Hmm...Deep, Deep, Deep Lies the Source of Earth's Water

Oh, silly Guardian...Time magazine got sucked into it too and even imagined Jules Vern'ish oceans.

This link has a much better description:

http://www.iflscience.com/environment/huge-underground-ocean-discovered-towards-earths-core

Not to worry. Fracking will pollute it sooner or later.

But, oil is more important than clean water.

I wasn't going there...but you found it anyway.

Well with oil you can burn it to make clean steam out of dirty water and then use more oil to power a diesel powered phase change heat pump system to condense the steam back into clean water!

None of which would be necessary if the water weren't polluted in the first place.

Or, you could use some of the $100,000,000.00 USD worth of flare gas that is needlessly burned off every MONTH in your home state:

Exclusive: Bakken flaring burns more than $100 million a ...

So, we know where you loyalties lie. Where the money is.

"So, we know where you loyalties lie. Where the money is."

Well yea I work for a fracking company now.

Not that I ever had much for loyalty to begin with.

Well for one we can't get enough people to come up here and help with tying all those wells into a central national NG piping system so that we can sell it to someone for $100 million or so.

On top of that if we started pumping that much cheap NG into the US systems the prices would drop making it worth less than that $100 million anyway.

So, instead of making some money and helping drive down the price of a commodity due to market forces, it is being burned so no one gets any benefit.

So, the consumers get screwed, once again.

Can't blame you for working there. Get it while you can.

One could take responsibility and do your part by converting your vehicle so that it burns CNG to begin creating a demand.........

I, myself do not do this because of the infrastructure.

You, making money is fine.

BUT! Don't, for a second, try to tell us that it is essential to pump that oil out of the ground TODAY! That's bullshit and you know it.

The oil is coming out of the ground today, because it makes money for the oil companies, not because it is needed. You can't come up with a single VALID reason to pump the oil today, except money.

Don't recover the crude until the infrastructure is in place to handle ALL of it. Gas, oil, and whatever else is in it.

You're peeing in my boot. That ain't rain!

If you want to stump TCM, you have to do better than that....

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dandiamond/2013/07/05/why-the-real-unemployment-rate-is-higher-than-you-think/

It doesn't take much just to give one good reason, but maybe because unemployment doesn't affect you, then one might think that's a difficult question...

Plus, when one works, one expects to get paid. Being employed is not a welfare entitlement

See post #28

P.s., I don't believe no ones peeing in your boot,........ Instead next time you have to pee, try peeing with the wind instead of into the wind. ;)

What you say is ridiculous.

The only reason is money.

You're a fool if you think big oil gives a crap about people.

I read #28. Once again, it's all about money, not people.

If jobs come back here, it's because there is money to be made. It's just a good coincidence that people get work from it.

If you think big oil is drilling because they want to bring jobs back to America, I've got some prime land swampland to sell you.

What kind of foolishness are you saying....... What is business?

You should read the posts before making such a asine statement. As I said before, employment is not a entitlement. And far as to harvest or mine, your statement that before you drill one should recover all before you even start shows your ignorance lyn.

That's like unmaking a cake.

And if you truly believe that, what are you doing about it except bitching to everyone else.........

Did you sell your car?

Do you grow all your food?

Do you making your own clothes from the cotton you grew and harvested by hand?

This list is too long........ So no, you just hitch about businesses making money......... That is what is so asine, as though their not suppose to.

I think you really should start cashing your pay checks from your career,,,,........ Because if you already did, that would also make you a hypocrite........ And we don't want that.

From post #28 ignorance and hypocrisy also falls under ect.

Employment comes because someone can make money. Not the workers, but big business. If big business could use robots, they would.

Big oil is making money, even by burning a $100 million worth of flare gas a month.

I NEVER said, "before you drill one should recover all before you even start".

That's dumb. Why throw away a $100 million worth of flare gas every month? That's how you drive the price up, I guess.

Never mind.

No, the mark up for CNG is only a fraction of oil,..... And to creat demand, why isn't your car running on CNG is stead of gas or diesel..

There is a reason why you never heard of a business that isn't in it for the money........ Why, because they never existed.

If people truly took an position like yours, truly, they would not expect to get paid for the work they've done........ But, There's no one like that, just only hypocrites.

As far as your statement of "You're a fool if you think big oil gives a crap about people.", .

Where did I say that or even remotely come to say it.

I'll make it easier for you, I didn't it, you did

Who says men don't get PMS symptoms.

Cranky much?

"BUT! Don't, for a second, try to tell us that it is essential to pump that oil out of the ground TODAY! That's bullshit and you know it."

So what exactly are we supposed to do and where and how are we supposed to do it?

"The oil is coming out of the ground today, because it makes money for the oil companies, not because it is needed. You can't come up with a single VALID reason to pump the oil today, except money."

Well yea if money was not involved how many of us would do anything at any time on any day? Personally if it wasnt for the money, and mostly for satisfaction of knowing my wife put her foot in her mouth when she told me to get a job and now she has to cover all of my work at home since my job she wanted me to get requires me to be gone two weeks at a time, I know for a fact I would not go to work and neither would most everyone else.

"Don't recover the crude until the infrastructure is in place to handle ALL of it. Gas, oil, and whatever else is in it."

I am not even sure how to reply to that.

However. As I understand it the product has to prove its viability before the infrastructure develops around it to fully support it. No one in their right mind builds all the roads, buildings, utilities and whatnot and hopes people come and make something out of it.

"product has to prove its viability"

There you go again.

So, your telling me that the flare gas is worthless? Really? If that's the case they will never commercialize it???? And sell it?

My boot is full.

"So, your telling me that the flare gas is worthless? Really? If that's the case they will never commercialize it???? And sell it?"

When the demand for it becomes cost justifiable to support the systems required to capture and transport it from every well they will start doing something productive with all of it.

Until then what amount that is being captured and processed at this time is getting used and the rest is just a nuisance byproduct of the primary product that people are wanting to buy.

But still yes we are working on the NG systems anyway.

ND Natural gas/propane plant.

and,

Natural gas pipeline development.

and,

North Dakota NG Pipeline Facts

Whatever. It makes quite a sight from space.

I read an article about our oceans being polluted with sodium.

Water water everywhere, but not a drop to drink.

How could we let this happen?

Even if the boards are shrinking, and the ship sinking, why waste good possible beer making material on getting them to expand .

Well done, sir! Along with the sodium "pollution", I hear there is also much chloride ion. What? You mean there are actual ions in the water, oh no we will all surely die! Yes, Charlotte, sometime you will, but more likely from something other than drinking water.

I was hoping someone would get the point...outside of an English lit correction.
It's like the crude that continually seeps from the ocean floor, off the southern Califiornia coast. For some reason, since it's not human caused, it's not considered "pollution".

I'm guessing that it's due to politics. Every time there is 'pollition' there must be a 'polluter' to blame and fine. Otherwise every volcano would be a source of 'pollution, as would the a wildfire started from a lightning strike. Even the black smokers, which are the source of warmth and nutrients for many exotic deep-deep sea creatures, would be a source of 'pollution' that would need to be stopped to save the planet, forget the fact that capping the smokers would mea extinction for some of the planet's most diverse and unusual life forms known.

Yep.

It would be awesome if we could remove the politics from every aspect of science, and get down to tackling the actual problems. More money is spent on advancing political agendas, than on the R&D that would really help. Such is life.

Yeah, how does that old joke go again..

"Life would be better if we slaughtered all the politicians."

"Yeah, but the lawyers won't let us."

"Okay, so we kill all the lawyers first."

I just started a FB ad. I am nothing, and they know everything about me. It's scary, but it's reality. Freedom is so yesterday.

How much is a henweigh?

The chambers of the deep were mentioned in Genesis, as having been opened by God at the time of Noah's flood. Do you or any others here supposed God missed one? I don't. Besides that, graphene is going to solve all water purification issues in the not distant future.

Frack them.

I have to look into it more, but I am going to assume that fracking doesn't go near magma. But...and, it's a big but...that water which is sweated out passes up and into aquifers through some mechanism, right?

The big deal about fracking is how they are deeper than the aquifers...

I'm not a tree hugger. But I do own property that has been directly affected by a near-by mining operation in AR. The creek that runs through my property mysteriously turned white. Silica, the mineral they were mining, is white. "Oh, don't worry, it's harmless", they said. After legal intervention the white water miraculously disappeared.

The frackers said flammable gas that appeared in many wells in fracked areas wasn't caused by them. It just happened, I guess.

Well, it's nice to hear that there is more water that we may someday be able to use.

Fracking, going near magma?

Fracking weakens the structural integrity of the rock, that's what the name means, FRACTURING.

You weaken the rock over a magma bubble, and the bubble pushes up faster than it would through unfractured rock.

Magma reaching the surface is called lave, where the lava comes out is called a volcano.

Deep Fracking = Volcano Machine.

I think you should go look up how aqufers are formed/replenished, then report back to the rest of us. It seems hardly realistic to think that water hundreds of miles below the surface and locked up in a mineral is going to magically "osmote" its way up into a fresh water supply.

Aquifers were mostly formed by slow melting of glacial ice in the last few ice ages. It literally takes water nearly one hundred years or even longer in some instances to permeate through compacted soil/porous rock layers down to the water table, and that is measured in hundred of feet, not hundreds of miles.

It is very easy to overutilize connate water at a rate much faster than natural replenishment. Look at the Ogallala aquifer and learn.

Lava tube descent....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EszQ_vkrIo

Lava tubes are surface features and would be collapsed at fracking depths

This is not low hanging fruit....itsa whimsical distraction....

It's not in the Cloud?

The deepest fracking wells are about 2 miles....

One of the deepest wells ever drilled is the Kola Superdeep Borehole which made it all the way to 40,230 ft, superceeded by a couple of oil wells by a few 100'....but still nowhere near the depth that would be required...It would have to be under explosive pressure that deep...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kola_Superdeep_Borehole

If that well is 2 miles deep on your graphic, then the deep aquifer is actually salt water from the Devonian or earlier era. That looks like a fine graphic of an oil well around Bradord, Pa, except they are never horizontally drilled. We have here another fine example of hysteria inducing half truths. The closest an aquifer gets to a true horizontally drilled shale well would have that aquifer in the top 1/8th, or usually much less, of your graphic. (thousands of feet) NW Pa is probably as close as we get, where the deep aquifer might be within 4500' of the shale and the shale around 5000'. That puts the aquifer in the top 10th of your graphic.

Everything you say is true, today.

It's a misnomer to even call it "water".

Not long ago there was a thread about gazzilion barrels of oil waiting to be found deeper underground. That seems rather at odds with this one.

'How can we spoil it' ? Well we seem to have done fairly good with rainforest/flora/fauna/society in general/pollution/atmosphere/oceans, , so I think we can manage this one.

How do you define a reserve? Not so long ago or so it seems, plate tectonics was just introduced as a matter of fact. To most people the hydrogeologic cycle was a surface phenomenon involving the oceans, atmosphere, and return via rivers, lakes, and shallow subterranean motion. In fact I was taught that the oceans were salty as a result of the movement of water across land that introduced the salts. The article is a recognition of the new fact that the oceans and not just land are subducting along fault lines (plate tectonics) and returning to the surface through mid ocean rifts and volcanic activity. So the new hydrogeologic cycle must now be considered and take into account some of the subduction factors. The whole system is dynamic and is forever recycling. There may be some trapped water in geologic form from the early accretion of the formation of the earth. But the new look at the hydrogeological cycle must now look at the "reservoirs" found in the oceans, atmosphere, shallow lithosphere, and now the mantle. The knowledge is now several decades old but quantifying the subduction has proven a big task.

It is now felt that the oceans will completely recycle through the mantle every 80 million years. It returns to the earth's surface through the ocean rifts and of course it is loaded with minerals we call salts. There are several good books on the topic but I cannot think of one as of this moment. And I am too tired to drill the internet for a resource or go to my old office. So to answer the question, "can we spoil these reservoirs?" No.

Are you sure we can't spoil them?

According to you we have 80 millions years to figure a way to do it?

I'll come back and let you know how it all turned out.

Link to Subduction and water cycle.

Wanna bet a slice of humble pie? OK 80 million is a long time and humans may no longer exist but if you come back I'll put a pot of coffee on.