Previous in Forum: Noise-Free Solar Inverter (DIY)   Next in Forum: Discussion
Close
Close
Close
16 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Anonymous Poster #1

Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/09/2011 3:00 PM

In such a widely known/ used parallel LC curcuit as that of PF correction one, current born of the changing magnetic field in the coil during 1 half-period goes into (and charges) the capacitor in the 2 half-period, and, alternatively, the current born of the electric field accumulated in the capacitor goes then through (and creates a magnetic field in) the coil.

Why the currents do not go throgh the path of less resistance (that is, impedance) - that of the source of the emf itself. Why the currents chose the pathes of more resistance (impedance) - those of the capacitor and the coil respectively?

Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.
Anonymous Poster #2
#1

Re: current in LC circuit connected to the source of emf

09/09/2011 3:31 PM

In parallel connection current is minimum.The circuit at resonance is called current magnifier.Initially both behave as a SC path.

Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#16
In reply to #1

Re: current in LC circuit connected to the source of emf

09/11/2011 3:20 PM

At PF correction bases does not lie resonance ?

What is SC?

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#2

Re: current in LC circuit connected to the source of emf

09/10/2011 1:10 AM

What is the basis of assuming that source impedance does not have an impedance?

PF correction capacitors may have inductrance in series for several reasons. This series impedance is in the circuit of the applied emf. The applied emf is cancelled by the voltage drop across the PF capacitor and inductor in series, satisfying Kirchoff's voltage law.

If you can draw the circuit diagram of what you are explaining, we can have better understanding of the same.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#3

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 10:00 AM

My qwestion may be idiotic.

Source impedance (for instance of an outlet 3 phases 400V) is very low. Load connected to it is inductive (an inductive motor without load for example), with a low PF. Parallel with the load capacitors bank is connected improving the PF. Why the reactive currents prefer to flow from the L to C and vice versa ? Why they do not flow the other direction - back to the sourse - through the source, that is, by the path of less impedance ?

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#4
In reply to #3

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 10:54 AM

Source only supplies the "Effective Current" of the parallel combination of the "Inductor" and the "Capacitor"

BY VIRTUE OF KIRCHOFF'S CURRENT LAW THIS IS THE ONLY SOLUTION.

Your impression that the current is not flowing through the source is not at all correct. Both the inductor and capacitor are passive elements and cannot supply the current. The effective current always comes from the source.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Guru
India - Member - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Temporarily at Ashburn, VA
Posts: 2744
Good Answers: 164
#5
In reply to #3

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 11:01 AM

If you disconnect the load (R,L,C), the source is open-circuited and there is no current..only the open-circuit voltage. The circuit needs to be completed externally to make a current flow...

Or do you mean something else?

__________________
Nothing worthwhile can ever be taught, it can only be learnt.
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#6

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 11:39 AM

Ignoring the load parameters (ind motor), let's say the impedance of the C is 5 Ohms, the impedance of the source (transformer) - 0,005 Ohms.

In the absence of the C a back emf from the coils of the lightly loaded motor will flow back into the source in the form of reactive current, let's say of 5 A, 50 times per second in Europe, 60 times in the USA.

Why, after connecting the C, should the reactive current flow the path of more impedance of 5 Ohms (charging the C), instead of the path of less impedance of 0.005 Ohms (heating the lines from the source and the coils of the source)?

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#7
In reply to #6

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 11:52 AM

You failed to notice that capacitive reactance is negative compared to inductive reactance which is positive. You are only comparing the magnitude and ignoring the direction.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#8
In reply to #7

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 12:44 PM

Yes, 50 times per second in one direction, 50 times in the other.

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#9
In reply to #8

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 12:54 PM

There lies the answer. A 5 MVAR capacitor compensates a 5 MVAR inductor with the source having 0 MVAR or 0 Amperes.

the capacitive impedance is lower [being negative] compared to source impedance. The source therefore has lesser current.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#10
In reply to #9

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 2:00 PM

Do the reactive currents of L and C flow through the source, towards each other and mutually compensating each other in the case of PF correction ?

My big misconception may lie in believing reactive current of L flows through C charging C, and the reactive current of C flows through L creating flux in L.

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#11
In reply to #10

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/10/2011 9:58 PM

Individual reactive currents of L and C will not flow into the source. Only the effective reactive current flows into the source. Hence measuring power factor at the source shows improvement, when C is used in parallel with L at the load side.

Thus if we have 5 MVAR reactor and 5 MVAR capacitor, the source does not see any reactive power component. And source is not the least impedance path, as the impedance needs to be considered not only by magnitude but also by its sign.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#12
In reply to #11

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/11/2011 5:41 AM

Thank you Mr Ramaswami for your answers.

But, then, would I be correct if I put it so:

with parallel L and C we select such their values that frequency of the source becomes = the inner frequency of the LC curcuit, and there takes place a potential resonance, Ul = -Uc, Z of the circuit becoming unlimitedly great, thus the impedance of the source becoming unlimitedly great, reactive currents of the L and C flow through each other.

Sorry that my terminology is not always correct as my native language is not English.

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/11/2011 9:32 AM

The potential across the L and C will be same at any given instant [they are in parallel connection as in power factor correction and Induction motor example discussed]

i.e Ul = Uc , The inductive component of the current is partly supplied by the source and partly supplied by the capacitor. When compensation is such that net power is lagging.

Ul = Uc and inductive power is wholly met by capacitive power at unity power factor

Ul = Uc and Capacitive power is partly met by inductive power and the absorption of the balance capacitive power from the source, for leading power factor.

Thus you see, that source may contribute, may not contribute or may even absorb reactive power depending on the situation.

In all the cases there is actually only one source , with neither C nor L active Q generators.

The source impedance always remains same - never infinity nor 0 or anything else. This is what we use for example in Transient stability calculations for generator model. The X"d, X'd, Xd , and similary for Q -axis of the sources remain constant. They do not vary irrespective of combination of L and C chosen in the example considered.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#14
In reply to #13

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/11/2011 1:16 PM

We are not (approaching) a parallel resonance in PF correction ? (we actually do not want PF =1)

Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#15
In reply to #14

Re: Current in LC Circuit Connected to the Source of EMF

09/11/2011 1:23 PM

I did not understand your comment.

Parallel resonance is a condition, where in the driving point impedance at a node reaches maximum for a harmonic frequency.

Our discussions so far have centered around fundamental frequency only.

the point is source impedance at a given frequency is constant.

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Reply
Reply to Forum Thread 16 comments
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (8); kvsridhar (1); raghunath7 (7)

Previous in Forum: Noise-Free Solar Inverter (DIY)   Next in Forum: Discussion

Advertisement