SIL FOS Silver Solder???

Find a comercial mechanical contractor. or a plumber.

Check eBay for Sil Fos auctions.

You will be pleasantly surprised. $$/Lb!

For the silver content, if it is 15% silver, you're looking more at about $450.00 tops right now.

I believe silver solder is usually closer to 100% silver. In electronics is is typically ~97 to 99%. I don't know about plumbing but I'm not sure what else would be in it because it isn't going to have any lead in it.

From what I've seen, silver solder is used in other things than electronics (usually jewelery). It has a higher melting point than regular tin-lead solder, and the surfaces to be soldered have to be flushed with an acidic pickling agent.

The higher melting point is sometimes a reason silver is used. Not so in electronics. The only reason for the switch is to get the lead out and the higher processing temperatures have presented a challenge to the industry.

It looks like what this guy has is more what I would think of as brazing rod but it is really out of my field so I am unfamiliar with common terminology.

"I believe silver solder is usually closer to 100% silver."

First you have to keep in mind that there is a definitive difference between soldering and brazing. In a nutshell it's brazing if the filler melts above 800F and soldering if the filler melts below 800F.

A common silver bearing solder like "StayBrite" has around 5% silver with the bulk being tin; these types of solders melt at about 430F give or take a little. Many silver bearing braze fillers are silver and copper in various amounts with all other stuff tossed in based on the application but basically have a mix of high to mid melting metals like zinc, copper, nickel. Silver bearing solders use lower melt things like tin, antinomy, lead.

I think for electronics there are a wide variety of solders but I don't know how common it is to use high silver content filler due to the high temps needed. Pure silver melts at 1761F and Sterling melts at 1640F. I don't think it's too often that one wants to subject electronics assemblies to those kind of heats even with the small amount of silver being melted

As for what to do with the SilFos, which is a nice cadmium free braze filler that uses phosphorus instead, I would sell it on CraigsList or ebay. FYI, McMaster-Carr sells SilFos type stuff: $80 gets you 50 20"x1/16" rods.

Thanks for the clarification between what constitutes brazing vs. soldering.

Clearly I don't know what I was thinking when I said what I said about electronic grade solder. The new lead free electronic grade solders are typically mostly tin with some silver and copper and who knows what else to distinguish brand A from brand B.

Nice find, check the current price if silver solder, reckon to get maybe 65% of that, maybe a tad less......

Advertise on ebay in the right section....clean well first.

Don't let 'Stinky Pete' find out about it!

You can do 2 things:

#1 Hold on till I come -I shall take over from you--I will buy you a steak

#2 Make adeal with this English Company:

at cupalloys@hotmail.co.uk

Prices for silver solder 842 which include P&P

No delivery charges - No VAT

Nothing more to add



1.0mm dia x 500
5 rods £ 8.30
10 rods £13.30
25 rods £28.50
50 rods £53.90

1.5mm dia x 500
5 rods £10.10
10 rods £17.90
25 rods £40.30
50 rods £77.40

2.0mm dia x 500
5 rods £22.30
10 rods £41.10
25 rods £98.00


2.5mm dia x 500
5 rods £33.30
10 rods £63.50
25 rods £155.70


Wire 0.5mm x 1m
£ 3.10 per metre

Wire 0.7mm dia x 1m
£ 3.60 per metre

Paste
£ 7.40 per 10gm


Prices for silver solder 840 which include P&P

Wow, good infos, therefore our friend has found a veritable Gold (sorry Silver)Mine!!!

nice find troutdog

We recently bought some Sil fos 15 I don't remember the exact price but I believe it was somewhere around 40 U.S dollars for a one pound tube. We use it for repair and fabrication of copper and brass weldments. We purchased it from our supply house but any welding supplier has it.

My guess is that you have Sil-Fos which is 15% silver-80% copper-5% phosphorous. It is commonly used in the HVAC business. There are other Sil-Fos alloys, but I think this is the only one ductile enough to be rolled into strip form. You might find a retail customer for it on ebay, but with tracability so important these days, I'd sell it for scrap.

Electric motor shops use this material to make lead connections. If you have a local motor shop near by they will likely buy it from you slightly below retail.

Good luck,
Drew

Silver-Copper-Phosphorus Alloys

Material Safety Data Sheet

1. Product And Company Identification

-------------------------------------

Supplier

--------

Lucas Milhaupt, Inc. Handy & Harman of Canada, Ltd.

5656 South

Pennsylvania Ave. 290 Carlingview Drive

Cudahy, WI 53110 Rexdale, ON M9W 5G1

Supplier Emergency Contacts & Phone Number

------------------------------------------

Lucas-Milhaupt, Inc.: 414-769-6000

Handy & Harman of Canada, Limited: 416-675-1860

Manufacturer

------------

Lucas Milhaupt, Inc. Handy & Harman of Canada, Ltd.

5656 South

Pennsylvania Ave. 290 Carlingview Drive

Cudahy, WI 53110 Rexdale, ON M9W 5G1

Manufacturer Emergency Contacts & Phone Number

----------------------------------------------

Lucas-Milhaupt, Inc.: 414-769-6000

Handy & Harman of Canada, Limited: 416-675-1860

Issue Date: 04/30/2007

Product Name: Silver-Copper-Phosphorus Alloys

CAS Number: Not Established

MSDS Number: 77

Product Identification Text

---------------------------

This MSDS is applicable to the following products (with respective product codes): Consil 996 (15-996); Sil-Fos 1, Sil-Fos (71-150); Sil-Fos 15 (67-150);

Sil-Fos 2 (71-020); Sil-Fos 2M (71-017); Sil-Fos 5 (71-050); Sil-Fos 5F (71-

052); Sil-Fos 6 (71-060, 71-061); Sil-Fos 6M (71-062); Sil-Fos 6i (71-063);

Sil-Fos 10 (71-100); Sil-Fos 18 (71-180); Sil Fos 18M (71-181); 21-015 and 24-

863.

2. Composition/Information On Ingredients

-----------------------------------------

Ingredient Name - (CAS Number) - %

----------------------------------

Copper (7440-50-8) 0.2 - 92.6

Phosphorus (7723-14-0) 0.01 - 7.25

Silver (7440-22-4) 0.9 - 99.8

No Data Available...

3. Hazards Identification

-------------------------

Primary Routes(s) Of Entry

--------------------------

Ingestion; inhalation

Eye Hazards

-----------

Eye contact with these products in finely-divided forms may cause irritation, conjunctivitis, ulceration of the cornea, and/or argyria, a permanent blue-gray discoloration of the eyes, skin, mucous membranes, and respiratory tract.

Skin Hazards

------------

Skin contact with these products, particularly in finely-divided forms, may cause irritation, argyria, discoloration, and/or contact dermatitis.

Ingestion Hazards

-----------------

Ingestion of these products in finely-divided forms may cause nausea, vomiting, and gastrointestinal irritation.

Inhalation Hazards

------------------

Inhalation of the components of these products is not known to present a significant risk to health when used according to instructions and with appropriate protective measures (see Section #8). Inhalation of component elements has been reported to cause one or more of the following symptoms and effects upon excessively high or prolonged exposure:

COPPER: Acute exposure may cause respiratory tract irritation, fever, muscle ache, chills, cough, weakness, and a metallic taste. Chronic exposure may damage the liver, kidney, spleen, pancreas, and brain.

PHOSPHORUS: The red form of phosphorus is stable and relatively non-toxic at room temperature. When heated in the presence of air, it is converted to phosphorus pentoxide, which is corrosive and irritating to the eyes, nose, throat, and mucous membranes.

SILVER: Chronic exposure via inhalation may cause argyria.

4. First Aid Measures

---------------------

Eye

---

Flush affected areas with water for at least fifteen minutes. Seek medical assistance if necessary.

Skin

----

Remove contaminated clothing. Wash affected area with large quantities of water for at least five minutes. Seek medical attention if necessary. Launder or dry-clean clothing before reuse.

Ingestion

---------

If subject is conscious, induce vomiting. If unconscious or convulsive, seek immediate medical assistance.

Inhalation

----------

If signs and symptoms of toxicity are observed, remove subject from area, administer oxygen, and seek medical attention. Keep the subject warm and at rest. Perform artificial respiration if breathing has stopped.

Note To Physician

-----------------

None of the components are acutely toxic by ingestion, nor are they absorbed through the skin. Extensive or prolonged skin contact may cause dermatitis and/or argyria.

5. Fire Fighting Measures

-------------------------

Flash Point: N/A °F N/A °C

Autoignition Point: N/A °F N/A °C

Flammability Class: N/A

Lower Explosive Limit: N/A

Upper Explosive Limit: N/A

Fire And Explosion Hazards

--------------------------

In finely-divided form, these products may ignite when exposed to flame or by reaction with incompatible materials (see Section #10). If present in a fire or explosion, they may emit fumes of the constituent metals, metal oxides, and/or phosphorus pentoxide.

Extinguishing Media

-------------------

Use dry chemical. Do not use water.

Fire Fighting Instructions

--------------------------

If fighting a fire in which these products are present, wear a self-contained breathing apparatus with full facepiece operated in pressure-demand or other positive pressure mode.

6. Accidental Release Measures

------------------------------

If a finely-divided form of product is spilled, clean up spillage so as to minimize dispersion of dust. Wet sweeping or vacuuming using HEPA filtration are recommended.

7. Handling And Storage

-----------------------

Handling Precautions

--------------------

No special handling precautions are required.

Storage Precautions

-------------------

Do not store in proximity to incompatible materials (see Section #10).

Work/Hygienic Practices

-----------------------

To minimize ingestion, wash hands and face before eating, drinking, applying cosmetics, or using tobacco.

8. Exposure Controls/Personal Protection

----------------------------------------

Engineering Controls

--------------------

Use appropriate ventilation (e.g., dilution, local exhaust) adequate to maintain concentrations of all components to within their applicable standards.

Eye/Face Protection

-------------------

Wear eye protection adequate to prevent eye contact with finely-divided product and eye injury if products are used with a flame. Plastic-frame spectacles with side shields and filter lenses (shade #3 or #4) are recommended.

Skin Protection

---------------

Wear appropriate protective gloves and clothing to prevent skin injury if these products are used with a flame and/or for prolonged or repeated contact with finely-divided forms of product. Avoid flammable fabrics.

Respiratory Protection

----------------------

If an exposure level exceeds an applicable exposure standard, use a NIOSH-approved respirator having a configuration (type of facepiece, filter media, assigned protection factor, etc.) appropriate to the concentration of the

contaminant(s) generated. For guidance on selection and use of respiratory protection, consult American National Standard Z88.2 (ANSI, New York, NY 10036

USA).

Ingredient(s) - Exposure Limits

-------------------------------

Copper

ACGIH TLVs: 0.2 mg/m3 TWA (fume); 1 mg/m3 TWA (dusts and mists)

OSHA PELs: 0.1 mg/m3 TWA (fume); 1 mg/m3 TWA (dusts and mists)

Phosphorus

No applicable ACGIH TLV(s) No applicable OSHA PEL(s)

Silver

ACGIH TLV: 0.1 mg/m3 TWA (metal) OSHA PEL: 0.01 mg/m3 TWA

9. Physical And Chemical Properties

-----------------------------------

Appearance

----------

Odorless light-copper metals in form of wire, rod, strip, powder, tape, grain, or preformed shapes.

Chemical Type: Mixture

Physical State: Solid

Melting Point: >1190 °F >645 °C

Specific Gravity: 7.8 - 10.5

Percent Volatiles: Not Applicable (N/A)

Vapor Pressure: N/A

Vapor Density: N/A

pH Factor: N/A

Solubility: Insoluble

10. Stability And Reactivity

----------------------------

Stability: stable

Hazardous Polymerization: will not occur

Conditions To Avoid (Stability)

-------------------------------

Silver and copper can form unstable acetylides if in contact with acetylene gas.

Incompatible Materials

----------------------

Strong oxidizers; ammonia; azides; nitric acid; ethylene imine; chlorine trifluoride; sulfuric acid; inorganic and organic peroxides; peroxyformic acid; oxalic acid; tartaric acid; 1-bromo-2-propyne; permonosulfuric acid; bromates, chlorates, and iodates of alkali and alkali earth metals; alkaline hydroxides.

Hazardous Decomposition Products

--------------------------------

Heating to elevated temperatures may liberate metal/metal oxide fumes and/or phosphorus pentoxide.

11. Toxicological Information

-----------------------------

Chronic/Carcinogenicity

-----------------------

The products contain no chemicals classified as potential or demonstrated carcinogens by IARC, NTP, or OSHA.

Conditions Aggravated By Overexposure

-------------------------------------

Pre-existing pulmonary diseases (e.g., bronchitis, asthma) may be aggravated by inhalation overexposure, particularly as fume. Chronic overexposure by inhalation and/or ingestion may aggravate pre-existing diseases of the liver, kidneys, gastrointestinal system, and nervous system.

Ingredient(s) - Toxicological Data

----------------------------------

Copper

LD50: No data available LC50: No data available

Phosphorus

LD50: >15,000 mg/kg (oral/rat) LC50: 4,300 mg/m3 for 1 hr (rat)

Silver

LD50: >2000 mg/kg (oral/rat) LC50: No data available

12. Ecological Information

--------------------------

In their intended manner of use, these products should not be released into the environment, and adverse effects on ecosystems are not anticipated under recommended conditions of use, storage, and disposal.

13. Disposal Considerations

---------------------------

Dispose of unused or unusable product in accordance with applicable Federal, State/Provincial, and local regulations.

14. Transport Information

-------------------------

These products are not Hazardous Substances or Dangerous Goods per USDOT, TDG (Canada), IATA, or IMO regulations.

15. Regulatory Information

--------------------------

SARA Hazard Classes

-------------------

Acute Health Hazard; Chronic Health Hazard

Ingredient(s) - U.S. Regulatory Information

-------------------------------------------

Copper

SARA Title III - Section 313 Form "R"/TRI Reportable Chemical

Phosphorus

SARA Title III - Section 313 Form "R"/TRI Reportable Chemical

Silver

SARA Title III - Section 313 Form "R"/TRI Reportable Chemical

Canadian Regulatory Information

-------------------------------

WHMIS Class(es) and Division(s): none applicable

Components on Ingredients Disclosure List:

1. Copper, elemental (CASRN 7440-50-8)

2. Phosphorus (CASRN 7723-14-0)

3. Silver, elemental (CASRN 7440-22-4)

16. Other Information

---------------------

Revision/Preparer Information

-----------------------------

This MSDS Supersedes A Previous MSDS Dated: 04/29/2004

Disclaimer

----------

Although reasonable care has been taken in the preparation of this document,

we extend no warranties and make no representations as to the accuracy or completeness of the information contained therein, and assume no responsibility regarding the suitability of this information for the user's intended purposes or for the consequences of its use. Each individual should make a determination as to the suitability of the information for their particular purpose(s).

Lucas Milhaupt, Inc. Handy & Harman of Canada, Ltd.

Hi Joey Silfos /ASilver solder is used mainly in the HVAC and Plumbing industries for braising copper pipe. I would offer ring around your major plumbing and HVAC installers and see what you can get. I think $800.00 is a bit optomistic but then I havent bought any for years

Thanks all,, I'll probably put it on ebay soon.