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Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

Posted November 28, 2010 7:36 AM

With the economy in the doldrums and unemployment remaining at high levels, the Federal Reserve — the backbone of the American banking — has decided to continue its program of "quantitative easing," which injects new money into the banking industry. The theory is the increased liquidity will trickle down through the system, eventually creating new economic opportunity and jobs. However, others fear it will sooner or later create dangerous levels of monetary inflation, giving rise to the dreaded hyperinflation that could bring down the whole economic system. Should the Federal Reserve be more prudent about what it is doing?

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Anonymous Poster
#1

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/28/2010 10:40 PM

Get real. Dangerous inflation cannot occur when products are not being purchased. Duh.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/28/2010 10:51 PM

What about the products that people may still think they need to purchase such as milk, bread, baby formula, nappies, gas, diesel, bottled water, etc.....

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#3

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/28/2010 10:53 PM

smell that? pure bs!

"the backbone of the American banking"... no, it is the giant parasite of the american people.

chris

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/28/2010 11:44 PM

Chris, I agree 100% with you! Finally some one gets it! Oh my!

The Fed and what they are doing is completely insane. The problem, the "real" problem is Oboma doesn't get it.

You can not print money that doesn't exist. Period.

If the US is serious about doing something, they need to follow what Germany is doing, and has been doing. Yea, I know , they are no where near our size geographically and humanity as far as numbers go. But look at their GDP, take a look at their stocks. These folks are heading in the right direction and have been uneffected in the 70's. 80's, and the only issue "they" have had, was investing in the US playing in the 08 housing markets. But they have recovered early on after realizing what was really happening. Unlike the FEDS, and OUR OWN GOVERNMENT being ASLEEP at the wheel. So here we are now. Screwed, and not even a Kiss from the Presidents. And yes that is pluroal. Bush didn't kiss us and Obama just hugs a select few.

SCREWED!

Lets not even talk about Fannie May and Freddie. Oh My....

Double Screwed, and again , No Kiss.....

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Anonymous Poster
#5
In reply to #4

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 12:08 AM

"You can not print money that doesn't exist..." Well you can, it just lowers the worth of the currency. It's a deliberate ploy to reduce the real value of the loans the US has with foreign lenders.

But that's not the main problem. You have a banking sector that were allowed to bet heavily (and lost) and were rescued with public money. A classic case of "privatising the profits, socialising the losses".

Obama (or any leader) only has a small number of options to help. Lower interest rates - done. Stimulate exports by devaluing the dollar - on going. Borrow for "pump priming" investment - ongoing.

What ever he does it'll upset someone. Next election he'll get kicked out while the real culprit who released the controls on banks (Reagan) will be seen as a great manager. Ffej

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#7
In reply to #4

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 12:37 AM

Let's back up here, the Federal Reserve is not responsible for printing money. So lets talk some facts. Banks create money because of the federal reserve. Let me give an example: the fed loans money to banks, it's called the federal funds rate. People go to banks to borrow money, and then provide some collatoral in turn. Say I go to the bank and want to borrow money for my home that is paid in full. I want to borrow $100,000 and the bank only has $10,000 because of investors deposits. The bank gets money, overnight money from the federal funds. Now my house is worth $100,000 the bank only had $10,000, because of leverage (that is they are allowed to loan more than what they have based on credit and underlying assets), therefore, $90,000 of money is allowed to enter the system, it doesn't come out of thin air, that value in this case is tied to an asset ie-the value of my home. There is no inflation in this scenario, banks create money through this process.

Now, while we are experiencing inflation, we can and should directly tie this to the rising price of oil. Oil is a major input to everything we buy. Goods won't make it to market with out it, and most goods need it to be produced. With that said, homes are the most expensive things we own, and their values have been dropping. If you want to say they have leveled off, that is fair, but it hasn't hit bottom, and without the federal reserve to loan money via the federal funds rate, demand for homes will decline further, and prices would decline further if people can't borrow money to buy said homes.

So if you have a problem with the above logic, ask yourself who is responsible for printing money. . . and if you do not know, please google it.

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#11
In reply to #7

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 8:29 AM

Now, while we are experiencing inflation, we can and should directly tie this to the rising price of oil.

no.

inflation is the difference between the amount of money created by the federal reserve and the gdp. full stop. it is tied to nothing really...

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 10:48 AM

You seem like a smart guy, but you are wrong. There are many causes for inflation. The relevant points to this discussion include the following a) inflation is normal, too much inflation is bad b) there are many factors that cause inflation, printing too much money is one of them, but the fed is not responsible for printing money, which is the premise of this discussion, the treasury prints money c) another cause of inflation is a rise in input costs, like I was saying oil is a major input in all goods d) another cause is demand for workers, the more demand for workers relative to supply this also puts upward pressure on the price of wages- creating inflation (not relative to this case, but relative to causes of inflation) e) a drop in the exchange rate relative to import/export levels f) taxing goods causes prices to artificially go up, which is the last source of inflation I will mention here.

Now, I will gladly entertain your questions, but the above points are irrefutable.

TTFN

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#17
In reply to #13

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 10:11 PM

Prior to the creation of the Fed (or other central banking mechanisms), prices changed very little. Your statements about inflation are the standard output from the Fed and gang.. (appearance of rising prices, etc)

Thank you for the compliment, but really intelligence has nothing to do with this. The Fed is a deceptive entity, and continues to perpetuate that deception most especially by 'helping' others how to think incorrectly about inflation. If smarts could fix this deception, it would have done so long ago. There are a great number of smart people who have tried to figure out how to fix this, and a lot have suffered for it.

They also want people to think that there are no reasonable alternatives to the fiat currency system... again, that is an untruth.

It doesn't matter who actually prints the money, any more than it matters what atm spits it out. That isn't where the control of the money is. The fed lends money... at interest... that it never had. With the participation of the banks and the goverment, they lend more money than the economy produces. The end result is that the tax payers are put on a hamster wheel and made to run faster and faster and faster, just to stay in the same broke place.

People who disagree with this are typically benefitting from the system, thus justifying their participation in the ongoing criminal activities. (by criminal, I mean a crime against humanity) I really don't care how else you paint it or stroke it. It is akin to being in a gambling house, and trying to convince customers that the house doesn't statistically prevail.

Chris

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#19
In reply to #17

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/30/2010 10:52 AM

GA. The Fed seems to be collapsing the dollar intentionally or not. They are either fools or they have a plan... either option is a concern.

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#8
In reply to #3

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 2:35 AM

Chris -- You have a right....nea, a responsibility, to oppose what the US Federal reserve is doing to the value of your country's currency. But that does affect your credibility in this issue.

Ed

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#6

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 12:34 AM

"I sincerely believe that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies, and that the principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale."

or

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

Thomas Jefferson

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Anonymous Poster
#9

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 7:01 AM

Maybe we need to value what we have. More is not better. We all have a disease called more greed and selfishness which leads to waste. How to function on what we have may be what we need right now. There is plenty out there we always want to satisfy our appetites not knowing what we need by what we want or think we need. Start growing your food and cut back. Sustainablity means to function on what you have.

Sustainability interfaces with economics through the social and ecological consequences of economic activity. Sustainability economics involves ecological economics where social, cultural, health-related and monetary/financial aspects are integrated. Moving towards sustainability is also a social challenge that entails international and national law, urban planning and transport, local and individual lifestyles and ethical consumerism. Ways of living more sustainably can take many forms from reorganizing living conditions (e.g., ecovillages, eco-municipalities and sustainable cities), reappraising economic sectors (permaculture, green building, sustainable agriculture), or work practices (sustainable architecture), using science to develop new technologies (green technologies, renewable energy), to adjustments in individual lifestyles that conserve natural resources.

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#10

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 7:49 AM

Here is a hilarious (but true) explanation of the idiocy of 'quantitative easing':

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTUY16CkS-k

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#14
In reply to #10

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 11:55 AM

Yes it's hilarious. Yes, it is a string of truths constructed into a very effective propaganda piece. Very likely designed by people to influence Americans into supporting the very same conservative policies that drove the US into the great depression in the 1930-32 period and laid the foundations for the second world war.

Now, like then, there are a large number of very smart and self serving people that are unaffected by current economic conditions and see a huge opportunity for personal gain in these trying times. The big difference today is that there are more of them (note that 70% of American workers are still fully employed), they have a wonderfully effective electronic media propaganda machine at their disposal and they have the financial wherwithall to drive it's output.

So it's a new century with a new set of selfish distractions to keep us ignoring a new set of foreign competitors as they slowly build their strength. 1910 or 1930 all over again. But that is history. The history humankind is doomed to ignore and then repeat.

We worry about our sons and their families. The best we can hope for after we're dead is that their native talents will keep them afloat while their peers are passing into a self destructive oblivion.

Ed Weldon

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#12

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 10:03 AM

Guest who talks about "ethical consumerism". This is pc language for communism or some form of the elite thinkers telling the rest of us dummies how to live our lives. Why do you not identify yourself so we can know who is superior?

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Anonymous Poster
#15

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 3:15 PM

perhaps you should

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Anonymous Poster
#16

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 8:19 PM

My two cents... The Federal Reserve is a misnamed institution. It actually is a private central bank that 'loans' money to the US. The Federal Gov may print the money but the Federal Reserve controls it. Part of the US debt goes to paying the interest on the loaned money to the Federal Reserve. In other words, the Federal Gov will never be debt free because it is always borrowing money from the Federal Reserve.

I cannot remember the person that said this but the quote goes something like this.... "As long as I control the money supply, I care not what laws are passed". This person was the creator of the private central banking system that has become the Federal Reserve.

Our country is not the only one that has a private central bank. Do a Google search on the Federal Reserve and you will find out when it was created. That will tell you that our recent presidents were / are not responsible for creating the problem only in making it worse.

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Anonymous Poster
#18

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

11/29/2010 10:43 PM

Research Germany around 1932-1939 for info on what happens when money keeps getting added to the economy and print presses are working over time printing money.

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#20

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 2:28 PM

As working class trickle down was metaphorically representative to me of being pissed on. Leastways they at least called it correctly as a trickle, and not a stream, river, creek or flood.

Nevil Shute, who I consider the engineers novel writer with street cred as a businessman involved in the aviation industry moved to Australia when Great Britain instituted high inheritance taxes. Course when aristocrats stop investing in the ideas and businesses of their own nation, then they undercut the willingness of the proletariat to let them keep their family money, since they aren't doing much good with it.

Seems to me nation states today want it both ways. They want a Global Economy, without any fair assessment of monetary valuations that level the field.

At any rate there are factors of philosophy and culture, involved that skew things right much where no one can see the forest for the trees. Global Village is an oxymoron.

The banks don't want your collateral of overvalued land and houses and malls. They just loan against that stuff if they think you can keep it yourself, or sell it at a profit without bothering them too much.

When looking at the world from a working class perspective, and trying to figure out how best to start a country from nothing, I of course want to print money people will like to use to pay bills. From what of nothing could I create bonds?

According to my study all I own really is my life. Hence I determined that all fees paid to the nation for services would provide Whole Life Insurance policies for all citizens giving their very lives value as collateral equal to, or as more than property.

The services that my nation, or any nation are correct to provide are defense, and education.

Why did Hong Kong become powerful? I predicted 30 years ago that Hong Kong would take over China, more than China take over Hong Kong, and far as the rise of China is concerned I feel I was essentially correct.

Accordingly Transcendian Theory as far as control of land is concerned adopts a Lease concept which I have seen work for Aviation FBOs, and Hong Kong, and China.

What the hell, all things are temporary...

Once Transendia is up and running a nice little confederation of airports and ports, well it will vie for power and importance with the UN, and either take over the UN, or be taken over by the UN.

Key economic theories of me, the Transcendian, are valuation of the individual via insurance, to balance the capitalistic half right banking founded only on property.

All right I admit this is utopian, and further dependent on a pool of educated citizens.

Ever wondered why I, the professed political scientist of CR4 hangs out here too much?

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#21
In reply to #20

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 2:54 PM

A country arises from the people who live within it. The country is defined by the ideas of the people who populate it. To create a country requires people. Large projects are typically funded by the excess of value remaining after the population has consumed what is required for their own survival.

The first thing that people do, is to create something, usually in order to ensure their own survival. (Food, shelter, clothing, etc... all the things requiring labour) They do this first, in the mind, planning what they will creat, based on what they know how to create.

The mind is the 'means of production' of ideas, and as such, all people start (somewhat) equally. Research and education both amplify this tool's (the mind) output.

In order to create a nation of airports, where airports are necessary for the survival of the people.... airport planning must be done. This means that the people of the country must have, or acquire, a body of knowledge about airports and their creation.

(and of course, to ensure that the means of production of airports remains in the hands of the people)

Who has this knowledge currently? Can we see it?

Chris

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#22
In reply to #21

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 3:19 PM

I do have a significant problem as pilots, do not expect to own the ports they visit, have little loyalty to anywhere, and don't talk much.

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#23
In reply to #22

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 3:47 PM

so then perhaps pilots wouldn't be citizens... just visitors.

What other people 'need' to own airports? Travellers and tourists?

there isn't a lot of unclaimed land in the world, where you can create your own country.

Perhaps a floating paradise... somewhere in an ocean, but having a fixed gps location?

Chris

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#24
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Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 4:08 PM

Chris-- So where would you locate the floating city of Trancendia? Why would you put it there? What methods of construction and how to do the architecture? And finally how would you sustain it economically to a level of prosperous self sufficiency and provide for a defendable political position in a potentially hostile world?

Don't answer here. Good new topic for CR-4. Could well go over 200 replies.

Ed Weldon

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#26
In reply to #24

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 4:52 PM

Hi Ed,

First I read a book called "The Millennial Project - Colonizing The Galaxy In Eight Easy Steps." by Marshall T. Savage. (continuing now as the Living Universe Foundation) In that book as part of one of the steps, he talks about how to create a type of concrete accretion from the sea, over wire mesh, using electricity. (called Biorock)

I also really like the idea of an offshore energy farm or palace, or whatever you want to call it. this conversation has been started a couple of years ago... Here are some of my images and links to that conversation.

http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/337521/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/337479/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/338004/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/338482/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/32245/Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/338007/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant
http://cr4.globalspec.com/comment/338041/Re-Alternative-Offshore-Hydroelectric-Plant

and I'm still thinking about it and planning it.

here is another more recent attempt...

but honestly have difficulty and a lack of training and time, in portraying some of my thoughts. I do love the subject of an 'offshore energy palace' though.. it has so many possibilities. and I'm sure airports could easily be part of it.

so economically, the energy, the sea food, water purification, and living space, make such ideas potentially viable for sustaining people. Militarily.. well honestly that isn't my thing... I suppose one could view it as a floating flaktower... but when it is susceptible from air and water... it would probably develop a significant investment in defense methods... I don't know.

I've been planning to do a version of it covered with a solar tower type of tech.

Chris

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#25
In reply to #23

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 4:15 PM

We are all just visitors.

I addressed this ownership problem by cleaving to lease agreements.

Yair, an aircraft carrier will be good to have with its own zip code.

P.S. A modular framed car may well be great, but a modular dashboard would be nice when the radio goes to hell.

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#27
In reply to #25

Re: Is the Federal Reserve Taking a Risk?

12/05/2010 4:59 PM

and I was just thinking about modular stuff again... after talking with my girl about her laptop.. and how the stupid screen goes dark if it gets shut down... and I thought.. you know.. this needs a modular replaceable monitor. If my desktop has monitor trouble, I go buy another... If my laptop has monitor trouble.. I buy a whole new laptop. so wtf?

laptop mfgrs should make their products more modular.

/rant off

in relation to offshore cities, I suppose that the recent adventures in offshore drilling (and environmental pollution) are a key indicator of some of the difficulties such an establishment would face. One thing they did have was gps, and anchor or positioning systems.. so I can see it having an address, and staying in the same place.

I can also see the rules about pollution having to be enforced and recycling systems fully utilized.

radios are basically modular aren't they? you just pay the installer to wire it up for power.

Chris

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