Broken Wood Screw

Easyout (TM).

GA Del. I would just add, that if the screw doesn't have to be in that exact location, he can drill out and plug the hole, leaving the existing screw in place and simply put a new screw right alongside the old.

Oh, just to reiterate, drill a pilot hole before installing new screw.

Covering several replies. Yes, too small for an Easy Out. On standard bolts, I've had zero luck with these--if the bolt was broken by torque (the case with most of my bolt problems), the Easy-Out just won't work.

It may be buried too far to get a soldering gun on it.

Needs to be in the same location. It is the brace between the seat and back of an old swivel chair(very old! I got it used circa 1959.) The wood is probably oak or maybe maple.

Probably will first try my Foredom flexible shaft machine (similar to Dremel) and a carbide bit to attempt to cut a screwdriver slot; if I'm extremely lucky it will back out. I've also considered using a left-handed drill bit (if I can find one small enough.)

Thanks for the ideas.

Thanks for the update. Easyout removers are an oxymoron if there ever was one. I've got several broken ones.

The only other thing I can think of is drilling out the entire center of the screw, pick out the threads with a little pick of some sort, and replacing with a slightly larger screw. Or, if you can pick out the screw threads from the wood, the same size screw. I've managed to do this with a metal bolt, leaving the female threads intact. Haven't tried it with wood.

Last Thursday, at work I sheared a bolt securing an exhaust pipe to exhaust manifold on a stationary running engine. I had given the thread a good dose of WD40, but, alas..........to no avail..........I sheared the bolt.

I picked up a set of easyouts...........and thought "What are you doing stupid!!"

Anyhow,..............it actually worked.........Why??????............it is still a mystery to me. I am now in a quandry........I don't know whether to frame it.........or.........send it back to the manufacturer and ask for an explanation as to why it did not break!!!!!

That's a rare occasion. Sounds like time for a party!

I usually break the easyoff off in the hole. I make sure it's really jammed in there first, well connected to the broken bolt, so getting it out is impossible. After that, I start breaking drill bits off on the easyoff, this is usually accompanied by flying tools and bloody knuckles. I've spent days on these projects...............and yup, it's usually on an exhaust system.

You got lucky.

Yup, old chair, that's exactly the situation I was in.
It was an old Carver chair that that me n Mrs Cat bought from a second hand shop when were were penniless and first hitched so it had sentimental value and I wanted to restore it.
I'd started the job about 30 years ago and I did finally finish it, it just needs Mrs Cat to do a new tapestry seat now.
Del

If you have a soldering iron, you may be able to transfer enough heat into the screw to char the wood. Then you might be able to dig it out.

They also make hollow drill bits. I doubt that a common cork borer would work here.

Or, drill all around it with a 3mm drill...................................................

You could try a copper tube inserted into the hole until it contacts the broken screw,then with an insulated (except the end) metal rod inserted into this tube, apply a high DC current to the tube and rod, so as to weld the rod to the screw shank, allowing the screw to be backed out.....or not.

If you the left-hand drill doesn't make the screw back out of the hole, drill the rest of the hole with a left-handed drill bit appropriately sized for the eazy-out that you would use for that size screw. I usually try to make my first attempt to drill with this size drill bit.

Also, there are a variety of extractor styles out on the market. I find the ones with a shoulder on them after the cutter grooves to be the ones that work most successfully for me (looks similar to a shoulder bolt) for screws and machine screws. If one is available with the diameter of the shoulder about the size of the hole in the wood it would probably do the least damage to the wood.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#easy-out-extractors/=asyu5p

I most often use the "Shallow-Grip Screw Extractors" or the "Any-Direction Heavy Duty Extractors" for this type of project.

Good Luck, old salt

hi there: - as lynlynch suggested - some heat applied will probably set it free - i've found a small micro-torch - small flame for short amount of time, say 4 or 5 seconds will break the bond between the wood and the screw. if you have propared the screw with a dremel cut slot and have your screwdriver ready you will get it out. fast timing is the essence here.

If the screw is somewhat small, I do not believe a few servings of a high potency acid will harm the wood.................Please be careful of burns and inhalation of fumes.

As the acid is unspecified; hydrochloric might work if the screw is steel.

Do NOT try NITRIC acid on wood

34.5 -- What does nitric acid do to wood? Completely break it down? You've got me curious now......

Ed Weldon

Jeopardy

Chemistry for $1000.00

Answer = "cellulose nitrate"

_{(I'm assuming you will figure out why my answer is kinda obscure) If not PM me.}

34.5 -- Thanks for the heads up..... or heads down as the case may be....

Does sound like an interesting experiment. I've got this aluminum plate welding table. Put a gram size pile of sawdust out in the middle and add a couple of drops of nitric acid and see what we get. I think I'll put on my welding mask and gloves and hide down low next to the table top and watch through the filter window........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrocellulose This is instructive.

I suspect my suggestion could be a bit dangerous to try for removing a steel screw from wood. I can visualize a variety of nasty possible accident scenarios starting with the wood spontaneously catching fire down in the hole or a drill bit with attached electric drill being launched out of the hole with suprising force.

Bad Ed!! Don't try this at home.............

Lehman - What's the size of the screw and what metal is it made out of? If steel, is it hardened like sheetrock and other specialized screws or is it a conventional wood screw configuration? If you can match the screw thread diameter with the ID of some thin wall steel tube like a piece of automotive brake line you're in luck. Drill the hole in the wood to the OD of the steel tube down to the top of the broken screw.

Then cut the steel to be to a length about 3/4" longer than the hole you just drilled. Put the tube in the hole all the way down to the broken screw. It will act like a drill jig and keep a drill centered while cutting. Now take a drill the will just slide into the tube and drill out the broken piece. Hold the part sticking up with some pliers to keep it from spinning while you're drilling. Better if you use a left hand drill for this. If it starts turning the broken end it will just push the steel tube up until it clears the threaded part of the wood. Then you should be able to pull it out wit a good magnet or needle nose pliers. I have a pile of small left hand drills and I'll be glad to stick one in a first class envelope to you gratis if you send me a mailing address via Yahoo messaging.

If the broken screw is hardened steel then use a plastic tube, maybe a drinking straw or coffee stirrer in the hole to feed a few drops of nitric acid that will disolve steel. You can neutralize it afterwards with baking soda solution. While the acid is disolving the steel (may take hours) use a thin aluminum rod or wire to probe the depth of metal disolved. Nitric acid doesn't affect aluminum. This is the basis of the old machinist's trick for getting broken taps out of aluminum workpieces.

You could use a carbide tipped drill on a hardened screw but might do more damage at the bottom of the hole than you want.

Ed Weldon

Haven't checked the size of the screw yet--maybe this afternoon. It may be a #12. It's Steel, but won't be hardened since it is so old--standard flathead wood screw.

The tubing as a guide is a good idea that never occurred to me--I have had trouble keeping drills "on target." But the hole is already somewhat "buggered out" (the spell check may choke on that!), so the sleeve/guide may not work.

I haven't checked locally to see if left handed drill bits are available.

Update: the screw is a #10. It is broken off in the threaded area--smaller size, and roughly 1/4" below the surface.

Just so I am sure that you know what a hole cutter is.

It is taking me longer to keep replying here than to do it my self. Just buy a complete set of them and Bob's part of the extended family.

Is this a plug cutter to you ronseto? Great, we are in agreement then. No need to replicate again, Ky.

I say Plug cutter, you say Hole saw.

Well a plug cutter cuts plugs that are then snapped off and used to plug holes, and the best ones are tapered so that the fit is really snug. Hole saws saw holes, the outside dia is the important thing there.

Plug cutters cutting a 5mm plug may be as wide as 12mm

Jim

Yes, this is what I call a hole saw or hole cutter. However, as far as I am aware, these are relatively large sizes. If I tackle it that way, I would need one much smaller--to fit over a #10 screw, although it is a bit smaller where broken off, perhaps 1/8" ID hole saw. This size would probably have to have homemade cutting teeth in a suitable diameter tubing.

I was confused earlier about the workability of a plug cutter.

So..

'find a thinwalled tube that just fits over your screwshank, and use a file to serrate the edge like a saw; I guess in an anticlockwise-cutting way would optimise your chances of extraction. Poke the tube down the hole and peck-drill away.'

Car aerials are a good source of various slightly different diameters, but you have to go carefully, some are really thin, and chromed brass.

Jim

KY..................I told you that hole (saw was)¹ too big

1.........and.............how about that

Oh well!!

Better luck next time.

This is what happens when you get so many good ideas and decide to try the lot

If you look closely you can still see the screw in the centre of the hole!!!

If it's in far enough it's indecent

If it goes on forever it is indefinitley.

If it's in far enough, it's in decent.

No! A hole saw has a teist drill in the center. A plug cutter has no center drill. It is used to make plugs for plugging holes to cover screw heads.

A hole saw has a twist drill in the center. A plug cutter has no center drill.

For my information, enlightenment, education, etc, what do you call it when the hole maker is very small; in the case I had, about 3/16" OD? I had to saw out the annular space around the broken screw--I was not cutting plugs, but could have no center drill.

One only - generally - uses a center drill in a hole saw when sawing 'free hand'. If used in a drill or mill, the center drill is usually removed - unless one wants the 'washer' that results. However some 'hobby' level wood dedicated hole saws are driven by the center drill, so removing it, is not and option.

I did it with a set of 6 chairs. They had been repaired prior with screws and not dowels. The core was rotten so I used a small diameter 10mm whatsthename and killed 2 flies with one hit. Nice spot for a fresh dowel.

Good to hear about your success, Ky.

Hi Lehman57,

Any chance you took pictures of the process? Can we see what you were working on and how it turned out? Pretty please....?

Nope, no photos. It was on part of the back of a wood office swivel chair that I bought used circa 1960 and still use every day. I wonder how old it really is. It had been repaired before--probably a couple of times! I've gone thru a couple sets of casters!

But I do have some photos of installing a gas gage and repacking the booster hose reel gland of my 1925 fire engine!

post away, then...

The one better way i found to remove broken wood screw Tip is using plug cutter Bit to make a hole around the broken Tip of a screw and Remove it completely. Always remember to buy quality wood screws from the best companies like "Mutualscrew and Supply". Hope this is helpful for you guys.

Hello and welcome to the forum gurubunny.

Your advice is spot on, Lehman57 did in fact use a home-made hole saw, similar to a plug cutter, but with thinner walls, to cut round the articles to remove them.

He did this after I posted exactly that as a solution, then posted it as his own idea, and no 'Good Answer' for me, ...not yet anyway.;)

cnc jim

Ok, good answer. It's been so long that I don't remember the sequence of the suggestion and the doing it. But I do have the minor excuse of reading decades ago that a similar technique had been used in metals where an aluminum part had become "welded" in a steel part due to the interaction of the two.

Hi.

Another way is find a thinwalled tube that just fits over your screwshank, and use a file to serrate the edge like a saw; I guess in an anticlockwise-cutting way would optimise your chances of extraction. Poke the tube down the hole and peck-drill away.

You would need to fill before putting the new one in.

Jim

Try a plug cutter. After the plug is cut and removed, bore the hole left to a common dowel size. Glue or epoxy the dowel in the hole; redrill for a new wood screw.

So you guys call it a plug cutter. Well if it works the same as my hole cutter all is good and repeating will not hurt.

Its the fastest way I know and for timber furniture the way to go, even if you can get the screws out in one go. You need a fresh start and a dowel does the trick, Ky.

If you have clear access to broken screw you may try a left hand drill bit. Sometimes with enough pressure it will bite in enough to revrse the screw out. Works in metal with broken studs sometimes. Make sure you are well centered. If you can drill a pilot hole in the screw there is a better chance of staying centered and biting hard enough with the left hand drill to back it out. I assume going all the way through is out of the question.

Any good wood working magazine has adds for screw extractors made especially for wood. They are hollow tubes with saw teeth on the end. eagle american is one that comes to mind.

oilcan13

I didn't realise my idea was already commercially available.

Jim

Are wood screw extractors relatively new on the market? They are not in the only woodworking tools catalog I have on hand--circa 2003.

Interesting. I have a similar set from Sears, only the 2 ends are combined in one end. I have used them only once, the smallest size, and promptly broke it off when the extractor part gripped the stuck bolt. Will be trying the left hand drill portion on this stuck wood screw.

I trust that you understand that you not allowed to use any sort of power tool under such circumstances..............only hand tools.....

Those are cute, best design and simplicity I've seen. GA

If I had such a problem:-

1) I would take a piece of copper tube that will just fit around the screw. Widen the hole slightly to allow the tube to make good contact with the screw.

2) Take a similar quality screw (for a really good weld, the steels should be similar), remove the head, wrap the sides with Teflon tape to stop it contacting the copper tube.

3) Push screw down (head end first) till it makes good contact with the screw in the wood.

4) Attach a welder and give a good current burst to weld the two screws together, douse with water to cool. A helper may be good at this point!

Another possible for 4)

4a) Take a stick welder and just "touch" the upper screw for a second.....

Unscrew.

Just my 2 Cents worth.....hope it helps.....

Go here and pick your weapon

http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&source=hp&biw=1912&bih=975&q=broken+screw+extractor&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+screw&fp=19e974be687f7f6e

Can you work from the side opposite of where the broken screw was driven?

If so, then you don't need a left hand drill. Normal (right hand) drills approaching the broken screw from the opposite side of the workpiece will be backing the broken screw out as the drill bores in.

Aligning and securing the workpiece are critical, but this is true from which ever direction you might attempt to drill out a broken screw. Drilling a pilot hole and then grinding flat the tip of the broken screw may make things much easier.

If you have access to a welder, try my previous post with the welder trick.

A similar method is used in the industry for broken off bolts in expensive castings.

Castings are metal and therefore conductive, which makes your problem much worse.

But I have also thought of another method that might also work:-

Assuming that this is a screw with an 1/8th" shaft, adjust the sizes if that is not true.

1) Find a sharp 1/8" drill bit.

2) Drill carefully down until you have made a small crater in the end of the broken screw, the shape of the 1/8" drill and probably about 1/16" deep or so.

3) This small crater will center the next drill much better. So using this crater, carefully drill a small hole say about 1/16" deep, using a 3/32" inch drill or a tick smaller in the screw. This will leave a thin piece of metal surround/tube.

4) Go to your DIY shop and buy the following tool in 1/8" size. Watch video below to see which tool. Do not drill deep and do not use a normal extractor as I think it will "bulge" the screw and make it even more difficult to remove. The tool in the video needs pushing down hard and will tend not to bulge the screw shaft as much I believe, pressure from above..

5) Video:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfbqbKb8aB8

6) It might be possible to use the first picture in the video of the tool shape and carefully grind yourself one from an old 1/8" drill shaft.....its almost just a backwards drill shape, should be quite easy if you are a "Workshop Animal" like myself.....

Best of luck.

Tried these on normal steel no 8's. All that happened is; as at 39 seconds in the video, only it kept going, and pared off the slots even more.

Then I went and got a thinwalled tube, etc.etc.

Also, there's no head on this job.

Although I am reminded about something else now.. I can't see it being possible to drill a hole in this thing, it's too small, but I have seen or invented a device where a roughly ground square pin is knocked down into the sleeve that remains. As it is tapped in, the corners cut their own channel. Then it is just turned out. The large surface area of the four long cuts is what makes it work. Something hard like an Allen key.

Jim

That sort of drilling isn't a problem if you are used to doing it.

The method I gave I have used in other situations (not exactly the same as here) to help people drill "in the middle!", many have problems with that, you do need a year or more in a workshop to pick it up.

There again, there are plenty of people around with 20 years workshop and they still can't drill straight!!! Or sharpen a drill either........met them many times!!!! A hammer is the only "instrument" they are good with......

I personally liked my (previous post) welder method best as the screw getting hot will make it even easier to remove!!! And the resulting hole only slightly bigger than the screw hole and then only till it connects with the screw!!

I agree.

If available, the welder method is best. But now, over to the judge...Lehman57

Jim

I also agree, See post #8.

This high current could be produced by a set of jumper cables on a car battery.

I tried to put the fire out...............

but my firefighting skills ain't what they used to be

Thanks. I believe I already have the "screw extractor," but the one I have was sold by Sears. Haven't tried it yet--still trying to work around our winter storms (NE Ohio) to get the chair brace splinted. I also have a screw remover for use in metals, but I will use only the left hand drill bit part--if it is long enough to reach the screw.

I liked the video showing the "QuikCenter;" it might be useful in removing 2 broken Sisson Choke bolts broken off in an exhaust manifold. Getting that pilot hole in the center is almost impossible when looking at the end of a helix!

In metal casting, there is another method I like better, and it works really well. I do believe the heat of the welder actually loosens the rest of the bolt/stud.

Watch here:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Asb4RWMvig

One technique not yet tried is the reorientation of perception, as in leave the broken screw in there and slather epoxy over oriented fibers, as in nylon thread, string, twisted steel wool, silk, etc. If the material is selected carefully, such as fabric from an old liver's unmentionable, the result can provide a deep, satisfying connection on an emotional level. and you can go on with your life. Or you can carefully cut the head from a new screw and glue it onto the old shaft. Then all that is needed is a new chair, using the old one as an art piece. I have seen it done many times. Good luck! ( I think that is spelled correctly)

Thanks for all the suggestions. The 2 screws are now out! I tried cutting a screwdriver slot with a Foredom flexible shaft tool using a tiny carbide cutter, but the cutter jumped around too much.

Also tried 2 left hand drills; it was too hard for one to work. I was off-center with the other--one of those places where you can see or have the tool in place, but not both at the same time. The hole was already too out-of-shape to use a small tube as a guide. This is also one of those places where the hole is not perpendicular to any surface.

Then made a tiny hole saw out of some small air/vacuum tubing. This worked by cutting around the screws until they would come out. Hole was less than 5/16" so I could enlarge it for the plugs to be put in.

Now in the midst of plugging the holes; then try to re-drill for the screws after applying some plastic wood where the holes were really buggered out around the plugs.

So that's a retrospective GA for me then guys, eh,... eh...

Jim

Hi.

Another way is find a thinwalled tube that just fits over your screwshank, and use a file to serrate the edge like a saw; I guess in an anticlockwise-cutting way would optimise your chances of extraction. Poke the tube down the hole and peck-drill away.

You would need to fill before putting the new one in.

Jim

Just to let you know I am still peeved about this. That was my suggestion Lehman57.

cnc jim