What Happened at the Sandy Creek Power Plant?

I never had them on the list.......

RIGHT ON!!!!

As the man complained back to the guy who's dog had just bitten his hat, who simply wanted to ignore it.....

"It wasn't your hat he chewed (your attitude!)"

LOL!!!

OH!!!

Thanks.....

Its amazing that one can get to 65 and still learn something new almost every day......

That was my orginal intent!!!!

Thank You.

Welcome aboard to CR4! As with others here, I think you have the beginnings of a good story. I hope you keep digging on this, and please keep us posted.

I so do agree, most of us keep the politics and religion out of the threads.

Guys,

I just e-mailed Mose and asked him to come back and play.

Cool. It sure would be nice to find out what exactly happened.

The video showed white vapor (steam) at first. This looked like an unnaturally prolonged blowdown, or maybe a steam line rupture. Continuation of either condition could then result in low water level and exposure of the upper tubes of the boiler to full flame temperature. This in turn could lead to rupture of the boiler itself, releasing combustion products--as seemed to be the case later in the video.

This is only one possible speculation; it would be interesting to find out what really happened.

As we say in the inspection biz,
"great catch"

You all won, I will be leaving, taking my technical thoughts to the newer forums that were spun off from older users here, a lot of you gaming the GAs like kindergarten kids, the idiocy of bathtub breaking, the frequent self aggrandizing posts of a few promoting their hobbies, the ridiculing of non English speakers, and the "regulars" who cannot even see and bitch about the satirical posts I have made. (Those were a test)

Count the number of posts months ago, the variety of answers, the number of diverse answers, the number of posts, and the nationality of the posts and compare them to the present.

Staff, research the frequency changes of your astute posters through the last 2 years.

I will leave this post alive in my world for another day to see your responses.

Anyone who wants to participate in a true Engineering/Technical forum, there are quiet a few.

Sad to see an old friend die.

Bye.

One of the main reasons I like CR4, is that they give people like you, (and me), the opportunity to spit your guts up on the table for everyone to see.

It ain't always pretty.

I'm also over getting GAs knocked down...................go for it.

The more you speak, the more apparent it becomes that you started this thread with an agenda in mind.

I certainly will not miss your preaching about politics, when you have been engaged in them from the start.

I have a handful of Maxi-Pads that I hand out to chronic bitchers at work. Would you like one?

To give credit to our 14 year old, trapped in a 65 year old body................it's still an interesting thread.

"14 year old, trapped in a 65 year old body"

Wait a minute! That's me.

T**b*gg*r is a slang name for a member of the radical American movement trying to force the US government to slash all the social programs in the country.

They are responsible for many conspiracies in this country. Most of them misguided.

Oops, that's politics.

This "discussion" is in the tank, and, for once, I had nothing to do with it.

Mark, I'm having a shot of tequila right now. Beer chaser. Care to join me?

Why of course. Whiskey for me.

I've got lots of friends, you're one of them.

I don't care about my friends' politics, the color of their skin, sexual orientation, etc.

They only have to be honest. That is the only criteria that is critical.

As long as a person is honest with me, we will get along and be friends.

True, true true.......well said.

Thanks for the explanation and I would love to have a drink with you!!

Maybe one day.

I just heard from Mose.

He won't be disclosing anything, I fear, (reporter stuff and all) but I invited him back because he was curious about some of the statements made by some members.

We'll see.

lyn

I'm sure he is curious.

You mean about the carrots, right?

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Texas_and_coal

Everything quit at the plant on Oct 17. Coincidence?

From the link:

Supreme Court may hear Clean Air Act case regarding proposed Texas power plant

In October 2011 the U.S. Supreme Court indicated that it may be interested in weighing in on the Associates v. Sierra Club et al. to determine whether or not the Clean Air Act requires the Sandy Creek Plant to install technology to control mercury and other air toxins regardless of when the plant began construction.^[

It would be pointless for them to continue, if there is chance that the US supreme court sides with the sierra club. That decision could change the entire nature of the technology already in place.

Whether or not there was an accident is speculative. Two things we now know for sure:

1) In Oct of 2011 the supreme court decided that they may hear the case.

2) In Oct of 2011, work on the plant ceased.

Come on. It's just a coincidence. Or maybe they knew they couldn't win, even before a decidedly conservatively loaded supreme court.

You will note that I did not capitalize supreme court. That's because they have mostly become lackeys of the conservative right and can no longer be considered impartial.

The entire case is weird.

I got up early this morning and read the court decisions from the 5th circuit. Politics are definitely involved. The Bush administration got them green lighted, and then the Obama administration changed the Bush policy after the plant was already under construction. Sneakiness from both sides of the aisle, with Sandy Creek stuck right in the middle.

As ugly as our little argument got on here, the real life battle is far more brutal. I didn't save all of the links from my reading this morning, but the federal government, along with the EPA is also threatening to step in and remove Texas' ability to make their own "clean air" determinations when it comes to projects like this..........................in other words, the federal government rules trump Texas rules, and if need be, Texas government will be removed from the process.

The bottom line:

If they are allowed to go online under the Bush rules................not a big deal for them, it was planned from the beginning.

If they must conform to the clean air act changes under Obama....................it will either cost way more money, or may have to be scrapped entirely.

Or maybe this settlement will be the end of it. Who knows?:

http://texasvox.org/2011/12/14/sierra-club-public-citizen-and-sandy-creek-reach-legal-agreement-to-slash-air-pollution/

This may surprise some people on here. But my personal opinion, is that if they have the technology and ability to conform to the current MACT rules..................they should do it.

Overheated components?

http://austin.ynn.com/content/top_stories/282742/power-plant-delays-could-spell-trouble-next-summer

It's really the only story out there from a source close to the project.

The agreement reached on Dec 11 with the Sierra Club,et.al., included further reducing emissions, which they can't do with the system currently in place.................they need to implement technology that isn't already there. They also are closing/delaying two other plants, and they have to build a $400,000 solar plant at an elementary school.

I would imagine that all of this work has to be completed before they open........................that would explain things taking a year. I'm also guessing that they are using the umbrella of an accident to complete all of the required work.

It sounds a lot better to shareholders/investors than.......................we caved to the Sierra Club.

Here's the agreement. If the courts agree, this should be the end of it, and everything will move forward.

Don't shoot the messenger, but all of this isn't over. Natural gas is also a target. The only thing I can't figure out.................is how are we going to generate electricity when all of these things are gone?

http://www.energyjustice.net/naturalgas

I'm all for solar, but I haven't seen anything that indicates that it's anywhere near doable on the scale that we need it.

This months Popular Science has an article about the hydroelectric dams that are being torn down in the pacific northwest, so salmon can spawn. I guess it's a good thing. I used to love salmon fishing........................but is there really no way to accomodate the salmon without completely tearing out the dams? Seems like we should be able to both. Oh well.

Germany (they are not alone either) has built "Fish Ladders" around dams, they appear to work well...

Here is a link showing some in the USA as well......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fish_ladder

They work, but according to this, they are too expensive. I'm not sure of the math on that, considering that we're eliminating clean power generating plants forever.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/10/111028-condit-dam-removal-video/

We'll be doing it across the US................I guess because they are old. We won't be replacing them either.

http://www.klamathbasincrisis.org/whosewho/AmericanRivers/58DamRemovalProjects2009.htm

Rhetorical question: After we can no longer generate and distribute electricity due to worn out equipment, how will people adapt to living in the stone age when they are not ready or equipped to live in the stone age?

I'm thinking specifically about urban areas where 75% of the us population lives.

Silly Goose.

Soon Russell Lee's whirlygig will be spewing out free power for all mankind.