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Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 2:49 AM

Just got this E-mail from my Daughter, who thought my CR4 chums might have some good ideas on this. Here's the brief...
"I am involved in a video shoot in a week. The 'video concept' is that we are going to build a flying machine out of scrap stuff. We've got loads of space, as Rich the frontman lives in a converted warehouse, in the middle of a gated industrial estate. We've also got loads of scrap wood and tough fabric as there's a blinds company and plenty of others on the estate who fill the skips, and contacts to source other materials we might need. Rich is a pukka carpenter by profession, which helps. Now, whilst the main point of this is that the building and testing process looks interesting, and whilst it's a bit of a 'birdman of Bognor' endeavour, in that I guess we're not really going to be able to make something that will fly, we're the sort of people that want to do things properly. We don't want to build something laughably cosmetic, we want to build something based on proper physical principles, which we can at least try and launch in some fashion. The question is, what? What should we build? We have six people and I guess five hours of daylight. We've got loads of tools and I can take that old Singer sewing machine, too. Ideas please!"
Del

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#1

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 3:18 AM

Powered?

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#2
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 3:23 AM

Nope... I assume not.
You know pretty much as much as me as I quoted the E-mail almost in it's entirity, with a few brevity edits...
Del

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#3

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 3:45 AM

Can bits of a Hyundai Accent be used in the build?

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#4
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 3:49 AM

...D'oh

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#9
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 7:19 AM

...and if anyone offers Chevy Cavalier parts, by all means, TURN THEM AWAY!

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#5

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 5:41 AM

Since you will have the old Singer, is there enough blind material and cord for one of these ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlrRzfvUffw

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#13
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 9:55 AM

Wow! That's awesome! I wouldn't try a "quick" build on any thing I was going to fly in, or sky dive with...You do have enough time to build an awesome kite though, to be flown from the ground...

http://www.kitesrus.com/

http://makeakite.ryanpublishingandreviews.com/category/kite-plans/

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#6

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 5:42 AM

Lots of these on the internet. With detailed plans. Maybe use your wood and fabric, and make one of those. Heck, it might even fly.

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#7

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 5:58 AM

Del,

Today in Auckland, but don't try this one for the quick build!

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/national/news/video.cfm?c_id=1503075&gal_cid=1503075&gallery_id=122790

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#8

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 6:09 AM

<...scrap wood...>

Balsa!

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#10

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 7:29 AM

You could, in 5 hours, build a kite, but I would guess, NOT an airplane. There are some ultra-lights that are simply powered gliders, so in 5 hours,its possible, but Not probable. Even a piper-cub derivative could take hundreds of hours. If every sub-assembly was already built, maybe you could put them together in 5 hours, but not build & assemble from scratch. Plus, the woods in a Stinson-wing, for example, are special aircraft weights/grades. Left-over fabrics may be, but probably are not, strong enough to stretch-over a wooden wing framing, and then the fabrics were usually "doped". Of course epoxies may do better than dope. You could do a plane as a static-sculpture, but not as a flyable piece, and even then, I don't know if it can be done in 5 hours,even with 6 people. Still, TRY it, see how far you can get in 5 hours. The Wright brothers' Father opposed their flying efforts, but it merely gave them impetus. But I'll bet they had more than 500 hours building their Wright-flyer.

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#11
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 7:37 AM

.

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#12

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 9:54 AM

I would suggest a simple hang glider design of sorts. Minimum parts and materials but still well understood mechanics behind it and easily scalable to fit what time and materials you have available.

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#21
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 3:36 AM

Darn you beat me to it! That was going to be my suggestion.

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#14

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 10:06 AM

I like the idea of one of those wonderful kites with a dummy sitting in the rigging, it covers the story without risking human life and limb (BTW, do students qualify as human?).

Great project.

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#15

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 1:48 PM

Sounds like fun Del. With out a doubt the best wood aircraft to come into being out of desperation in WW II was the Mosquito (DeHavlin I believe). It was a beautiful and out performed everyone's hopes and dreams. The German fighters were afraid of it!

I think it would make a clear Tribute to the airmen that fought that Bloody War.

A scaled down version would be a challenge and fun to build.

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#16

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 10:28 PM

Well not in five hours? but highly doable

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culver_Cadet

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#17

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 10:37 PM

Even better, there are flocks of these flying out there

But it occurs you could put a dead weight in place of the engine and a tow strap between the wheels and drag it into the air.

Just don't let loved ones do the test flight

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#18

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 10:45 PM

Here's another idea, recently on CR4.

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#19

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/23/2011 11:37 PM

Take a look at "RC autogiro" or "RC autogyro". Easy to build. The big rotor is free running. It either has an independent pushing propeller, or somebody pulling it running. It will lift into the air readily. There are man carrying powered / unpowered ones flying. The unpowered ones were towed in the air with a car and cable. Kitplanes magazine, among others have periodically articles and listings of all amateur things flying, this one too, for reference. Or look in a RC modeling mag. I think.

As a small or medium size model goes, I do not think anything else is as simple. The profile of the big rotor is nothing fancy. On a scale model I would start with tilted flat blades, only later improve it toward an airfoil.

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#20

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 3:32 AM

In builds like these there are two major enemies: weight and flying speed.

It is vital to keep the build weight as low as possible to have any chance of success (regardless of the design). The flying speed is generally under estimated. That's why you see most participants in 'birdman of Bognor' contests go down very, very quickly. If they may use a launch mechanism, I would include one in the build. Look at pictures of the first flight of the Wright brothers in Kitty Hawk. They had a rail with a pulley system and weights that dropped behind the plane.

Regarding the design I would certainly go for the KISS principle. A copy of an early Langley or a Cody glider would be really cool. ;-)

Here's a plan of the design I am refering to:

http://www.apogeerockets.com/education/downloads/Newsletter08.pdf

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#22

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 7:38 AM

Dirigible/zeppelin. Milo

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#26
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 10:24 AM

One of these, perhaps? A worthy successor to the R100, and better than the R101. And being built at Cardington, where Neville Shute worked.

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#23

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 7:49 AM

A catapult or siege engine comes to mind. The "pilot" could wear wings crafted from the curtain scraps.

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#24

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 9:17 AM

There was a program on , I guess you Brits call it the telly, that was caled "JUNKYARD WARS" where two competing teams would try to outdo each other using scraps from a junk yard to build different machines. On one program they actually built a flying machine that worked and I believe it was piloted by a BRIT.

Just an idea.

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#29
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/25/2011 4:52 AM

There's no such thing as a Brit. English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish, yes. Not "Brit".

"Vive la difference".

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#30
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/25/2011 5:04 AM

I disagree. Any immigrant who takes citizenship becomes British. Although a Nigerian colleague of mine always claims to be Scottish....

For our Colonial cousins, the correct term is "Briton*" (without the "Ancient" in this case) NOT Brit. You know how those from the Southern States hate to be refered to as "Yankies" ...?

*But never Breton. They're quite different.

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#35
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/27/2011 10:57 PM

It would be "yankee", but you can call we yanks(plural) anything you care to, as long as it's not, late for dinner. However, the British, of ALL people, should KNOW the difference between a Southerner and a D--n-Yankee!

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#37
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/28/2011 4:17 AM

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#31
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/25/2011 5:07 AM

How do you say "telly" in Welsh?

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#33
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/27/2011 6:20 AM

Not sure about the spelling (not got there in my Beginners' Welsh course yet)but I know it's pronounced "tellywelly" - it's a slang word, so not in the online translations. My junior school (7 - 11 yo) head master was Welsh and he used the word.

Television, on the otherhand, is teledu (telly-dee)

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#32
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/25/2011 2:41 PM

Lord luv 'ee, thee vergot Cornwall!

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#25

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 9:40 AM

I love the idea, but some consideration should be given to the people on the ground. an Item that seems to be forgotten in most of our high flying expeditions. An alternator from a volvo coming through the roof would play havoc with my computer. But, again that would save me a lot of time...

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#27

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 10:29 AM

I'm no expert but I don't think the Singer will provide enough power for lift off.

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#28

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/24/2011 11:29 AM

My Daughter has just been round and says thanks to everyone, she's been following the thread and has been given plenty of inspiration. She hasn't registered as "I'm not and engineer".
She was ammused by the Hyundai reference too
Del

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#34

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/27/2011 7:58 PM

within 5 hours you could rent a balloon

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#36
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Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/28/2011 4:16 AM

That would make the film/programme very boring...

...or...

A rent balloon wouldn't fly...boom tish, I thank you.

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#38

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/28/2011 9:12 AM

Just combine bricks, and photo-shop. Anything can be made to fly. It would certainly be amusing to watch the careful crafting of bricks to resemble a plane, and then to show it flying.

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#39

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

11/29/2011 8:35 AM

Testing a wing design could be deadly.

Testing a balloon is safer. One foot off the ground = success.

The film could show a home built apparatus for separating hydrogen from water. Let it run "overnight." In the morning, come in to discover your envelope filled with gas (helium). Assemble the gondola and attach it in your 5 hours of day light.

Allowing for some fiction in actual implementation, you could build a balloon using "proper physical principles" and show the process on film.

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#40
In reply to #39

Re: Quick Build 'Flying Machine'

12/02/2011 7:05 AM

Yes of course, don't really use the hydrogen actually use helium instead. But don't tell the viewers.

Over here they use acetylene gas to fill balloons that float. Different party tricks eventuate.

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