No, no no... It's common sense which is repelled by a magnet.
Del

His tin foil hat is magnetic?

Just think of the perpetual motion implications. Water in front, magnets in back, car goes forward. Move water to back, car stops.

Damned if I know what would happen in the rain.

Maybe that's why hovercraft have magnets in the hem of their skirts.
Del

all you need is a pair of rapidly rotating mirrors to split the magnetic force into negative energy.

All you need is a nice strong magnet and a kitchen sink to see the effects of a magnet held near a trickle of water. In my experience, water is repelled from a magnet held near a little stream of water falling from a faucet.

"Negative energy"....That would be a mass less void, without a detectable presence and presenting no appearance of existence. Useful for driving horses wild.

I wonder if you put a meter across the stream, you might find a leakage voltage?

in earlier days someone has tried to generate electricity using earth's magnetism as magnetic poles and river thames as conductor and didn't find any appreciable voltage

So if you flip the magnet over so the poles are opposite you attract water?

Actually, try it with just your finger...

Milo

you CAN use magnets to dehumidify... just freeze them first!

I tried that but noticed magnets do not collect frost as much as a near equal mass in the same environment that is not a magnet. I'll take pictures.

Ok, Magnets repel water. Clear enough?

Please show me an example of any magnet available to the average homeowner (NOT superconducting, unless you can sell me a verified room-temperature superconducting magnet for under $1000), repelling water.

A fine stream of falling water will easily be deflected (always attracted, if I recall correctly), by a rather small static electric field, so the repulsion should be fairly easy to show. If the stream is not broken into droplets, it would be possible to send an electric current through the stream, and that current would be deflected, but it would be a deflection perpendicular to the magnetic field, not an attraction nor a repulsion.

I DID try it in my kitchen with a hard drive magnet today! I could observe NO deflection. I HAVE observed (and demonstrated to classes) static attraction of water dozens, if not hundreds, of times.

Me too. The magnets in a hard drive are strong, but they don't demo water changes like those with one pole of the magnet on one side of the magnet and the opposit on the back side of the magnet. jkmagnetics.com and other suppliers sell lots of inexpensive powerful magnets on the cheap. I have some that will produce a 1/4 inch depression in a pool of water when placed in the bottom of a glass bowl with water over the top. I haven't tried this with mercury yet but I think it will make a better photo-demo of diamagnetics.

also see:utube search "Magnets and Water"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FvWtEdY4sE

Is this distilled water? or tap water (town or well) or 'de-ionized' water commonly sold as 'battery water'?

Just asking as atmospheric water could be more like distilled water than the others.

Distilled water.

If that is a 1/4 inch diameter depression a fraction to a few wavelengths of light deep, then it's no big deal. If that is a depression of any diameter and 1/4 inch deep, then I gotta see it!

Mercury may or may not make an effect more obvious, but its an atom, not a bipolar molecule, so it would have nothing to do with water's supposed magnetic properties. About the only thing that water and mercury have in common is that they are liquids at room temperature!

WALOOB.

Try switching to decaf.

Pseudoscience.

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/magscams.html

Milo

Maybe you were thinking of static electricity, not magnetism:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhWQ-r1LYXY

No, It was more in the line of

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FvWtEdY4sE

which at utube is a search for "magnets and water"

I did view a couple of the youtube videos. I'm open-minded, but highly skeptical of the Aussi infomercial, especially when I see an apparatus that probably cost $10 to produce being sold for hundreds of dollars! Obviously I don't know all the details on what exactly is inside the device, but...

The reflection of the light in the ceiling is effectively a highly magnified view of the light position, so an extremely tiny force on the water would produce a visible effect. It did appear authentic - I'll try to reproduce the effect myself, soon. I have LOTS of magnets available...

it's all starting to make sense to me now

that's why we have water softeners

the softener takes the chemicals out that are aquired when the water is in the ground,mainly iron particles. And that's why magnets repell water.

ok, gotta get back to Willie Wonka and his oompa loompas

Stub

I saw an explanation of this at

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Magnetism&oldid=384616769

Remind me not to drink the water in California.

Actually considering Yreka is basically Oregon, the question seems consistent.

Water is repelled from a magnet, so I would expect humidity to be repelled also

As others have said this is incorrect and will not work.

Perhaps you would have better luck removing the excess moisture from the air using a baffle (or similar) system covered in sponges or paper towels. As the air (drawin in by the fan) hits the baffles on its way in and/or out of the swamp cooler some of the moisture will be absorbed, reducing the overall humidity of the outgoing air.

Somewhere to start anyway using easy-to-obtain household products, just be careful that the excess moisture doesn't end up in your fan electrics creating a potential electrocution hazard.

First, as several others have said (often in unkind words), water is NOT repelled (nor attracted) by a magnet. I just double-checked, in case something had changed: no effect whatsoever.

Second, I've never spent any time in Yreka, but I have driven through a number of times, usually in the summer, when the temperature was not too far from 81°F. Perhaps I've been lucky, but I have the impression (no measurements involved), that the humidity was WAY lower than 84%. I'm wondering whether you may be doing something wrong while measuring your wet and dry bulb temperatures.

Third: If your daytime temperature is in the low 80s, then your nighttime temperature is most likely in the 50s. Run your fan without water at night, close up during the day, and you should be able to keep the house or building cool pretty much all day. If not, then insulate!

first of all a swamp cooler will only work properly in a dry hot area like desert conditions ( low humidity) as the cooling effect is from the speed of evapoation by passing the air over a water soaked batt ,If the humdity is high this will cause less cooling and as you say raise the hmidity in your building ( remember you must exhaust the same amount of air as you bring in or your humdity will also rise ) the best way to keep your hmidity down is to get a dehumidifer that works by collecting the moisture from the air and letting you dump the collected water . If your humidity is the high in the outside ambient air then the swamp cooler will not work properly . Possibly you could use a small room or container that could handle a large dehumidifier pryer to the in take of your swamp cooler ? A Lot of work but it could be done ! Jerry

kindly provide just one example of water being repelled by a magnet.

The water molecule is a dipole- which means it has a north & south pole- this is how a microwave oven heats as a rotating magnetic field moves the water molecules, which movement causes heat thru friction as the other atoms & molecules present resistance.

Hmmm- I think you are confusing the issue- obviously there is a varying electro-magnetic field- I simply stated the obvious magnetic effect on a water molecule with magnetic dipole - voltage variation?-in any microwave oven I have seen & worked on- no such thing!. If there was voltage variation- one would expect the output power to vary as against the input power as against the load as against the shield presented by the Faraday cage & measured simply at the cage interface with a radiation tester(obviously I am using a set power level!)- as in normal cooking- unless you are referring to sensor level cooking!. To educate yourself on microwave cooking may I suggest you use Wiki?- there is a comprehensive coverage.

You are correct in saying that the varying voltage is the microwave voltage itself - no magnetic rotation required.

But you've got the wavelength all wrong. From Wikipedia: "A microwave oven works by passing non-ionizing microwave radiation, usually at a frequency of 2.45 gigahertz (GHz)—a wavelength of 122 millimetres (4.80 in)—through the food."

I've known the 2.45GHz frequency since the early '60's, and λ=c/f=3.00E8(m/s)/2.45E9(1/s)=0.122m or 122mm, so the values give in Wikipedia are correct.

There do exist industrial microwave ovens that work at other frequencies/wavelengths, but I believe all home microwave ovens use the same frequency pf 2.45 GHz.

The only reason you can see inside most microwave ovens while they are operating is that the holes in the perforated metal door panel are very small compared to the wavelength, so virtually no microwave energy can pass through the holes. If microwaves had wavelengths in the micrometer range, they would pass through those holes and damage people and other things outside the oven.

Thanks for the details on the wave length of microwave ovens. I did not check the frequency or the wave length they worked on. I simply detailed the theory behind the heating of the water by the electromagnetic wave energy.

thanks

Thank you for your input-are you saying that the north & south poles in water molecules are non magnetic to magnetic attraction as we know it, but are attractive to electric fields?-only?- if true this has vast implications for the world, universe, & almost everything. Now you are also saying that the microwaves(almost 5"!) vary in electric fields?. you have said that the oscillator varies the voltage- well the wave length is set - the frequency is set- are you saying that the wavelength of almost 5" somehow turns the molecule of water which is truly miniscule?- oh well - if all else fails- can always turn to theory- or are you saying that every oscillation has to start from 0 to reach max then repeats & this is what you call voltage variation?. How the f====hell would anybody measure this?- unless thru results- or an extremely fast cro!. Cheers from someone who really wants to know!.

4 Microwave frequency measurement

Well, maybe you should have a look at the reply #58 on this topic(forum). Click on the link and read! You will have your answer for how to measure electromagnetic waves frequency etc.

Before starting to rant and deduct conclusions on an issue you seem to be ignorant about, and using words like f.... invoking Hell... think and learn by doing some research!

I can't see why you got so excited about something you need to go back to school and refresh: Electromagnetic waves and Oscillations are dealt with as of that level somwhere..(?). Yes, The voltage is varying up and down as you said from 0 to a max and then back to 0 (and depending on how much you know...) to - the max reach before (Look at a sinusoid shape wave that you should have been familiar with in you 2ndary school ...), the voltage varies in time... the current also... and this generates a magnetic field at right angle to the propagation direction of the electromagnetic wave...

Nevertheless, Even if the water molecules have some affinity to a magnetic field, it seems to be very very very weak and maybe indiscernible for us common humans (Maybe some very advanced laboratory equipment could detect the influence, but I do not have any reference (reputable, that is) for such ...). But Electric Fields (Voltage fields), have been found to exercise influence on the water molecules. The best proof is the microwave ovens where you can heat a glass of water to prove it. Even if the microwave has a magnetic component, magnetic fields by themselves have not been found to attract water or to polarise the water molecules etc.

By the way, you make vast conclusions about the influence on the Universe if water was not attracted by a magnetic field! On What do you base your deduction if you do not even know how an electromagnetic wave is made or works or anything related for that matter?

I can't see why you got so excited either. He said he really wanted to know, so I told him. Nuff said, "point/s made", I would have thought.

Maybe you are right.

You are correct, but I can't find any evidence of a material capable of shielding an electric field, as opposed to electro-magnetic waves, wich can relatively easy be shielded.

Yahlasit

The faraday cage was mentioned before and that is why I kept to it. In a sense, the grid in front of the oven window bounces back the EM waves because of their small apertures in relation to the wave length used.

You are correct, the electric field by itself will be felt across if applied as a voltage field. But then we are talking about electromagnetic waves...

Swamp coolers only work in very dry climates. Up where you live, where the evenings are fairly cool, I think you could lose the swamp cooler and just install a dehumidifier. Combined with a few ceiling fans, you should be fine.

I'm not gonna touch the magnets repelling water statement.

It seems that water has some magnetic dipolar properties. I once read about those dipoles and the snow flakes shapes. Anyways, here is a link: magnetic water

NO critical thinking in that link.

Milo

Far from me to start a controversy, I did some magnetics research for switching power supplies, and I can accept that water can be paramagnetic. How much? Idonnow! But those guys who publish an article in Nature have done some experiments and, if you pay, you can read the whole article. Here is the abstract: abstract

What good came out of it? Idonnow!

Is it good to drink this kind of water for my prostate? Idonnow!

So why am I throwing those links?.....R..r...Idonnow!

I love you, man! Pax nobiscum!

Lol.

Thanks for saving my eyes from all that.

I did start to read it but knew that I could stop when I came to this:

"we make use of gravitational and magnetically induced buoyancy forces in the host paramagnetic atmosphere (pressurized air or oxygen), rather than simply the diamagnetic force on the levitating object, to balance the gravitational force."

I'll just add my vote! Cheers.

Splarf :D

Thanks for that.

Hows the dancing over the icelandic abyss going? Must be bothersome with all that volcanic ash and stuff. Your volcano eruption cancelled my last trip to Germany...

I'm dancing over just a "big honkin dark abyss," but I'm lovin' it all the same.

@LYNLYN- yes, strionging together a bunch of polysyllables will make most of our eyes glaze over...

Milo

I was reading your post and unconsciously read "Debbie Shimadry is a qualified pain in the narse".

Some of the links posted for evidentiary support are good but many are too much to get into. Thanks for doing the research for us.

and also makes julienne fries!

You did notice they seemed to mix up ferromagnetic and paramagnetic. Also, ferromagnetic materials like many rocks can be magnetized as liquids and hold that polar directionality only once they solidify. Thus magnetized water would hold that magnetic directionality only if flash frozen in that strong field. As a liquid it would just re-orient upon reduction of the field.

Lots of scientific words, VERY little science! Try the wand on snake oil...

I'm with Milo and RCE.

I'm with you. I accept nothing until I have checked it out for myself. Accept no hearsay. I'm looking for someone who has gone past me to find the answers to questions that I have not found an answer to. In this way, I'm looking for someone who has done an experiment that I'm in the process of assembling. It is an understanding of the field strength of magnets and the effects it has on the humidity in air movement so that I can construct a math model and Excel spread sheets based on the resulting model in real time. The glib format I choose for my opener reflects the target beneficiaries that would be those who dwell in arid countries primarily. The stifling heat is a human health hazard and I thought I would try this method of developing this to the product level. I have no interest in this for monetary gain but see its potential for benefit.

This is just an advertizing site for their product. It cannot be considered a scientific prouf or valid information to the availability of magnetized water.

in any case, if you need to put a very powerful magnet for such a long time to obtain (what is claimed...) a magnetized water, how can such a phenomena be useful to attract the humidity from the air in any significant quantity and in a short enough cycle to be usefull for dehumidifying the amount of air required per a reasonable unit of time ...?! In reply to the OP question.

Everybody knows that theories are only made after something has been observed- the greatest discoveries in history were made by people thinking outside the accepted- yes some concepts put forward are wrong- but even scientists are willing to reject the last theory for the later theory if the latter works better!. So dyed-in-the wool proponents of an older theory really need to accept that what they believe as fact could be wrong- but no-one will ever know unless somebody experiments.!. Kind regards.

"if the latter works better"

No not really. Perhaps if the latter is supported by repeatable results and fully defined inputs and process protocols.

E.g. "cold fusion" - claimed - yes. repeatable - not yet. because "How" and "Why" - not sure. "proved" - no.

It's possible that water is magnetic, in certain conditions, as the atoms are, in certain conditions. It could be a matter of a sufficiently intense field.

But you need to get to the point of surety that no other extraneous influences are producing the 'observable effect' - or proof that it is magnetism, not EMR, not a voltage, not an aerodynamic phenomena, not the WD40 they got washed in, not static, not, not ....

And to do that, it is helpful to have some knowledge of each 'possible' other discipline/field/dynamic/skill set.

All 'discoveries' are much assisted by this input of outside knowledge process of others throwing in opinions on what else it might be and demanding suggesting it 'eliminated' from cause.

For instance it is amazing how literally thousands of 'cooking inventions' come to nothing because the 'perceived need/problem' is fulfilled/solved, when the inventor's efforts in perfecting - teach him/her 'how cooking actually works'.

Or try not to get in a knot over a essential part of the development/proof process.

The OP is correct.

Water (Pure) is diamagnetic and hence is repelled by magnet.

However the magnetic susceptibility of water is very low (if I remember it is of the order of 10^-5. And that makes the magnetic field required to move it appreciably a bit too large (and that then translates to the requirement of energy)

it is of the order of 10⁷T/m² for water and that makes the exercise a bit too inefficient and also there is the hazards included in trying to contain the field.

Any one interested may check CRC handbook of Physics and Chemistry for exact values (Volume susceptibility 0.91x10^-6) or study diamagnetism.

UD15

I guess you've never seen a rusty magnet, I've had to buff clean some of them or dispose off for this and other reasons (weakened).

If you are in a moist-saturated weather, the only choice you have for evaporating your cooler's water is heating it, but that will be even less unpleasant !.

You need to change to an air conditioner, instead of an evaporative cooler.

Yahlasit

...back to the original question: "how to" reduce humidity?

• Magnet = NO.

• Hygroscopic materials = YES.

...they absorb water vapor (humidity) from the air, which you subsequently "drive-out" by heating (think solar here).

That could become pretty expensive in a place where they regularly get Fog.

...which expensive? (a) buying magnets that don't work, or (b) alternative heating source to solar?

...last I heard, trees and lumber still grow on mountain tops.

True, but burning trees as a energy source is only really legal anymore in a few backward locations, i.e. barren deserts, areas of deep snow cover, and a few 3rd world countries, though even most 3rd world countries have outlawed it (even if they can not enforce it in the marxist rebel held zones).

Who you calling backward? OHIO? Pennsylvania?

I have heated with wood, and I know many people that do.

Like my neighbors.

Note, I also heated with wood when I lived in Georgia, USA but I chose not to add it to my initial response for fear of helping make your point...

Milo "Ohio isn't a 3rd world country, most days..."

"...burning trees as a energy source is only really legal anymore..."

what the heck are you talking about?? that is simply not true.

Even in California (where I live), burning wood as a heat source is only prohibited where pollution is a problem, meaning down in the valleys and in areas of dense population. I get a large portion of my heat by burning wood, and at least one of my neighbors has no other source of heat besides wood. Cutting and splitting wood is probably the most important activity keeping me fit!

If I did not cut and use all the fallen trees for firewood, the fire danger would be increasing even more than it is, and the smoke produced when it did burn would be much worse that that of my fireplace! It would most likely occur during the summer, when there is little wind (other than that created by the fire) and no rain to disperse and settle the ashes. Add to that all the plastics of burning houses etc., and you really have a bad situation!

All wood that grows and dies MUST be used for constructive purposes, as fuel, otherwise disposed of, or decompose. I prefer to have the fuel portion of that equation used gradually to heat my house to just warm, rather than all at once to ashes. Allowing the wood to decompose takes many decades for larger logs, and the result still returns the CO2 to the atmosphere; meanwhile, the probability of adding fuel to a wildfire is high. I prefer to use decomposition only for those parts that will provide mulch within a year or two.

Burning wood in fireplaces and such in very rural areas, areas in the SNOW, very desolate areas like the deserts, or well economically depressed areas is still common. But using wood for a fuel source for energy for other than residential heating is not. I suspect that you guys may have missed the part about the snow, and the implication by saying it was for energy generation that the energy was for recovery of desicants, in there and just read 3rd world. And well I would not fault Georgia over Ohio, the economy in the rust belt has never been all that good to look down on Georgia and in current circumstance may be substantially worse than Georgia.

BTW in California burning firewood is also prohibitted in areas prone to wild fires and along nearly all of the coast, unless grandfathered in with a fireplace or stove installed prior to regulation, and there are allowed burn day restrictions, it is not just about smog (though some people still do it and there is no real enforcement in some areas). Even then I don't know of anywhere they burn wood for energy, outside of residential heating and maybe a few waste to energy plant (which actually process the waste typically gasifying it), which is the implication of the discussion that they would recover the dessicants by using wood burning heat.

okay... I get you now.

Hey, I'm still trying to figure out your stomach acid lining ecosystem comments with the magic field separating the bad water many posts above.

I've lived in both Georgia and Ohio. I've been president of friends of the library in both.

In Ohio, our library had books on subjects other than civil war geneaology. In Georgia, ehhh, not so much.

I've had more dealings with your SCAQMD than I care to admit.

I just got a mailing form them last friday - automatic increase in Regulation III fees based on Consumer Price Index.

Thanks for the further explanation.

Milo

The secret is in the application of good magic fields, instead of the potential for bad magic fields. Bad magic fields would have the reverse effect and increase the acidity, though the ends might be the same but instead of natural selection through bacterial infection, it might be due to excessive mucosal erosion of the esophygeal and stomach lining leading to hemorrhaging and perforations.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!

milo

Will you please tell us which magnetic fields are 'good', and which are 'bad'. How do you measure the level of goodness and/or badness?

You convey the impression that acidic water is bad, and that it is desirable for water to have a pH higher than 7. Why? Virtually every restaurant (at least in the USA) has lemons available for adding to your drinking water. Lemons are clearly acidic! Can you name any basic (pH higher than 7) food item that you would willingly add to your drinking water? I'm NOT talking about foods that raise the pH of the urine, but rather foods that have a pH above 7. There has to be a natural reason that acidic (within reasonable limits) foods taste good and basic foods taste bad. Or is it only my taste buds that convey that message?

Magic fields, not necessarily magnetic, but definitely magic.

what about

things are different once you cross the grapevine, the ban on open burning of ag waste has put several co-gens back on line

there is not a ban on wood stoves in areas prone to wild fires [spark screens are required]

but there are restrictions on open burning in the dry months [ I have a burn permit & will start burning brush piles any day now]

you are correct that using wood heat to recover dissicants would be an unusual practice.

My predictions offered on this thread are proven to be correct. Your efforts to support your contra-opinions are unsupported opinion. Since you gave me nothing, work or proofs you get nothing back. I did my work and you did not. So why should you be enlightened in the dark place that is your mind? Good bye and may the crudity of your lackluster opinions keep you entertained where you are.

Thank you

Who the hell are you talking to?

It's Crudité... as in Joe Dirté