What would be your best choice for a survival weapon?

Hello Bricktop

It really depends on how long you hope to survive, and if you intend your descendants to survive also.

Long-term survival = at least 100 years, is going to eliminate almost all modern weapons.

The reason is they rust, require ammunition, need machine shops to make parts, and the like.

So, no firearms, metal spears, swords, knives, explosives, or that sort of thing.

Long term, it is best to learn how to make things from readily available renewable resources.

That means wood, stone, fibre such as flax or sinew which do limit what may be made.

It is a maxim that water, food, and shelter will be needed, along with self-defence measures.

Learn how to make wooden and stone weapons, wooden arrows, fledged with real feathers, and a stone arrowhead.

Spears with wooden shafts, stone spearhead.

Longbow, with the "bowstring" made from animal sinew.

Wooden swords are generally useless.

The Boomerang, made of wood, is extremely effective at a longer range.

Wooden and stone clubs are useless at a distance.

The most important thing, is to train yourself to be a weapon-maker and hunter, and train all your descendants to do the same.

In such a state of societal "flux", you are not going to be able to stay in one place, and grow vegetables, or "farm domestic animals" such as cows and sheep..

So...very long-term survivors would be the following examples:

Australia: Aborigines

Africa: Kalahari Bushmen

US: "Red Indians" = "Native Americans".

Long term survival is something to think about early, and plans for that need to be made as early as possible, and while that is happening, you need short-term survival.

Short-term survival means abandoning one's comfortable all-electric home, filled with all those "necessary" appliances, and having a place already prepared, "just in case".

Ability to make fire, without high-tech devices such as matches, lens etc.

Knives - Carbon steel, because keep the edge longer than Stainless Steel

Sharpeners for above

Semiautomatic (Modified to fully Automatic) - FN F.A.L .308 NATO complete with Trilux Scope for long-range shooting

AK 74 Rifle (yes that is the updated foolproof version of the useful AK47)

100,000 Rounds of Ammo for each of the above.

That's a start, and of course all the equipment needs to be moved, or cached where it won't be found by others, is readily available, won't get wet, rust, corrode or deteriorate.

There we are now, just my first thoughts.

Kind Regards....

Plus i hear that brains are tastey (not sure myself, just seems a bit disgusting, but some of the smaller mexican carnicerias serve them and they seem to like them). Need to give equal access to such quality food to the Grizzly Bears also.

Sparky, the AK-74 and the AK-47 are not chambered for the same ammunition. The AK-74 used a 5.56mm round that used a necked down 7.62x39 case if memory serves. From what I recall (but I am less certain of this.) the -74 was not a big hit and it is being phased out to go back to the 7.62 round. The 5.56mm round wasn't doing enough damage.

Rorsch, Sparky's been MIA since around the first of the year. We fear the worst.

Oh dear! I had not noticed I am ashamed to admit. Maybe he was trying to chamber a 7.62x39R in an AK-74 and had an accident.

You aren't aware of what "each" means?

I was saying that the AK-74 is not merely an updated and revised AK-47, it is chambered for a completely different round so it is not interchangable. Functionally they are quite similar and visually they look nearly identical, but they are different.

If you think long term firearms are useless as the ammo will run out.
You can make a bow and arrows which will get you food.
The trickiest part to find is the string.

String can also make snares (cruel...but if you are hungry...)

So my answer is STRING.

As Spike Milligan once wrote.

String is avery wonderful thing,
Rope is thicker,
But string is quicker.

Del

(PS sorry the post is so long I did string it out a bit )

Cat Gut makes a satisfactory string...

A handaxe, 5000 feet of mason's cord, 500 waterproof matches, a dozen fishhooks, water purification gear, a strong antihistamine, several packs of sterile gauze, Betadine, 2 extra pairs of socks, and a small copy of Machinery's Handbook in a waterproof bag.

If you're taking Machinery's Handbook, look also for a copy of Henley's 20th Century Formulas, Processes and Trade Secrets. It contains everything from cosmetics to explosives to electroplating. Not a book to curl up with, but a terrific referance for making almost anything with 1900-1930 technology.

I agree. A book of formularies is a must have and the basis for much of our chemical products today.

Hello HarryBurt

If readers want an on-line version of that useful set of Henley's Books, they are available free on-line right here: http://chestofbooks.com/reference/Henley-s-20th-Century-Formulas-Recipes-Processes-Vol1/index.html

At the top Right Hand side of the page is a small "previous Up next" selector, which moves you from one volume of the Henley Set to another.

If you continue the "Next" button, you finish with the Henley Books, and arrive at many further interesting free on-line reference books.

In each page, navigate down, and click on the hyperlink for what you want to research.

As the new page arrives, scroll down past the advertising (It pays for your visit) and you should see the part you are interested in.

Trust that assists the discriminating reader = you.

Kind Regards....

Wonderful link, THANKS! When I was a boy, our local public library had a copy of Henley's that I used to take notes from routinely!

I haven't looked at it in years, so I'm not quite sure that it's still produced, at one point a 22 rifle that disassembles and all components fitted in a waterproof floating stock until reassembling was available. I'm sure it or something like it currently produce . So if you're looking for something to survive with after a light plane crash or a regional disaster where you may have to do some light game hunting for a limited period that would be my choice to put in the backpack or light plane.

If you're talking about Armageddon the Barnett M107 would be a good choice to start with providing you bring your your Abrams tank with you.

"22 rifle that disassembles and all components fitted in a waterproof floating stock"

I actually own one of these, I bought in the 70's.

I don't really like it. It has a weak firing pin. Dry fire it and you break the pin every time.

The 1970s is probably about the last time I saw one of those, though I've never owned one. Seemed like a neat idea and the one I saw at the range was firing with no problems, glad I never bought one if it has firing pin problems.

The Ruger 10 22 is a great weapon, as you say you can carry a lot of ammunition its only limitations are that of any 22, not real useful on large game. Personally I would dump the 45, not that it's not a nice weapon but there are better choices now.

A 10 mm Glock is one of my favorites ,more muzzle energy than a 45 flatterer shooting and the ammunition is lighter and takes up less space. You probably already know this, barring mechanical problems, such as 45s gets a lose slides or barrel bushings, the primary limitation in pistol accuracy is the link of the site radius, which can be overcome with either a scope or a laser sight.

Obviously there are limitations to fitting a scope anything with a slide, so lasers seem to be the preferred sighting augmentation of choice with semi automatic handguns. I have a 41 Magnum Ruger with a four power scope attached and would have no problems taking a 100 yard shot at a deer or other large game (supported off of something of course I'm not as good as I once was) A large caliber handgun would make a good survival weapon for large game as well as defense.

As far as pure defensive weapon I might also consider the new 50 caliber handguns, you don't necessarily have to hit your target with one, just blind them with the muzzle flash long enough to run like hell.

PS. I'm not really kidding about the the effects of large caliber weapons, I once owned a 460 Weatherby, I took it on a deer hunting trip to Michigan just so friend could see it and fire it a few times. Two locals walked walked up and commented about the nice-looking shotgun just before my friend touched off the first round, between the muzzle blast and the fact that the dirt filled tire exploded that was the backstop, the last we saw them they were jumping in their truck and leaving.

"I don't really like it. It has a weak firing pin. Dry fire it and you break the pin every time."

Really? Here's a photo of the pin, which is actually a flat plate with a semi-sharpend edge. So--how do you break a non-existant pin?

http://www.e-gunparts.com/DisplayAd.asp?chrProductSKU=388600C&chrSuperSKU=388600&MC=

I called it a pin for not a better name. It breaks where the hole is, as in half. I've replaced this part a couple of times. This firearm is cheaply made, nothing I would ever pick up as I went out the door.

But you could throw it in the pack when you went fishing or something.

Shouldn't be "dry firing " any rimfire firearm ...period. It tends to peen the firing pin and put a nice nick alongside the chamber. The takedown 22 that stores in the butt stock was popular in the 1970's to the 80's was made by Charter Arms - I think it is still being produced by by someone else now. I believe that Armalite had something to do with it's early development. Ed

You're talking about the Armalite AR-15. A nice rifle, but sights are hard to adjust and you cannot mount a scope and still fit the barrel into the stock.

AR 7 is the takedown 22 rim fire --- the Armalite AR 15 was the first version of the M 16 - the current AR 15 is semi auto only and is produced by several companies presently. All of the last 3 are chambered in .223 ( 5.56 NATO ) . Ed

You're talking about the AR-7.

For a firearm a .22 Long Rifle is sufficient. You can purchase and store large amounts of ammunition and learn to shoot a bow and arrow at your leisure.

My grandfather claimed to have killed two deer with one shot from a .22 and my Dad and Uncle confirm the story. One of my Uncles still has that .22 and it is still shoots. It has a nail rigged on it by my grandfather as a firing pin but it shoots. Back during the depression, kids were often sent out to hunt with a .22 and and given one bullet and they better come back with something or come back with that unspent bullet.

If you're worried about survival, it would be best to learn what plants are safe to eat and get over your fear of eating bugs.

Learning to make snares and traps would be a benefit as well. A figure 4 trap is effective and easy to do. That's notching three sticks, that when set form the number 4, with the bait on the part that sticks out in the middle. When the bait is tampered with the 4 falls apart and a heavy weight falls on your prey.

You can also assemble box traps.

Hello old school

A favorite saying of the range master at the SilverRado rifle and pistol club where I shot at for over 20 years (even though I can't spell the name right) was if you want to teach a kid how to shoot by them a single shot bolt action 22, if you want them learn how to spray buy them a garden hose.

When I was actively flying on cross-country trips I thought about buying one of those survival rifles to leave in the plane, in reality you'll die from lack of water long before lack of food in most cases, so you're probably better off with a flare gun, and a basic survival pack water, food and a book on what you can eat and what you can't.

As far as a bow there are pluses and minuses, if you can find your arrows you can use them again, when practicing at long-range shots where I managed to miss the hay bales I have several arrows that were never located again. They either entered the ground and buried themselves, or the freight train that was passing in the background reported an Indian uprising when they arrived at their destination.

Undoubtedly a shotgun. However I say a heavier gage. 20 gage over under?

As stated, I not a real survivalist here. I put it in the context of a Katrina like event. Basically having to survive for several weeks, on my own. With the now proven fact that the police and government are not going to protect you, or feed you, at least for this given time period. I realise that it would be very difficult to survive the woods of New England for any extended period of time, with the 4 seasons and all, without extensive preparations. I can carry several days of food, then use the .22 for small game. Yummmm, flame broiled squirrel, with a Queen Ann's Lace salad, with Burch bark dressing. And for a late night snack, kiver and mash.

Oh ya, and the 45 is to keep the boogie man away.

I used those firearms as choices because that's what I got. I'm sure there are better choices, hence the question.

Good.

I know some organization in US, conduct a training course "Survival Course". The training includes every thing about vagitation around.... which vegitation you can eat, and what is harmful...... beheviors of animal world, how to face them friendly and many more things. The course duration is 6 months as I understand from one of my friends, who attended the course.

I do not know which organizations conduct this training. I am out of touch with my friend. Can somebody guide me about the course?

The same things I used in the Military: My Colt 1911 .45, for close protection; my 7.62X39 SKS, for hunting; and my 7.62X54R MN 91A2 for taking out the owner (at 1500 yds.) of the other things I wanted.

We are talking survival here, correct?

Just theorizing Dragon

Take my ex-wife. She knows fricken everything.

If your Ex wife looks like you (your Avatar), no body will dare to take her.

Well, I know you asked for 'which survival WEAPON', but unless I am retreating into the woods against a human enemy, I don't know what I need the gun for? Besides, I've never been very comfortable around guns (not against them and admire those who know what they're doing), just that I DON'T know what I'm doing, therefore it would probably end up being more harmful to me than to someone else.

I'm no survivalist either, but my first choice would always be a good combat knife ... good for a hundred things including my greatest needs in that scenario, food and shelter.

If we're talking survival against 'bad guys', one guy (especially me) and one gun won't do much but to get me killed.

GOLD

as a boater, and having been through the L.A. riots, an ex-FBI friend of a friend commented on what to have in a motor vehicle, should one need to "survive" an urban breakdown, as we had just been through, after the Rodeney King riots---get your self a flare pistol kit, from a marine store--12 gauge launcher, with extra cartridges--anyone messes with you, stops your car, etc., the sight of a 12-gauge pistol , loaded with magnesium , is pretty daunting---as he advised, you bounce the flare off of the pavement, into a hostile crowd, blinding them, and scattering them---the next flares go straight up into the air, as a "9-11"--seen by helicopters all over the city---one of these flares will scatter just about any hostile crowd---and, if you are travelling from your boat to home, or visa, versa, it's legal---(hit a deer with it, and you could problably cook some of it at the same time)---just a comment---mac

Weapons:

1. SKS paratrooper [16 1/2 inch barrel] in Tapco composite collapsible stock with 100 rounds [50 154 gr soft points & 50 123 gr steel cores]

2. Suppressed, optically sighted, target grade, 22 rim fire pistol with 100 rounds match grade ammo and 500 rounds bulk grade hollow points.

3. Leatherman Wave model stainless multitool [the blades lock when open hence it's inclusion in the weapons category].

4. Tactical tomahawk. Handles all chopping and slicing functions of a large knife besides being an extraordinary close quarters combat weapon.

All the above stowed in a "Go Pack" with the emergency rations, med kit, water purification apparatus, etc. Weight not to exceed 50 lbs!

Thanks

Certainly there is some difference between the country side and the cities. You will find less hospitability in cities. As you go deeper and deeper in country side, the people reciding with nature are more hospitable. In cities, the hospitability is almost nil, because of many reasons. People are too engrossed in earning money and fast comfort. But still cities too are not very unsafe, at least in day time till late evening. Metropolitan cities (four major cities.. Mumbai, Kolkata, Delhi and Chennai) may be little unsafe during late night. But other cities are more or less safe during night time also, except some state like Bihar.

I can not say the crime is not there. But it is not wide spread. We need not always be scared. We never need any weapons. (Weapons are not permitted here). Also the crimes where weapons are used are very very rare.... only bank looting, terrorism or rare killings.

In some states like Kashmir, it was not safe for last two decades, but now it is more safer. But the reason here was (or is) totally different... terrorism (political). Before terrorism started in Kashmir, I had experienced hospitability of poor people there, which was uncomparable. People there are really nice.

Just wondered, because I am 60 years old, and I DO remember when our country was a LOT safer, and also a LOT friendlier. Neighbors actually helped each other, and talked to each other.

In small cities and villages in India, still the situation is like as you say. Neighbour's house is your house in all sense in these locations.

why do you think that your people are that nice to everyone in your country?

Difficult to answer. I think, people are content with what they have, however small it may be. There is no big ambitions of bicoming very rich. What they want is just basic requirements.. full stomach, shelter and cloth. Bihar is troubled area, because these three basic requirements are not fulfilled. The people are poor and forced to go for crime for their requirements.

Hello

As you say, India has problems. But the problems are creation of new fast prosperity culture or because of politics.

People are more are less content. They accept the situation, they are in.
Bigger the expectations, bigger the ambitions, less satisfied you are, because there is no end to expectations.

Kris.. what's your full name. Your name sounds like our Krishna... the supreme god. The only perfect personality (from many many gods of India)

I give this a GA.

Milo

Add to your provision one taser, non-lethal close quarter protection should be an option. A little bell makes a good warning. One can of cheap aerosol hairspray, a Zippo lighter with at least 9" of duct tape; how could these three items be used together? About a dozen light alloy cowtrops. A wrist rocket. One spool of piano wire or the type used to secure aircraft fasteners. TVP45 gave good reply also. Don't forget a sturdy staff...a.k.a. walking stick.

Ray Mears/ Bear Grylls.

Some hottie for company (neither of the above people) would be good too.

Failing that, a massive machette/parang would be handy. Bullets and guns can fail you, but a good blade...........

Any weapon needs two people, you and the victim. Until you have defined the victim and why he/she needs to die you can't pick the weapon. I'd take a pony, they may not kill people but they make strangers into friends, and ponies are useful, they can do anything a horse can do but without the hassle. And a pony needs an experienced handler, so anyone who decides they need a pony, might as well take the team, which makes you safe.

But remember, the guy heading for your food or whatever, that you shoot, may be scavenging to feed his starving children. Is that really a capital offence?

Simon

Nice olive drab glock!

THANKS, Vandarye!

But, er. . . it's actually a Springfield XD.

Sorry. I am personally not a big fan of the Glock. IMHO, the XD is a much better gun.

BTW, the AK is chambered .308 w/ 22" chrome barrel and a reinforced bolt for the bigger round. 1 MOA @ +600yds.

-A-

Wow, remarkably similar then. I saw the olive drab glocks when they first came out to purchase at an NRA convention in Houston. I personally don't own a glock either. My handguns are Taurus, which are decent. Berretta is just a little on the pricey side. I would so love to have a 92F though, that is one of the smoothest shooting guns of all time. The Berretta 92F and the Colt 1911 are probably my two favorites. If I had to go it in the woods alone and really rough it, I would have to go with a good knife, some flint and tinder, and a good hatchet.

This is a really good topic. When I was growing up I was a boyscout and really into survivalist training. This also reminds me of a great book that I read when I was a kid called My Side of the Mountain. If you haven't read it, you should check it out. It is about a boy who leaves home and lives on his on in the catskills mountains. It's a great read.

I would take my Ruger 10-22, and at least 500 round of .22 long ammo. my stainless steel S and W 40 caliber pistol with 50 rounds, my Collins 36" machete and a good hunting knife, diamond sharpener, fishing kit and of course a fire starter. I would probably have a tough time deciding between the pistol and my 20 gauge Remington pump shotgun though. Then I would just decide to make the wife or son bring it. I live pretty much out in the woods so I keep these guns loaded and ready anyways. These days you never know when someone gets a crazy notion in their head to take what is not theirs.

pipewelder

I would want at least one good friend.

Someone wrote 'a hottie'. That would be nice but they are usually the basis of most conflicts. So I want a good freind.

Being a GE employee, I'd have to say first off, if armageddon came, I'd get into a military base and get myself a GAU-8 Avenger 30 mm gun. While I can't exactly run around carrying it, knowledge that I have it will "keep the neighbor kids in thier own damn yard", so to speak. I'd probably mount it to a heavy truck and use the trucks engine to pump the hydraulics to keep the barrels rotating and to generate the electricity needed to prime the rounds. Not having to fire a shot means not getting shot back at.

I vote for the .410 shotgun with a good mix of shotshells and slugs, a sturdy knife of a good size (a machete may be a bit much, and a pocketknife may be underkill) with a stone, file, or ceramic rod sharpener, the roll of mason's cord, and the spool of piano wire. Keep in mind you will eventually if not at first be schlepping this gear on foot, so keep the weight to a minimum, or travel at a snail's pace. I don't see a pistol or rifle as being a "best" choice. Unless I've holed up and have 100K rounds stashed, that is...then, make 'em both .30 cal. for universality. If you can afford the weight, a case of bar soap is more valuable than it's weight in gold in a crisis. Smart trade goods is a survival aid, no?

This is all highly dependant on time of year and latitude....compass or watch, knife, tarp, matches or flint, fish hooks, pellet pistol....and most important would be knowledge of the environment

A good dog, as witnessed by Will Smith in his survivalist movie. Barter material like gold, alcohol and tobacco will come in handy. And don't forget your Bible.

I would have to say any edged weapons. Of all the technology we have now, it still has to be maintained. I say "edged" because it can be made of any material, bone, wood or stone and yes metal. It can be fastened to a pole for a spear or a larger piece of wood to make an ax. I am not trying to go into all the details in this, as every situation of survival will be different. I am in the south east USA ,we have woods lakes a streams. Most of the central USA has the open plains west coast has wild fires and mud slides. So different it would have to be tailored to the terrain and the type of game to hunted and of course what type of defence needs will be implemented. All of our Native Americans did pretty well with the bow and tomahawks. NO DEL NOT THE MISSILES

as double J B said, your brain. If you don't keep your witts, you are doomed.

I appreciate the Kudos but the credit really goes to Sparky. I just simplified wht he was stating.

A simple long bow and 1 good knife along with a good canteen is all you need-nature would provide everything else for survival.Mankind has been doing this for century's already.Read in the past to survive in the future.Animal organs can make almost anything you'd need and there's always trees and birds to resupply any arrows you;d lose or destroy.

Re: What would be your best choice for a survival weapon?

I laugh at so many of these threads on CR4. "...for A survival..."

"A" means ONE and one only.

IF Bricktop: had said a survival PACK, then there could be discussion about what is in your survival pack. (guns, food, tools, etc) But he didn't. And with using the word "best" it restricts it to one again... there is only "1" best. Next is second best. He asked what would be your best choice.

Yes, your brain is neat, but it isn't a weapon, it is a tool to be used.

Definition of a weapon:

1 : something (as a club, knife, or gun) used to injure, defeat, or destroy

Even such things as car or other things can be used as a weapon if it is used to injure or kill someone.

Many of the things in this thread being talked about are tools used for survival, not as "A" weapon.

Many talking about a knife would be their choice. When everything goes to hell you want your BEST choice for a weapon to kill someone (to protect yourself or your family) to be a knife? And the people coming after you have guns? Haven't you people heard about taking a knife to a gun fight? Not me! I don't want someone getting so close to me that the only way I have of killing them is with a knife.

So, I would have to side with choosing a gun as my weapon of choice. Along with that many "tools" of course. But since I don't live right in the city, I would remain at home where I would have access to all of my belongings. Then I would have available everything from a .22 pistol to a .45 and rifles from .22 to a full auto M-16 plus shotguns, plus a bunch of reloading equipment (save that brass!) and a well that I can run the pump motor with the portable generator for water.

But the "best choice" would have to be a gun.

I guess someone needs to start a thread: What would you include in your survival pack of equipment?

That would cover everything, including weapons, food, tools etc.

So start the thread...

milo

Here it is. Three questions in one thread.

Survival kits/packs

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/23555/Do-you-have-a-survival-pack-already-and-if-not-what-would-be-in-it

Walk/hiking packs

Driving around packs

End of the world as we know it packs

Seein' as most here are gun loopy I would suggest a rifled barrel single shot .410 shotgun slightly modified to take .405 Winchester cartridges (low velocity, slow/medium burn powder...45's don't fit well and they're too low power)

For those who can make their own barrel (remeber to case harden) .02" undersize with long tang rifling.

Great gun for surviving elephant attacks while in survival mode!

In defense of the "gun loopy", Bricktop did specify "weapon" in his post. IMHO a SKS fits that niche better than ...........a pony.

SKS hasn't the accuracy to be a 'survival' tool/weapon. It is an assault rifle.

Under ideal conditions (and balanced bullets) and at 100 yds it will give a spread of 18" +- from centre.

So would a .410 shotgun loaded with birdshot, but for each pull of the trigger...

be it ever so humble and to continue your train of thought........."for each pull of the trigger" ..........I'd venture to say that you'd be eatin' bird not people (too salty I'm told)......

B'sides, eating people whilst in 'survival' mode is frowned upon.

Th' .410 might not kill 'em, but it would sure discourage all comers (bears included)!

Actually a 410 would just irritate a Grizzly Bear enough to take notice of you, and maybe look close enough to decide you might be edible. A 410 would barely hurt a wild bore, and would seriously piss them off (they have nasty tempers anyways). For a Bear, at least in the western US where they get a little larger, you are going to want something more along the lines of a 30-30 or larger.

I reiterate--- A 12 gauge flare pistol, with 1000 ft capability, vertical, will in fact, do more than just piss off a Grizzly---it will totally blind and totally disorientate the animal---the magnesium continues to burn (moisture activated)---still the best LEGAL defensive weapon, in a close fight. It will repel one or 10, easily, and quickly reloaded, and did I say, no carry permit required--it is a Marine flare flare/distress signal gun--(friends of mine, pilots, carry them in their planes for overland trips, for both protection, but also for signaling)--Just my 2 cents---C-MAC

a slug would work pretty well but buckshot probably wouldn't do enough damage. not enough pellets.

Hmm, after watching that video of that bear enviroactivist and his girlfriend in that tent, I am leaning towards an Abrams. Not much is going to get inside it and attack you, though it might be a bit uncomfortable, and you can do significant damage just running things down, let alone by cannon or machine gun fire. Oh and most smaller trees would not be too much of an obstruction (though i guess very steep slope might not be traversable).

The problem is that when we kill one of these bears we call it sport.

When a bear kills one of us we call it 'ferocity'.

That guy was no enviroactivist. He was an idiot.

I am not sure there is much distinction between the two. When he was alive, many enviroactivists claimed he was a researcher who understood these Bears and was conducting profound research into the nature of these majestic animals. So If he lives the crazies at PETA consider him a cutting edge "scientist" and animals rights activist, when he dies the general public decides he was just stupid.

I'm with you Brick', although I would take My Winchester model 67- 22 short, long and long rifle and my Colt SAA 45 long Colt(with one empty chamber under the hammer). Although if was open country that I had to survive in, I would want to take a Ruger #1B standard in 6mm with a a 3X9 Leupold Vari X II and a Harris bi-pod.

I grew up shooting tons of .22s and competing with my brothers and father, and the single shot rifles always out perform the semi-autos. If you have only one shot , you will make it count. It is my opinion that semi autos are great fun, but can be good for wasting precious ammo and semi auto handguns require way more caution.

As far as being somewhere that helps this idea register--I was asleep on the bank of Terror lake on Kodiak Island when my hunting partner woke me up--He exclaims that something was getting into our meat(no trees and the meat is a little closer to the tent than I would have liked)--He tells me to go see what it is. Ha, I just tried to go back to sleep because I new I could outrun him.--Turned out to be a fox(saw the tracks in the light of day).

Which video are you speaking of? Did I miss something?

Au Contraire. My personal SKS will put all 10 rounds in the magazine into a 10 cm dia group at 200 meters. It has the same power as a 30-30 winchester with 154 gr softpoints, but without the fragility of the commercial lever action rifles.

I nominated the SKS because it is compact, light, rugged [chrome bore/chamber, parkerized exterior], & accurate enough. Antipersonnel capable to 400 meters. Medium game capable to 200 meters. Heavy game capable inside 100 meters. Dangerous game adequate inside 50 meters in skilled hands and IF absolutely necessary. Did I mention how reliable they are?

I've circumnavigated the globe with one. Never needed to fire it except to test the blanks. For getting game I use my old Diana 177.......or my spec. bore .410.

Ponies have done 5000 years on battlefields. That isn't why I like them but it is a fact. Guns have done how long? And when you want to haul firewood, shift the sick, go for a ride, which gun would you choose? And which is the best gun for making friends?

Wikipeadia defines weapons as "A weapon is a tool employed to gain a tactical advantage over an adversary, usually by injury, defeat, or destruction, or the threat of these.

You note the word usually, so if your weapon means that otherwise hostile individuals come up and say "Can I pat your pony?" could this be defined as gaining a tactical advantage?

I may be weird, but I do have a point.

Simon

Hello saddlechariot

<"....You note the word usually, so if your weapon means that otherwise hostile individuals come up and say "Can I pat your pony?" could this be defined as gaining a tactical advantage?....">

What about when some hostile individuals come up and say: "Can I EAT your pony?"

Kind Regards....

Men Women and Children need knives. I carry now a Buck Whittaker that my friend and co-worker gave me for Christmas. He reverted back to the Leatherman, because the plyers on the Buck were not good. The Blade is better on the Buck. Everybody needs to carry a knife. BoyScouts were taught to carry a knife and a pen, or a pencil. Being bombed back into the Stone Age is not all that attractive. Day in and day out my most constant survival weapon is a knife. Last time I went to Chicago I went out of my way to carry a gun. It was helpful in a confrontation I had with a guy who had only a knife. "Wood is good, but Steel is Real." - is a saying. Urban and Rural environments have different demands, but universally I think it is sensible for anyone to carry a knife. The two weapons to carry actually are a knife and a shotgun. This is the iron age still, a bit. The 410 shotgun is actually attractive, though a 20 Guage is cheaper. Living myself in an urban environment, I carry a knife, and have a 32 caliber revolver in the beside drawers. I also have a BB pistol that will shoot pellets at 400 fps after three pumps. Obsidian flint chip hand axes were the survival tool for man for about 400 thousand years, so I do imagine that knowing how to make one, would be a good idea. In a difficult situation short or long term, a knife and a shotgun are desirable. Bows and arrows can be made from rocks, (Flint), however a man without a knife, cannot make a spear. The spear is important since it is hard as hell to kill enough for the family with a 22. Hence one must kill a semi large animal. The old guns where you had to pack the powder did work, and are recommended especially if you know how to make gunpowder. To survive it is important to have hunting friends. The lone wolf starves. Getting along with others is a great weapon, but a knife is a good thing to have.

You make many good points, and i'd love to know how you managed to pack heat in "my kinda town" they frown on firearms big time. much risk.

Asthe original scenario seemed to imply one persons lifetime, i'm intrigued by your idea :" Obsidian flint chip hand axes were the survival tool for man for about 400 thousand years, so I do imagine that knowing how to make one, would be a good idea. Bows and arrows can be made from rocks, (Flint)," seems to be a bit of a bother. There will be so much scrap metal available... where is the obsidian and flint?

otherwise, good post. milo

LETS SAY SIX MONTH MAXIMUM TIME LIMIT

DEPENDS ON SITIATION:

DROPPED IN WILDERNESS WITH ONE TOOL. A DOUBLE BITTED CROUSERS AXE.

IN THE WOODS WITH SOME SUPPLIES NO HUMAN CONTACT. ABOVE PLUS TWO RUGER SINGLE SIX'S (ONE IS NONE TWO IS ONE) AND A COUPLE OF BRICKS OF AMMO.

IN THE WOODS WITH SOME SUPPLIES AND OTHER DISPLACED HUMANS ABOVE PLUS 1911 .45ACP WITH 100 ROUNDS AMMO.

IN THE WILDERNESS WITH SOME SUPPLIES POSSIBLE CONTACT WITH HUMANS AND APEX PREDATORS ABOVE PLUS 30-06 AND 12 GAUGE WITH SLUGS BIRD AND BUCKSHOT.

Yeah, you'd probably last about 6 months under those terms...

BRILLIANT!

milo

ACTUALLY UNDER THOSE TERMS I COULD LAST INDEFENITLY. FOR STRICTLY ALONE IN THE BOONIES SURVIVAL THERE IS NO BEATING AN AXE BY ANY OTHER SINGLE TOOL. KNOWLEDGE AND AN AXE WILL PROVIDE FOOD, SHELTER, PROTECTION.

With that, I concur absolutely. My choice would include a sturdy knife to handle smaller chores, but an axe is near the ultimate.