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Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

Posted March 04, 2007 5:01 PM
Pathfinder Tags: challenge questions

The question as it appears in the 03/06 edition of Specs & Techs from GlobalSpec:

A very small ball is on the top of another ball with a radius of 5 cm; the mass of the smaller ball is negligible compared to the larger ball. The balls are dropped from a distance of 50 cm between the ground and the bottom of the larger ball. Lying on a roof 4.5 meters from the ground, you observe this experiment looking directly to the falling balls. If all collisions are elastic, will you be hit in the face when the balls bounce? If so, by which ball?

(Update 4:55 PM EST 03/12/07) And the Answer is....

A moment before the big ball hits the ground both balls are speeding downward with a velocity v given by

where g is the acceleration of gravity, and h is the original height (50 cm).

(See the given figure).

Immediately after the big ball hits the ground, it moves upward with speed v. The small ball, however, is still moving downward at speed v. Therefore, the relative speed of the two balls is 2v. After the balls bounce off each other, the upward speed of the big ball stays equal to v (because its mass is much bigger than the mass of the small ball), and the upward speed of the small ball is

By applying the conservation of energy to each ball we get:

1) For the big ball

It is clear from this equation that the height reached by the big ball is the same as the original height (50 cm).

2) For the small ball. The conservation of energy equation is given by

where H is the height reached after bouncing off the big ball. From this equation we find that

or

Then, the maximum height reached by the small ball is

This is depicted in the figure.

Certainly, if you don't move fast you will be hit in the face by the small ball.

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Guru

Join Date: Mar 2007
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Re: Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

03/21/2007 6:09 AM

Hi ,

I wasn't looking at the shock wave or whatever breaking the neck - I do that (!)

Re your last sentence , do the balls not have the same perfectly elastic property of the original question. The morphing shape will get pancaked and bounce to original height .

I sense a slight agreement with my conjecture (?) that all the shapes I illustrated will return to original height . Clarify - answer given for the op is correct , Yes or No ?

If it's a "yes" I'm going to have to hunt down somebody outside the forum. To use an English idiom , I do not think this particular horse has been flogged to death.

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Anonymous Poster
#202

Re: Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

03/21/2007 7:13 AM

I can not understand the law of conservation of energy. If the small ball has a negligible mass compared to the big ball but greater than 0 than the energy in the "max. high"-position in greater than the energy in the "release" position in the picture. Where does the additional energy come from?

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Guru

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#203
In reply to #202

Re: Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

03/21/2007 7:41 AM

The 'official' answer would have us believe that the larger ball does not return to original height , it transfers energy to the smaller ball which bounces to higher than it's own original position (hence energy is not lost). It can not be tested for the conditions stated , but using balls of different property can give a spectacular result. I for one do not accept the 'official answer yet.

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Anonymous Poster
#204

Re: Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

06/06/2008 8:54 PM

Congratulations! You have solved the energy crisis. If the large ball attains its original height, and the small ball goes beyond its original height, we have just extracted some free energy from somewhere. Something about conservative fields and independence of path. Isaac must be spinning in his grave.

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Guru

Join Date: Apr 2007
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#205
In reply to #204

Re: Bouncing Balls: Newsletter Challenge (03/06/07)

06/07/2008 4:13 PM

Alack Sir Isaac, he knew limiting approximations well. ["Negligible mass" being a limiting approximation, I doubt he would be the least fazed.]

Naturally, if you choose not to neglect the mass of the smaller ball you will find that neither ball bounces quite that high - similarly if you choose not to regard the mass of the earth as infinite.

Nevertheless, if there is any remnant of Isaac in his grave, it will indeed be spinning, along with the non-infinite earth and the rest of us

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