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Anonymous Poster

Tripping of Feed Pump

12/24/2010 2:30 AM

hello everyone,

i have a problem with feed pump motor/starter system, it's 110 kw motor with soft starter make seimens and model 3rw44

Problem is that motor trip any time may be after 3 hours or 24 hour remain uncertain and start again after removing trip

after checking parameter of soft starter i find that current shown in soft starter display are very much uneven say r-67, y-70 , b-95 but on motor terminal its same 128 +/- 3 volts

firstly i change motor as current in soft starter are not in range but problem remain same with new motor too.

what to do now , kindly suggest

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Guru

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#1

Re: tripping of feed pump

12/24/2010 2:54 AM

Obviously soft starter problem.Try and by-pass the soft starter with ordinary starter and observe results for one or two days.

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#13
In reply to #1

Re: tripping of feed pump

02/02/2012 11:06 AM

i had bypass the soft stater by putting a timer with 15 sec. time after getting start by same & solve the problem

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#2

Re: tripping of feed pump

12/24/2010 3:36 AM

These numbers are somewhat confusing. 110 kw ≈ 150 hp. A 460/3/60 motor would draw about 180A, a 230/3/60 motor about 360A. The unbalance on a new motor does make the soft starter look suspect, as Ramvinod notes. Or possibly a wiring fault such as moisture in the insulation. Some megohm testing would be in order.

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#3

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/24/2010 10:08 AM

This sounds like a wiring problem to me. Disconnect the wires at both end and megger them to ground. Sounds like you have a phase conductor partially shorted to ground that is sucking off current.

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#4

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/24/2010 11:51 AM

The 3RW44 has integral bypass contacts. After ramping, the motor is DOL from then on. If it tripped in 2-3 hours, it probably has nothing to do with the soft starter other than the protection system may be doing its job.

The protection built in to it does monitor for phase current imbalance and even if you do not set it to trip at a specific unbalance percentage, it biases the thermal OL curve so it will eventually trip on OL to protect the motor windings from further thermal damage. You did not state what the trip was, it is recorded in the 3RW history, I suggest checking into that.

When you are reading the different values between what the soft starter says and what you see on the output terminals, when are you reading that? If it is during the ramp sequence, your meter may not be capable of accurately representing the chopped sine wave current. If it is after the ramp is complete, they should agree. The 3RW44 just has CTs inside that are reading the current, there is no magic involved. So either you are doing something wrong with your meter or there is something seriously wrong with your 3RW44, like maybe it is so small compared to the motor that you are saturating the internal CTs? You may also have the 3RW44 set up to think it is being used "inside the delta" when in fact you are not, or vice versa.

I suggest before you do anything else, step through ALL of the parameters and write down everything that is set. The back of the manual provides a list for doing this. If you don't have the manual, or yours is more than 2 years old, download the latest version from Siemens. If you see a lot of things you don't understand, post them here and I will try to help if I have time. Or do the routine to reset everything back to factory defaults and start over.

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#5

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/24/2010 3:18 PM

What are you pumping what is the mechanical conditions present?

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klearzen
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#6

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/25/2010 12:21 PM

Is soft starter in series with motor power supply from it's MCC feeder during normal running of motor? If it so ,then Soft starter is a culprit, since soft starter's current out put is not balanced as mentioned by you.

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Anonymous Poster
#7

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/25/2010 2:49 PM

Tripping always occurs when current higher than should be. It might happen that the resistance to flow in the installation is lower that predicted. That would cause feeding more than the feed that is normal, which always increases power consumption by motor driving the pump. You have two options: one on electrical side and another on hydraulic side:

Hydraulic side: Place Orifice in the flange of the suction part of the pump. Proper size would probably be aperture 90% of the flange aperture.

Electric side: Increase level of the tripping current by 10%.

Proper way would involve flow measure vs current of motor and finding out what to do!

Good luck as it is to late for knowledge for you!

Advise is not to trust what I wrote, as I do not have any idea about your system. This problem might relate to wrong selection of trip for the range of the operation of your pump.

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#8

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/26/2010 1:30 PM

Is soft starter in series with motor power supply from it's MCC feeder during normal running of motor? If it so ,then Soft starter is a culprit, since soft starter's current out put is not balanced as mentioned by you.

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#9
In reply to #8

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/27/2010 11:51 AM

AGAIN,

That soft starter has integral bypass contacts. At the end of ramp, i.e. 10-30 seconds later, the bypass contacts close AND THE SOFT STARTER IS NO DIFFERENT THAN A DOL STARTER. Nothing the soft starter does, or doesn't do, is going to affect the tripping 2-3 hours into it.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/27/2010 4:00 PM

Good point - check one or more of the bypass contacts are not cooked.

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#11

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

12/27/2010 6:46 PM

Yet one more time... no further input from a "guest" after posting a question asking for aid and receiving responses from the community.

Me thinks in the future, I will ignore requests from guests.

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#12

Re: Tripping of Feed Pump

09/25/2011 10:20 AM

Thanx to all my friends for reply

my office IP was Blocked i don't know way

i had put a new soft stater in place of old

and problem solved

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