is so true.

Ours is a problem of excessive amount of trivia, from which to make some sense of. This is a classic Occam's Razor dilemma:

How to decide given so many seemingly true versions?

...Nubian early kingdoms moved north by conquest...

One relatively known early Nubian kingdom and Clan, was called "Koosh", thought to be ancestral to the earliest Egyptian Pharaonic dynasty.

The Hebrew word "Koosh" means "Africa", The word "Kooshee" means "African"

Somehow the copyright notice on that pyramid strikes me a funny.

Wonder if the Boy King had his own website.

...notice on that pyramid...

Anything that says something like : Mysteries.com or Enigma Inc, automatically reminds me that the landing on the moon really took place in Hollywood, and that the nine-eleven attack was actually done by the CIA, and that Hitler was in fact a Jew, and that my grandma is really my unborn daughter from the future... you get the picture.

It looks to me that you better not tried the wood alcohol.

...you better not tried the wood alcohol...

I'm allergic to alcohol.

It was forced down my throat by aliens

And all you got was that lousy T-shirt.

Next time I'm abducted by aliens I want a Rolex.

Next time I'm abducted I'm going to give them a list of people that they should not bring back.

Maybe we should develop a list of people that really need to be abducted and give it too them. We could add that these are rare examples of human kind and worthy of detailed prolonged study in an off world situation.

We could start with the politicians the move onto layers and accountants. I'm not 100% certain of the order though so I will leave that open for debate.

Let's start with divorce lawyers...

Hey, wait a minute! What if our interstellar friends decide from these examples that we're too dangerous a species and exterminate us? It certainly would put an end to those anal probes.

Unless it is death by boogum.

-e

The fact that they leave no trace or proof makes them really intelligent: they don't want us to ruin their world too.

Does someone know when they bring back the Everwatt bloke? I'm in for a next round on free energy.

"I'm in for a next round on free energy."

Wanna start a "Free Energy" thread? Is it Spoof Time?

...next round on free energy...

Maybe it's a ® brand of a drink

They will probably pity us and wonder how we managed to get out of the trees in the first place.

Business before pleasure , Accountants first.

My fiance is an accounting professor. Is she exempt? I mean, she is training more of these buggers, about a 100 per semester. Does it help that she specializes in governmental/not-for-profit accounting? I think its those accursed bean counters you wanna go after.

On second thought, I don't think she'd mind if some of her more moronic students were abducted by aliens. You wouldn't believe some of the pathetic, brain-dead material she has to work with. It's amazing these kids even know how to tie their own shoelaces.

And the cheaters? Definitely!!!

Tell your Fiance not to worry , I wish to send Gordon Brown (Chancellor of the Exchequer ) away before he becomes Prime Minister . Come to think of it , he may be an alien .

Tying Shoelaces - I would not be surprised if a University over here dishes out a Degrees in that now. Honest , it's that scary . Part of political correctness. Everybody must have a Degree , even if it's pointless. Personally I see a conspiracy going on .

Oh jeeze. Gordon Brown. Isn't he the guy that taxed breathing? He and Tony are a pair, ain't they?

...he may be an alien...

In fact this might just be a great thread: "Name and explain your favourite alien".

Arnold, looks like it, talks like it, walks like it... A DUCK ! I was referring to a DUCK! Arnold is just my duck's name. Jeeeeeze...

Better yet: "Name and explain your subject for an ideal thread topic"

Just as your: "what did my girl drop" thread suggestion

Should it be you Kris, running for "Chancellor of the Exchequer" ?

Actually, I think this trend in education is one reason why we're seeing in increase in these free-energy, perpetual-motion, wacko physics, and pseudo-science posts/threads. These folks are so friggin' clueless they don't know they're clueless. And they have one of these new "degrees" to prove it. Challenge 'em and they turn nasty.

"...one of these new "degrees.."

You mean one of those new-age posts-modernistic "Quantum Zen" types?

And I, gullible that I am, thought that New-Age is all about open-minded tolerance.

Do you mean to say it's not?

You're not gullible. Not by a long shot. Wanna see gullible? Start a thread on Nikola Tesla and see what oozes out of the woodwork.

<flame on>

Some of these folks are so open-minded that their brains fall out when they lean over. These same people wouldn't allow a garbage truck to dump its load in their living rooms, but apparently they don't hold to this standard for what they allow into their heads. It's no wonder some of them are incapable of critical judgement and are unable to follow an idea to its logical conclusion. And of those spouting "tolerance?" Listen to them carefully and it becomes very clear that their tolerance extends only to those who share their worldview. Challenges to that worldview are condemned as examples of intolerance and are not..um..tolerated. Hmmm, sure sounds like the pot calling the kettle "black."

I don't mind people espousing alternative scientific theories, but I've yet to see any such theory meet the critical test of making an accurate prediction that comes to pass. Take, for example, Murray Gell-Mann's prediction of the existence of the Omega-minus particle, which was finally observed to exist in Nature. Or, his Eightfold Way, a new construct which reigned-in the explosion of the types of sub-atomic particles and organized them into a kind of Periodic Table of the elementary particles. Not only that, but it predicted the existence of the various types of quarks which are seen today as constituting a number of composite particles (like the proton and neutron).

I have yet to see one pseudo-science theory predict anything, let alone make any real sense or have much basis in fact. These people seem to think that because their pet theories appeal to themselves, they must be true. Some of them even go so far as to believe that because they thought of some theory - no matter how bizarre - it is worthy of and deserving serious consideration by others. I dunno, maybe they do it because real, deep understanding takes honest-to-God thinking. Effort. Work. Too hard, they decide, so they abandon their search for Truth and go looking instead for a good Fantasy. Knock, knock. Is anyone in there? Just nod if you can hear me.

<flame off>

-e

...Gell-Mann's prediction...Omega-minus...his Eightfold Way...

Funny you mentioned that. In Israel's elementary physics community, he is referred to as "the guy who snatched the Nobel from Yuval Ne'eman", who concurrently figured out and submitted the so-called "eightfold way" (which is actually a mathematical entity), describing the hierarchy of sub particle order, classified by their properties.

The late Ne'eman, who dedicated his life to elementary and applicable nuclear research, was himself snatched from the Israeli Army by Moshe Dayan, then the chief of staff, to go advance his studies in the US (Princeton, and MIT I think), leaving IDF's advanced research department. (I can see the wheels of your mind turning, so, Yes, he did/was...).

He was in touch with Gellmann, and credited him in all of his publications related to subparticle physics. Scientific community was more than once referred to as a "snake-pit of envy", but not in this case. Lookit up.

...I see a conspiracy going on...

The conspiracy is to dilute natural sciences to a meaningless pulp, a-la: "enough with this reality crap!"

dilute -How curious . One of the things needling me was the discovery that 3 UK 'Universities' are now awarding a Degree in Homeopathy. I am going to find some tin-foil with which I will cover my head to prevent further brain wave control .

Huge numbers of Engineering Students drop out because they can't handle basic maths - The Schools have seen to that .

I will be back soon (with tin-foil) when I have had several cups of Coffee and a really good rant to myself .

...dilute...a Degree in Homeopathy...

An intentional punt?

They say the more diluted the stuff - The more potent it becomes, no less !

Makes me wanna bang my head on a nice, massive, bell: dulololololol... (there's no emoticon for that, lookup Don Martin for inspiration)

They say the more diluted the stuff - The more potent it becomes, no less !

Exactly , and this snake-oil approach to medicine is being elevated to the same level as serious study. Unbelievable !

As to the conspiracy , You can't destroy ideas by shouting "no good" but you can marginalise them by elevating the mediocre to the same level . It's been going on before a pile of bricks was presented as art (OK , bad example it had a sort of Dada-esque point .But Tracy Emmins unmade bed ??)

It gets me so mad .

The UK is living the fairy tale about The Emperors New Clothes. I need more tin-foil

...can't destroy ideas by shouting "no good" but you can...

Well, you can do something, with a good-spirited "wacko" reply and sometimes you may do some justice to a "serious" issue.

Please refer to the progress of the thread, rather than the quoted post.

...Tracy Emmins unmade bed ??...

That's just saying: I am a work of art. You wouldn't want to hear some of my stories of what is or is not considered art, but take it from me, some of it is plainly insane

...need more tin-foil... And to sit under a wire pyramid, take it from an experienced dingdong

Re :Don martin (mentioned above)

I shall speak on this matter no more.

Lacking tin foil, I find it handy to occasionally Stare Into The Abyss while sipping my morning coffee (as I'm doing now). Lacking a handy Abyss, I've discovered that aluminized mylar works wonders, especially if it's gold anodized. Not only that, but in some circles such chappeaux is considered to be very, very Haute Couture. You wanna look professional.

"It's amazing these kids even know how to tie their own shoelaces."

That's why they wear thongs!

Thongs are also known as Irish safety boots!

I used to live with my girl, on the second floor apartment located in D'israeli Street, a very quiet neighbourhood.

I was the funky eighties, and she wore clogs, you know, dutch clompen, wooden shoes: Clip-clop, clip-clop, all-day-round.

On the first floor there's this Motty, blue collar working type, very direct.

Seven PM, Dinner, impatient knocking on the door: Motty, how is it, anything I candoforyou?

- You tell you girl to take off these clogs, I cannot concentrate like this!

- Studying?

- No, I'm trying for some intimacy with my girl, and I keep hearing your girl's clogs and I cannot concentrate

- You don't mean that I should offer you my girl, do you?

- Well... It would help... Would you?

Hmmm . . . I have an idea - may be patentable - I'll get back to you.

Wellllllll?

Just a couple of thoughts.

People seem to be concerned about the possibility of some group stealing spent fuel rods/assemblies for the reactor grade plutonium in them. Think of the logistics of such a task. Breaking into a secure facility and stealing at least a couple of tons of highly radioactive fuel assemblies that are shielded only by the water in the cooling pool, transporting them to a facility where the plutonium can be chemically extracted from the spent fuel, by cutting up the assemblies, disolving the spent fuel and chemically separating the plutonium, then the plutonium must be reduced to a metal. Disposing of the resulting radioactive solutions will also be a problem. Then the technically challenging task of designing a bomb to use reactor grade plutonium, shaping the metalic plutonium, and actually building the bomb. Working with all of this radioactive material is not something that can done in a garage or even a warehouse. It would be quite easy to detect.

I have read that the weapon made of reactor grade plutonium was still 80% weapons grade.

I would be much more worried about the weapons grade plutonium pits from dismantled weapons that are being stored as metallic plutonium. Another reason to convert them to MOX fuel and burn it up.

I have made no secret of my admiration for the CANDU system. The definitive web page for the CANDU system is www.nuclearfaq.ca by Dr. Jeremy Whitlock.

Some guy was busted years ago for trying to take 10,000 smoke alarms out of the former Soviet Union for their plutonium. Seems the soviets used plutonium (not americium and other short-lived isotopes) in their smoke alarms, and lots of it, too. Millicuries per alarm, as I recall.

The former Soviet Union is also missing a sizable amount of very pure, weapons-grade plutonium - on the order of several kilograms - and certainly enough to make a bomb. Some speculate that it was an inside job; not requiring a break-in at all, but a pen put to a ledger.

-e

Also, before I left Ottawa last year, I attend a seminar for the Nuclear Waste Management Organization, which exists to answer these very questions, and they conduct seminars and surveys to raise awareness in Canada etc.. http://www.nwmo.ca/

I know they gave out books and manuals discussing the issues surrounding the disposal of nuclear waste products. They are open to new members. You probably are already aware of this group, but as it hasn't been mentioned, I thought I would.

Chris

...Think of the logistics of such a task...

O.K, let's ship the darn mess away, to protect the potential terrorist's health as well. Agreed.

Crush and melt the material, mix it with other metals and impurities to dilute the concentration of radiation. Possibly add lead.

Create large ingots and transport them to a large pit that has been prepared to protect the environment.

Have a process where each new ingot arriving is melted or welded to the others in the pit creating a huge mass that is not transportable or useable.

The process will need to do this in an inert atmosphere, too, as uranium and plutonium are highly pyrophoric.

-e

One has to careful when melting down mixtures containing fissile elements. The volume and geometry should never be such that a criticality event might occur. That means never casting it in a sphere, and keeping the castings separated by some distance.

The problem you want to avoid is the accumulation of the fissile material into a critical mass with resulting release of energy which depending upon the circumstances might range from a release of intense radiation to BOOM.

In a television documentary they should a plutonium storage facility. The Pu was stored as a powder, in small quantities in much larger cans. The cans were then piled in a storage area. The powder was in a thin layer in the bottom of the can meaning that a critical mass could not be achieved by piling the cans because a critical mass could not be achieved because the relatively small quantities of Pu were separated by the air space left in the cans. If however the cans had been filled and then stacked it would be a different situation.

I enquired of a nuclear physicist about passing the spent fuel, minus the Uranium through a CANDU reactor. They feel that probably 90% of the plutonium would be burned up and 60% of the radioactive actinides. The necessary reprocessing would increase the volume but greatly reduce the radioactivity and proliferation threat.

I like the 'welding' and ingot idea... not to say the CANDU reactor treatment is bad, but expensive and time consuming etc. but just to focus on the ingot idea for a minute, could you cast an ingot surrouned and infused with moderator materials?