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Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/05/2014 10:39 PM

I'd been browsing the internet for some answers regarding a question I had on a specific type of adhesive used to glue two pieces of very thin newsprint paper (about 50micrometers thick) together with as thin and flexible an adhesive possible.
I am trying to manufacture a product with the following details for a school project:

Each sheet of newsprint paper will have ink on both sides that should not be smudged when the adhesive is applied. Two pieces of these newsprints will be glued together aligned one with the other (basically to double up the paper). The adhesive should be flexible and virtually extremely thin and undetectable (so that it doesn't seem that there is glue at all). The final feel of the paper (flexibility wise) should be as close as possible to a standard piece of paper.

As an example, imagine an exam with fill in the blanks. The goal is to make a piece of paper so that when held up to a light, you can see the correct answers (which lay on the inside of the piece of paper) because they lay on the inside of the two pieces of paper glued together. These pages will then be added to a book so that there are hundreds of these types of quizzes. The need for the product to not be much thicker than the two pieces is essential to fit more in the book at less cost.

If you think there is already something on the market like this that you can take apart to help me figure out the formula and make a lot of it, please fill me in as well.

Thank you for your time,

J.F.

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#1

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/05/2014 10:52 PM

You'll get ton's of "my favorite adhesive is best" suggestions from this.

Search for thin film adhesives. That's a very thin, usually Mylar® (polyester) film with a very thin film of contact adhesive on both sides.

So peel the release paper from one side, stick paper to it, peel other side, stick second sheet to it.

Liquids will bleed into the paper. Sprays MIGHT work.

You want a lot.

Contact 3M or other sources you find on the net.

Search for "thin film adhesive manufacturers" and ask them.

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#2

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/05/2014 10:56 PM

We could start by imagining that atomized Gorilla Glue wouldn't work. (Unless maybe it would.)

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#3

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/05/2014 11:25 PM
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#4

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/06/2014 2:43 PM

Welcome to the CR4 country. Since this is your first post, from my experience at least, don't try to reinvent the wheel! Also the participants on CR4 are from very wide backgrounds, occupations, experiences, interests, knowledge's and competences in these areas. Some are the Gurus in the fields of interest, some are absolute idiots and thankfully most others have various levels of interest and knowledge in several fields. It is up to the OP to determine what are the best answer(s). No one other than you can judge what will work the best. Some answers will be brilliant and you won't be able to recognize it. Some others will be some deviant's attempt to BS you and pull the wool over your eyes with an answer that sounds good but isn't simply for their joy of giving someone the wrong answer. Fortunately these are few and far between.

Now on to your adhesive question. Unless you are going into commercial production with this proposed mixture, FORGET ABOUT IT! The adhesives field is so wide and so varied that it would be a "pin the tail on the donkey" project to develop this formulation. Besides that how many participants here have any more than "Elmer's Glue-all" experience? Not as many as you need. In the adhesives industry there are tens of thousands of formulas for thousands of types of applications.

Your first step should be to clearly define what the end use of the formula is. Next state the desired properties of it. What are the substrates, working time, clarity, color, initial tack, viscosity, flexibility, cure time, etc. Next go to a large library and read the applicable sections of Skeist's-- Handbook of Adhesives. It is the bible of adhesives.

Now is the most important part. Contact several of the numerous adhesives manufactures and ask them if they manufacture any formula to do the application you have and with as many of the properties that you have determined necessary. Talk to the technical services or development lab personnel. They are the ones who know the product line and their capabilities. If one manufacturer doesn't have any ask them who would. Adhesives are very competitive so they will honestly tell you so they have good customer relations for the next opportunity with you. Start with some such as Henkel, Masterbond, H B Fuller, Bostik, 3M, Glue-Fast in NYC, etc. Do a Google of "adhesives manufacturers" to get a very long list. When you find one who you think has the formula for you, ask for a sample. Do your test and follow up with them if it isn't the one or it is the best. If your needs do not meet their minimum ask them to refer you to a distributor.

I worked in the adhesives industry for over ten years. I learned enough to know that I know little about the formulas and their uses. This is the way to succeed in finding the right product. Contact the development and technical people!

Good Luck, Old Salt

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#5

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/06/2014 8:23 PM

I believe I have exactly what you're looking for...http://www.mediaatelier.com/CheatSheet/

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#6

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/06/2014 10:38 PM

fish glue (made from fish hides) is the traditional book binder's glue. It does not wrinkle paper when it dries. It does not smell like fish. The use I saw it used for was to insert printed plates into books along one edge. (okay then,...it was when I was working for a crooked antiques dealer....)The process is called "tipping in".

I don't see much difference between glueing one edge or gluing four edges..the process would be the same. And it lends itself to a sort of printing method.

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#7

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/06/2014 11:05 PM

Consider using casket glue. It is an animal based glue used for gluing the cloth liners to the inner sides of caskets. It has a long work time before it sets up. It also will release quite easily.

Also try "padding compound" This is the glue that is used to glue pads of paper together to make pads of paper. Pads are made by stacking paper onto a piece of cardboard, not the corrugated type, like heavy shirt cardboard. Align the edge to be glued and clamp it down to a solid surface. Multiple pads may be stacked one on each other. Glue the clamped edge and let it dry. When dried unclamp, separate the pads at the edge between adjacent pads and you have a set of pads. Your application is similar to this operation. Contact Glue-Fast for a supply of it. They are a distributor of a variety of manufactures glues for many applications such as yours.

GlueFast

3535 New Jersey 66, Neptune Township, NJ 07753
(732) 918-4600

http://www.gluefast.com/

Good Luck, Old Salt

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#8

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/06/2014 11:33 PM

Regarding which glue will work I can only suggest what others have.

As for the final goal, an answer key that reveals itself when backlit..... this sounds like something better suited to an e-book with conditional formatting...

Paper books.....so last millenium.

Welcome to CR4. Have a good week.

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#9

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/07/2014 1:01 AM

Adhesive is a messy affair! Why not print the answers using UV sensitive inks and give/loan them small LED penlights with 7000K led's installed. Not too practical for the beach but very workable in a classroom, and inexpensive also.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/07/2014 4:15 AM

I liked your post.

I agree entirely, sticky tape and two sheets of paper are simply not practical.....

Going on from your idea, why does the OP not print a box around the correct answer that is ONLY visible when UV light is used, that works even outside in daylight. The box could even be on the back of the paper and still be seen through thin paper.

Many different ideas spring to mind as you have already demonstrated.

As an example for every day usage, I use small UV LED Flashlights (bought cheaply on ebay, some are really tiny and work well) to identify forged European banknotes when selling anything for cash.....up to now, no forgeries found!!

For anyone interested in checking their money, certain countries print on special paper that shows certain markings only under UV light. The UK and Europe are some. but I would expect more.....probably the USA too....

A short treatise on UV can be found here for anyone interested:-

Ultraviolet Light

If anyone is interested in further reading about making Bank notes un-forgeable, then I stumbled upon a great document covering the history of such efforts (going back over a 1000 years!) here:-

Banknote Security

Warning. But it has little to do with the subject here......other than to demonstrate just how accurately such printing can be made nowadays.

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#11

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/07/2014 7:32 AM

Answer is simple, contact several adhesive manufacturers and give them full information on requirements. Even if they do not have exact item they can probably tweak an existing product to match your needs. PS Do not refer to it as glue, they prefer the term adhesive.

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#12

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/07/2014 8:43 AM

Spray adhesive...

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#13

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/07/2014 10:02 AM

This smacks of the tools, materials and knowledge to create a counterfeit bill more than a age for a textbook.

The one counterfeit bill that worked was made from the same paper used in phone books.

The red and blue threads were simply printed onto the paper.

..if this is for a school project then why the specific need for thin paper .. flexibility.. extreme thinness ..

And since when does one need to "manufacture" a school project.

More questions.. less answers.

What school do you go to?

What class is this for?

Why the technical specs for a school project?

Why would a page in a book need to be so thin, flexible and flimsy?

Were you aware that a dollar bill is approximately 100 microns thick?

what a coincidence!

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/09/2014 2:39 PM

I'm with JE, this sounds more like a clever "cheat sheet" than anything else. Put it on your desk as the teacher passes by and the hidden image stays hidden, lift it up a bit and the reflected light from the desk illuminates the underside enough to reveal the hidden image. Same deal if it were embedded in a page in a book that's allowed to be used during an exam.

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#15
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Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/10/2014 10:22 AM

Yeah, if this were to be a 'self-grading test' in a book, an easy solution would be to have the answers 'written' in watermark on the page. that fulfills the requirements:

1) no thicker than a normal page

2) invisible under normal lighting, visible on backlighting

And if you want to fit even more into a book without increasing the bulk, talk to the places that make Catholic bibles. those books use incredibly thin paper, to the point where the books are handled carefully by their owners not only out of respect for the spiritual messages within, but also because they're afraid they'll tear the pages by accident if they're not extra-gentle. That thin paper, while feeling fragile, is actually almost as tear-resistant as normal book paper.

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#16

Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/11/2014 10:31 AM

Thanks for all of the responses guys!

The idea for this project was to be able to create an effective cheat sheet. After receiving the newsprint paper I realized that it is off-white and wouldn't be able to pass as a standard piece of white computer paper. As far as the UV Ink, I'm trying to figure out the shelf life of the ink once it is printed on the piece of paper.

It would work a bit better than my original idea because one could have a handheld small UV light on a key chain to illuminate what was placed on the sheet. The sheet could also be written on and still glow once the light was activated.

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#17
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Re: Need Help Figuring Out What Type Of Adhesive To Use

04/11/2014 1:01 PM

UV ink would be fairly easy to read in a classroom setting, since fluorescent lights 'leak' a fair amount of UV as well as their visible output.

Looking at this from another angle, if you put the energy into making this cheat sheet into say, studying for the test. You'd probably get a better score, and the teacher would have no chance of discovering the 'doctored' paper, because the paper wasn't doctored at all; you 'smuggled' the answers inside your own skull.

Why do you want to cheat anyway? Grades below college level don't really count for anything, and at college and up, it's more about what you learn from the course than what the GPA is. Trust me, your second post-graduation job won't care what your grades were, as long as you have the skills they want. And your first post-graduation job likely won't care either.

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