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Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 12:11 PM

This topic has been talked to death for years with pros and cons on both sides. The strongest argument for metrification is, it's easier for people to understand as it is based on units of tens. Going back a hundred years or so (78 in my case), I was brought up with the Imperial system and have no problem what-so-ever with it. I am also comfortable working with the metric system when necessary. I would make the argument that whatever system you grew up using is the right system if you paid attention in school. I would suspect there are people in metric countries that have a problem with metrics; not just in this country. I say; whatever works is the right system to use. The problem comes when we try to accommodate both systems into our everyday life. We buy beer in 12 oz cans, coke a cola and gin in liter bottles and milk and gasoline in gallons. Volume units don't create any real concern, but when we are dealing with distance, that's where we get into trouble. Measuring the distance from earth to a distant planet can be expressed in either system, no problem, but here on earth, the argument for or against is not so clear cut. Our society is made up of "building blocks", standards that everything is based upon. In the construction field, the 2x4, 2x8, the 4'x8' sheet of plywood and drywall, door and window sizes, pipe and fittings, electrical wiring cannot be changed. We can express them in metric form, but we cannot alter the actual physical size. In metric countries, their "building blocks" are different from ours and not compatible. In our country, a 2x4 measures 1-1/2"x3-1/2". In a metric country, the closest equivalent to a 2x4 is 48x98mm(1.89"x3.86"). Obviously metric lumber would not be compatible with American lumber. Going metric isn't just the use of the metric system; it's converting to the metric building block. We know that's not going to happen.

Let's take an example where metrics would not work. In our highway system, signs are Imperial for example; "1 mile to the next exit". We would have to either change the sign to read "1610 M to the next exit" or move the sign to a position that is a convenient distance from the exit, such as 1 Km or .5 Km. Road markers and all signs that display distance would have to be changed; no small task and a big inconvenience.

Another example: In steel construction, we use standard structural shapes that have no metric equivalent, like 6x4x7.5#T or 4x8x12# I or 20.4# plate. If we were to use metric shapes, we would have to go to a size larger than what we would normally use. I had to do this on a project involving a metric built ship before I retired. Much of the steel was bad and had to be replaced. Metric form shapes were not available in the U.S. so I had to use larger U.S. structural shapes and thicker plates to repair the damaged materials. Obviously going smaller wasn't an option. I'm talking about 10,000 tons of steel; not a small patch job. As a result, the ship left displacing a bit more water than when it arrived. The building blocks that we use in the structural fields of shipbuilding, bridges and buildings are pretty much set in stone; there is no changing that.

The two systems will continue to share the stage in the same way driving on the left or on the right.

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#1

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United State

01/24/2013 12:45 PM

'...In our country, a 2x4 measures 1-1/2"x3-1/2". In a metric country, the closest equivalent to a 2x4 is 48x98mm(1.89"x3.86")...'

.

Why would that be the closest equivalent?

25.4mm to an inch

...so for 2" x 4" , 51mm x 102mm is much closer.

...and for 1.5" x 3.5" , 38mm x 78mm is much closer.

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#6
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United State

01/24/2013 2:10 PM

The 48x98mm size are the actual dimensions of wood used in metric countries and is closest to our 2x4. They also don't use our 16" stud spacing.

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#7
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United State

01/24/2013 2:13 PM

They don't use 16" OC stud spacing because they don't use 48" X 96" sheet goods.

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#23
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United State

01/24/2013 8:56 PM

That doesn't seem like that is a problem inherent to the metric system, since the unit of measure is not the limiting factor.

.

It sounds more like a supplier problem.

.

For most lumber, just approximating using 100mm for 4 inches would work out fine in most cases. That is a really easy conversion. If suppliers are resistant to meeting a market demand, it shouldn't take long for competition to step up to meet that demand.

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#2

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United State

01/24/2013 12:59 PM

The strongest argument for metrification is, it's easier for people to understand as it is based on units of tens.

But I've only got eight fingers!!

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#3

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 1:34 PM

The strongest argument for metrification is, it's easier for people to understand as it is based on units of tens.

Try telling that to this guy :

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#4
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 1:43 PM

How come no-one else understands dodecadecimal......?

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#10
In reply to #3

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:34 PM

Gives new meaning to the double barrel bird flip....

I get it....

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#59
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 8:18 AM

Does this suggest that, when he lends a hand, he's giving more than 100%?

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#93
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 10:42 PM

They have quite a time trying to take his finger prints...

add one...

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#5

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:05 PM

As far as the speed signs go, I'm sure we could ease into it slowly. Start with signs that have both the km/h and mpg and work their way from there. I think Canada has both? Don't quote me on that.

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#8
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:17 PM

Oh yes- and both are also in French & English......

I believe we did back in the 70's when Canada went metric, but they'd probably be a rare find now. Possibly in some border areas.

Good example though. We did it in here and I know quite a few Canadians that are quite comfortable dealing in both systems. This does seem less so with younger generations though (it sounds much better to say you weigh just under 99 kilos instead of pushing 220!!). More and more people just don't seem to care, especially if they don't deal with exports to the US.

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#11
In reply to #8

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:36 PM

We tried the conversion thing in the 80's in Washington State...probably due to our northern neighbor...but it panned and the signs are only seen close to the border, now.

Curious about the 70's though...we still use the dual convention in our automobiles, even in cars that are never slated for export. I guess that's a border thing, too.

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#13
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:45 PM

we still use the dual convention in our automobiles

Same here! And a darned good thing on the NY Thruway.

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#24
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 9:13 PM

Would that dual use thing be that time in automotive history when they used both metric and standard sized nuts and bolts in single vehicles construction?

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#26
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 10:44 PM

Speed signs here are in km/h only. There is no French/English because "km/h" is bilingual...kilometers per hour and kilometres par heur. Besides, the bilingual thing would only apply to Quebec. When you cross the border near Plattsburgh there is a large sign that explains the speed limits are in km/h and that 60mph = 100 km/h...just in case!

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#48
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 5:13 AM

There are similar signs on the crossing between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland as well.

The other notable ones are on the roads out of the Channel ports, such as at Dover: "Tenez la gauche/Bitte links fahren", just in case.

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#96
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/26/2013 4:57 AM

Hi PWSlack,

At one time it was considered that we should complete our changeover to the Metric system by also changing over to driving on the right-hand side.

To make it easier for the people to get used to this change the change-over would be phased in over a period of time. For the first three months only heavy motor vehicles would be required to change over to RHS driving with other classes of vehicle to follow at a later stage!

With regard to the OP's statement I can only say "Viva le Metric!". I realise that the USA likes the Imperial system of measurement but, in today's World Trade market system, this tends to restrict the access to markets that are Metricated. I work with a lot of machines that have Imperial sized components and it is an absolute schlep having to carry around all the correct spanners etc to accomodate both systems. By not changing the USA is creating opportunities for their opposition within the Global market.

Perhaps it is the regular conventions that are held to try and standardise the thread sizes in the States that are the attraction? I feel sure that most of us can remember the hassles around standardising the colours of cabtyre cables in Europe at that time. Germany had a great colour scheme - grey = neutral, Black = live & RED = earth (absolutely shocking for others!)

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#102
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/26/2013 3:43 PM

Why do we have to change? If one system is best, then why don't you switch over to the Imperial system and we will all be on the same page. It should not be a question of which system is "easier" or "less complicated". We who use the Imperial system have no problem. If you can learn the metric system, I'm sure, with a bit more concentration, you can learn the Imperial system. That's why God gave us a brain.

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#105
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/26/2013 4:25 PM

Yes one system is indeed best, and it isn't the Imperial one!

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#108
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/26/2013 7:56 PM

Aaahh, here we see it. YOU (approximately 350 million people) have the problem, and you expect US (the remaining 6.7 billion - or 6,700 million for those who want!- and not the U.S.) to change to fix YOUR problem. Not likely.

Quite frankly, for most non-engineering people this seems to be a non issue anyways. And knowing that a 19 mm wrench will slip perfectly on that 3/4" bolt is handy too, when you've got one of each in your toolkit.

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#53
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 6:29 AM

220 is just 15 stone 10 pounds.

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#15
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 3:05 PM

Start with signs that have both the km/h and mpg and work their way from there.

If you can do a little calculator/app that converts from kilometers per hour to miles per gallon, then, we should all get the hang of it pretty quickly.

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#28
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 10:58 PM

Uhm...kilometers per hour to miles per gallon?? Did you mean "miles per hour"?

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#49
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 5:21 AM

Hours per gallon, probably. Hey, it's no worse than kilogram-meters per second squared.

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#97
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/26/2013 5:42 AM

That comment's a jewel.

(My spelling is atrocious. Right? I was caught elsewhere in this post misspelling 'Gray'.)

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#58
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 8:09 AM

Canada is metric on road signs as to speed and distance, some height signs are both imp and metric as in bridge clearance. Most are just metric.

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#65
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 10:44 AM

That's a 1-0 for Canada Versus USA......

Especially gratifying after all the bad talking about Canadians you hear on US TV programs....

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#120
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 2:05 PM

Not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but why are Americans so important to you?

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#129
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:40 PM

Once I left the RN, while still studying, I started working for my first US Computer company....eventually I never ever worked for a UK or European company in the end, all US.....Documation, STK K, STK Germany, STK International, Sun microsystems International.....

Still have lots of friends there in the USA, I made 100s of visits up to 6 weeks long, even while in the RN......if I had the finances I would visit again.....and again!

I have only visited Canada a couple of times, I would also like to make a longer visit there too.....

Australia is also still in my sights, only been there 3 times, but because I have a large family there as well.....last time was 1972......

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#122
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 2:13 PM

'...bad talking about Canadians you hear on US TV...'

.

Seriously?

.

You thought Fargo was a documentary? Well, no. We do not think the reason so much of the population live along the boarder is that they are poised to invade.

.

How much US TV are you watching from Germany?

I don't actually use a TV or allow one in my house, but I'm pretty certain most of us would agree you don't know what you are talking aboot, eh?

.

In general, most in the US appreciate Canadians, and when I have gone to Canada, the feeling seems to be reciprocated. Attempting to sour thos amicable relationship is folly, due to fail, whether such attempt originate at a television station, or with someone fabricating stories about television programs.

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#124
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 2:32 PM

My experience also: I've yet to meet a Canadian I didn't like or a Canadian who disliked the United States, with the possible exception of a few francophone Québécois whom, apparently, don't like either. Regardless, the whole argument is patently absurd and serves to underscore once again the fact that human beings don't get along and not because they can't, but because they won't. Not fate. Choice. [PRIMAL SCREAM]

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#131
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:54 PM

I like them too, served with several Royal Canadian Navy Officers in the RN. One used to drink UK Ale with a bottle of tomato juice in it!!!!! UGH!!!!

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#130
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:50 PM

You missed the point I made, I was talking about US TV programs.

I am not often enough there to judge as to whether it is a countrywide problem of bad manners or not, though I have heard unfriendly comments in that direction from basically normal US citizens.

Certainly Polish people get a rough deal in the US as do Hispanics.....Jokes etc..

British people used to use Irish people as the butt of their jokes, Irish use 'Derry men, Germans use Austrians.....and northern Germans....Belgians use Walloons....

By the way, I like "stupid" jokes, that attack no one......

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#134
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 8:14 PM

Fair enough.

I imagine some TV programs do exist that make derogatory comments about Canadians, but it is hard for me to believe the comments weren't made in jest.

.

TV programs typically play to their audience, and I can't imagine that derogatory remarks about Canadians would be acceptable, much less support continuing with similar comments.

.

There simply isn't ANY general discord with Canadians. What could we possibly hold against them? Canada hasn't intentionally wronged us in at least a century, right? Moreover they share many of our customs and mannerisms.

.

I also don't think Poles are disenfranchised for their heritage in the US, to any meaningful degree. I realize this not always been the case, and that Poles were the brunt of endless jokes. I never hear these jokes anymore. I haven't heard one in at least a decade. I don't think I know anyone who sees being Polish as something less than desirable.

.

Don't get me wrong, a meaningful portion of the US population still harbors significant unreasonable and harmful biases concerning people of different ethnicity and culture:

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Black people certainly experience unfavorable cultural bias on a regular basis. Thing have certainly improved, but the problem has certainly not been resolved. Many view a black person as inherently dangerous, prone to criminal activity, of inferior intelligence and education, but possessing large genitalia and superior athletic ability without having to work to accomplish such ability.

.

Many people will say Asian people, while intelligent and good at math, are myopic bad drivers with small genitalia.

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Many also stereotype women as being bad drivers (though not as a result of myopia, instead, Y-chromosome deficiency is blamed) and bad at math.

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The case with Hispanics is peculiar. Being from a country like, Cuba or Argentina or Columbia, is often well regarded. But often, people from countries like the Dominican Republic, Mexico, Nicaragua, or Haiti, can be held in low regard by certain groups.

What I find interesting is that this bias is prevalent in a sizable portion of Hispanic communities. If you doubt it, ask a culturally Hispanic person about the hierarchy of national origin. They might at first deny it, but usually they will confess to knowing exactly what you are talking about, whether they themselves hold such values or not. Typically being from Spain is top tier. Cuba and Columbia usually rank near the top. Haiti, Dominican Republic, and Mexico are ranked low.

Weird huh? It seems like it might be correlated assumptions about how European the population has remained (as opposed to having traits thought to come from Native Americans or people brought from Africa).

.

People speaking with a southern accent are seen by many as having lower intelligence and lacking education. They are also considered by some to generally be bigoted, insestual, racist, chauvinists, who only enjoy mudding, shooting and bestiality.

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All of these are absurd preconceptions to hold in the mind when interacting with an individual.

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As if that weren't enough, the US has a ridiculous habit of taking an old term and re-purposing it as a ill-defined derogatory classification. Now anyone who is disliked can be cast into this newly conjured bad class, and there upon, hated.

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It is simply absurd that we feel the need to conjure new groups to hate on. A very prevalent one currently is 'Liberal'. Many people who use it as a slur have very little idea of the pre-re-purposed meaning. They just label whoever they want to hate-on, as a 'liberal' and commence hating.

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In fact you can be pronounced a 'liberal', simply by inquiring it the person using the term can provide a reasonable definition.

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So, yeah, we have some things to work on. At least the Canadians, the Poles and a small (but growing) group of Hispanics are mostly out of harms way.

.

Now if we could just do something about all the damn Krauts around here. Just kidding

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#138
In reply to #134

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/28/2013 6:46 AM

Interesting reading, you make many good accurate points, many thanks.

The final sentence was funny and I am not offended.....

Even though I usually drive Japanese cars privately, I am not a fan of the Japanese as a whole. Why you may ask?

Well its simply that as far as I am aware, they have never apologized or made proper timely reparations in any way shape or form for the way they treated the Chinese people and those of all the other countries they took over before and during WW2 and the misused Allied prisoners in the second world war.....

The attack on Pearl Harbour was made minutes after telling the US that a war situation was in place (in Washington only I believe!). Typical for the Nazis when they attacked Poland BEFORE declaring war.....

That showed Japan as a country whose morals were/are of the lowest and worst type.....good friends for Nazi Germany at the time, as was Italy!!!!

At least Germany has since made reparations and given many apologies.....Japan = NONE AT ALL.....as far as I am aware anyway.....

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#140
In reply to #138

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/28/2013 7:28 AM

Japan certainly has appeared less than willing to make sincere apologies. Japanese reparations are almost non existent, especially in comparison to those made by Germany.

.

Deciding the level of accountability an individual should have for the actions of their government is not an easy task.

.

They certainly are not free of responsibility. They also can't reasonably be held accountable for each decision the government makes (they may be firmly opposed to the decision that was made).

.

I guess I'm curious about how (or if) your dislike manifests. Is it a factor when you interact with a previously unknown (to you) individual citizen of Japan?

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#142
In reply to #140

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/28/2013 2:48 PM

I have met many Japanese, some privately, most in business and it is not the individual that I see as the "enemy", basically its the Japanese government of then and now.....but me being a small fish, there is little I can do (lets agree on nothing!)

The Emperor should have been hanged instead of keeping both his head and his job!!!! That was appalling from the allies....

But I do feel that this fact should be aired on a regular basis......it could cause a loss of "face", most important to a Japanese person.....

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#9

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:19 PM

I thought you guys had an engineering mentality in which case, Imperial or metric should not be a bother. We think in our native language and if the Imperial system is what we were brought up in; then it's the Imperial system that we think in. We can work with both systems, but one system will always be our native system.

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#12
In reply to #9

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:37 PM

They must have different generations of engineers working at NASA.

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#119
In reply to #9

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 1:04 PM

Engineering has nothing to do with this. It is just applying the systems as they are available or everything starts to go wrong. Imperial was a good way out in the early days of discovery and they measured with their own feet and thumbs, not having standards with them yet. The problems started when they had to use fractures. That is how 1/2 to 1/128 found their way. And everything there between.

Good thinking but very impractical to comprehend on a fast basis. Just a loss of time and not very fool- proof since calculating with fractures creates more possible errors.

Our world becomes more and more miniature- micro and nano are modern terms. How you relate these to the imperial system?

It was not sufficient when everything became more precise, the Imperials had to go to one thousand th of an inch to keep up with the rest of the world.

Lack of standards gave birth to 3 different gallons, different tons (a ton is also a 10 fold). The gage is also a unique example, the F temperature scale, the Btu as like only the Imperials have thermal units. It is like the US population are the only Americans? What e.g. about the Canadians? There is life over your borders too.

Keep up with imperial units and one day you will become a museum. History repeats itself?

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#121
In reply to #119

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 2:06 PM

'....they measured with their own feet and thumbs, not having standards with them yet. The problems started when they had to use fractures....calculating with fractures creates more possible errors.'

.

Ouch, that does sound like a tough break.

.

.

'...That is how 1/2 to 1/128 found their way...'

.

'Their way' seems to have something in common with binary....You know binary; used by those things becoming '....more and more miniature- micro and nano....'

.

.

'... Imperials had to go to one thousand th of an inch....'

.

Okay, so if we have already adjusted, how did you get your slipje in such a terrible knot over this?

.

'...Lack of standards gave birth to 3 different gallons...'

.

Well, not really. Technically speaking it was a superfluity of standards that gave birth.

.

.

What is the big fuss? If you don't like dealing with the Imperial system, then don't. That shouldn't be all that difficult if someone minding their own business happened to live in, say, Belgium. Right?

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#123
In reply to #121

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 2:13 PM

Exactly.

And on the flip side, if we were the bunch of nobodies, imbeciles, miscreants, religious fanatics, maladapts and morons the world would have us believe we are, then why all the obsessing over us? Sort of speaks for itself, methinks.

GA.

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#145
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/29/2013 8:52 PM

I carry the Belgian emblem with honour as a small nation symbol for all the "civilisation" influences we passed through. The history of this tiny country dates from thousands of years B.C. In the epos De bello Gallico - the wars in Gallia - Julius Ceasar described us as the most brave of the Gallic people. (nice words for perhaps- biggest pain in the a**)

Belgium has also about all the European headquarters offices of the US giants under that flag.

I used imperial since the day I rode my first bicycle and ever since I have the 2 systems combined, because I am living and working next to your door.

Don't get confused, binary has no fractions, don't think upside down. It doesn't work. What I meant is that to add, subtract and process fractions, be it Imperial ones or others , more calculations have to be done than just moving a decimal point.

(add e.g. 1/71 and 1/103)

The Russians claim that the US is younger than the Bolsjoi theater, and once US citizen were mostly Europeans, or do I have it wrong? (a name check explains a lot)

I have nothing against Imperial and use it daily, but for new designs (like starting from scratch) I work metric. Your cars also have already a lot of metric bolts, marks on (native and/or national) Trucks and cars state, 7.5 litre or XXXX cc.

On the other hand, as a world citizen I believe that who doesn't follow, falls behind.

I suggest to watch HBO - real time with..... Most of what I wrote has been stated there and as brainwashed as I get, I find some truth there.

Switching to Metric staggers with the education system and the ability to implement.

In the US a M6 and M8 is mostly more expensive than a 1/4 or 5/16. Just different from more also producing other countries.

I don't intend to offend someone and I think we need to learn from history, not to repeat too many mistakes made. We had Babylon, Fenice, Egypt, Ottomans, Normans (Vikings), Rome and many more later (I spare the details), all with great ideologies.

I thank you for letting me explain some things. D

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#146
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/30/2013 3:33 AM

'....as a world citizen I believe that who doesn't follow, falls behind.....'

.

The problem with this idea is if everybody is following, ultimately, no one is getting anywhere.

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#147
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/30/2013 4:12 AM

What must be recognised is that everyone follows in some fields, and may still lead in others. The leading examples in this thread show what has been achieved in a range of fields. There is still a view from the rest of the world that the imperial system is more difficult to work with and that the US should work towards compatibility with them.

The last company I worked with used Swedish machines (metric) with US components (Imperial), so for the few dozen nuts & bolts which were replaced each year stocks of both were required, and there were issues with use of wrong sizes stripping threads.

One case of following does not mean "no one is getting anywhere", but that the whole can work more effectively together.

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#148
In reply to #147

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/30/2013 6:34 AM

That last comment of mine wasn't about the pros and cons of metric/imperial. It was an expression of my lack of appreciation for platitudes that feign utility.

.

When I read:

"one who doesn't follow, falls behind",

I see a clueless troop, dutifully marching on, each following the one ahead....in a continuous circle. If you are to get anywhere, at least one can't be following.

.

That statement is right up there with:

"There is no 'I' in 'team'!"

WTF? How does the spelling of that word bear any relevance? If you have to support your assertion with non-relevant ancillary drivel like that, doesn't that suggest something about the strength of your position?

.

OK, fine. No 'I' in 'team', huh? But you know what? There is an 'm' and an 'e'.

.

Which is good enough for 'me'.

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#151
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/30/2013 9:44 AM

To complete the picture: I should have written - who doesn't follow the world's evolution. Troops don't seem to bring us nowhere indeed as some people see it.

See e.g. an engineer in electronics, graduated 45 years ago when transistors started to be implemented. Without "upgrades" of new technology, he ends ups being a mummy in that field. I just try to explain my vision, which isn't often always the right one.

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#152
In reply to #145

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/30/2013 11:23 AM

So who's younger...Russia or the US?

Or should I say the Soviet Union or Russia? I mean, "Russia" has changed so much just since 1917 it's hard to keep track of what territory they claim. The US hasn't changed that much except for adding a couple of states since good 'ole WWII.

Apparently Germany adopted the metric system in 1868...Russia not until 1924...funny how the revolution changed that.

The US is still holding out.

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#161
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/31/2013 1:46 PM

Just as information: the Russia, as is now, existed also in the sovjet union (president was Boris Yeltsin) Some of us remember that Gorbatsov was president of the Sovjet Union. At the same time. With the (by the West) organized coup came Yeltsin to rescue.

Besides some earlier "renaming" done after changes of the model, the territory remained mainly the same. The Baltic republics did not all do well after the split and mother Russia helped them out on many occasions.

Russia's richness has always been a thorn in the eye. Many politicians stated that the country was too big for one nation.

Napoleon was there, Hitler and many others before them. Wars however are now more of an economic nature.

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#169
In reply to #145

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/05/2013 7:42 PM

'...I thank you for letting me explain some things. D...'

.

I appreciate that you took the time to thoughtfully respond and support your position.

.

I intended no insult in noting your location in Belgium (though it has now change to the Bahamas...did my comment precipitate that?). Looking back, I can see how it could be misinterpreted.

.

My comment was only intended to note that your suggestion was one of someone recommending (strongly) action of others, and not one compelling action of a group in which they themselves are included.

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#14

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 2:49 PM

Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States until it is financially profitable.

When you wrote "no small task and a big inconvenience", that indirectly means "it would be too costly, without any financial benefit". When international trade overwhelmingly gives an economic advantage to changing, then it will - one way or the other.

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#165
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/03/2013 7:09 PM

Yes, while the rest of the world feels the United States is holding back progress but sticking to its old impirical standards. Tells you what kind of major player the U.S. is.

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#166
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/04/2013 10:26 AM

LOL!...

"Oh the scourge of maintaining empirical standards for data acquisition"

.

.

(i'm giving the benefit of the doubt there, and assuming 'impirical' was intended to mean the same thing as 'empirical'... I make spelling error too.)

.

I don't think there is anything wrong with insisting on holding data acquisition to empirical standards. I'll even argue that forgoing an empirical standard for measurement makes the data less valuable.

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#167
In reply to #166

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/04/2013 1:00 PM

Maybe I meant Margarine..................

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#168
In reply to #167

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/05/2013 7:27 PM

..

You really are keeping me guessing. I thought you were going to claim your misspelling of 'Imperial' resulted coincidentally in something looks (and would be pronounced) more like a misspelling of 'empirical'.

.

But now you suggest that while you really meant 'Margarine' that what you actually type was 'Impirical'.

.

Ironically, believing you meant 'margarine', would require some empirical evidence.

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#171
In reply to #168

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/05/2013 10:19 PM

Sorry, It was the best excuse I could come up with in the amount of time.......

If I have more time I'm sure I can do better.

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#172
In reply to #171

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/05/2013 10:48 PM

Butter.

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#173
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

02/05/2013 11:22 PM

I can't believe it's better.

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#16

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 3:46 PM

Hey I'm ready to change! Imperial Pints for beer.

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#17
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 3:51 PM

I was thinking about liters of beer!

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#18

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 4:17 PM

From wikibooks

"In 1975 the 94th U.S. Congress passed the The Metric Conversion Act. This bill created the United States Metric Board and initiated planning and preparation for metric system conversion. In 1988, President Reagan signed the Omnibus Foreign Trade and Competitiveness Act. This bill required all federal agencies convert, "to the extent economically possible", to the metric system by the end of the 1992 fiscal year, but disbanded the USMB. [4] In 1991 President George H.W. Bush signed Executive Order 12770, reiterating this requirement. While some agencies did convert, the executive order stated that if conversion could "cause significant inefficiencies or loss of markets to United States firms," the requirement was waived. Since this time there have been no further requirements for federal agencies or other groups to convert to the metric system."

After the Bush executive order, we had to include metric dimensions on the drawings for government work although not on the calculations thank goodness, because we had a "feel" for foot pounds but absolutely none for Newton Meters. We worked in Imperial and added the metric dimensions. It became more arcane when we had soft and hard conversions to consider. Initially, the agencies wanted the jobs performed in metric but changed their minds when the engineering companies added the cost of the learning curve to their proposals.

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#36
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 12:47 AM

Back in the late 80's and early 90's, I worked for the Department of Defense. I remember Reagan's Foreign Trade Act. We were concerned about the huge number of old drawings and the difficulty getting comfortable with the metric system - even though we used it extensively in college, getting a grasp on Newton-Meters vs Foot-Pounds would take some getting used to - heck, I still have trouble with Celsius readings (I know body temperature is 98.6 Farenheit, but what is it in Celsius). I agree that metric makes more sense (0 is freezing and 100 is boiling) and when combining mass with volume, it makes even more sense.

I also remember seeing the drawings stamped Metric. From an engineers point of view, I wish everything was metric, but from the point of view of someone who grew up with pounds, feet, yards, gallons, etc, I prefer a dual system. I know that I can go 72 mph in a 65 mph zone and probably not get pulled over, but what if I'm doing 115 km/hr in a 105 km/hr zone? Or I know a Rib Eye steak is about $11/lb, so is $25/kg a good price? And should I buy a 1/4 Pounder at McDonalds or a 1/2 kg burger?

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#37
In reply to #36

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 12:56 AM

You'll have to split that half-key burger four ways!

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#75
In reply to #37

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 2:11 PM

I think you're the only one who got it!

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#76
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 2:13 PM

That's the reason why we won't go completely metric in the US!

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#19

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 5:32 PM

I worked in the R & D department of a large company in the early 80s.

We were told that everything was going to be metric from now on! Rah! Rah!

The first drawings came out with METRIC stamped on them in big letters and we found that all of the shafts were 25.4mm in diameter, standard bolts were 12.7-13, and fillet radii were 6.3r.

It lasted a couple of years until the folks in the field complained enough to make the company revert to imperial units.

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#57
In reply to #19

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 7:52 AM

Very lazy!

Start by deciding to change the dimensions gradually to metric standards (25.4 will become 25mm or 25.5mm or 26mm if the 0.4mm was absolutely necessary ...). What ever tolerance was required can easily be re-worked for the nearest metric round figure or available standards in the industry (metric zones).

For sure, it will take some time for the change to become the norme, 2 generations maybe. The dual system can be tolerated in some fields where the cost of change will need to be amortized for a longer period. But the sooner it is forced in the better on the long run. The Metric system is the easier for computer calculations and interfacing, and the trend is more towards that end! (inch, foot, yards, miles etc have no direct easy relations to make any programing simple: 1.35" is also difficult for someone used to the imperial system! he need to fraction it to have a grasp of it.

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#20

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 6:04 PM

The US will switch to metric when it's in the best interest of manufacturers of home goods, canned, bagged and boxed foods, etc.

For example, I've had to take up cooking now that I'm single. I try to use my wife's old recipe books. So a recipe might call for a 16 ounce can of something. I go to the store to buy it and find that the food companies have downsized to 14 ounce cans.

Then when I get back home I have to grab my calculator to refigure the proportions. (I can see now why there are always new recipes coming out for dishes that have been around for years. The chefs need to update due to the downsizing.)

The food companies can't just downsize forever. At some point they'll bring out 'metric' cans and boxes and bags and have their kitchens publish new menus with proportions using metric measuring cups and utensils.

Likewise I bet if gasoline ever hits an average of above $5 per gallon across the US, some gas stations will switch to metric, $s per liter, to look cheaper.

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#79
In reply to #20

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 2:38 PM

Cooking doesn't have to mean following a recipe exactly. I cook because I like to and none of my recipes ever comes out the same every time. With experience, you learn how to adjust quantities. Oh BTW, never add salt or pepper in quantities called out in a recipe. Always salt/pepper "to taste".

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#21

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 7:14 PM

Base 10 is a good thing. But 1/10 a mm is ~0.004 inch. Too small to mark on a steel rule. Where 1/64 inch can be marked on a steel rule, and is the accuracy need for cabinet making (good enough for me). 1 mm is maybe close enough for rough carpentry. So to me the mm is the wrong size. And changing it is just as hard as the US transitioning to the metric system. I would vote for changing the metric system mm to be equal to 64 mm per inch. Yup it would be a unique bastard metric system. But no more bastard then the meter definition, how the heck anyone would think the distance between the north and south pole was a reference distance!

It does make a difference what size you can see with the unaided human eye. This is my point, I want to be able to do the accuracy of work with tools that can be marked with simple manufacturing techniques, and seen by my eyes. And it would take lots of magnification to see 1/10 a mm, and could not be marked by normal tool methods. Unless you then use 1/2 mm or 1/4 mm, but then your back to where the imperial is today.

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#22

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 8:38 PM

It is amusing that people will argue vehemently for the metric system on the basis that having all measurements base 10 makes it simple.

.

The funny thing is that the metric system doesn't use base ten for all of the measurements. The result is a bastardized system that often results in units that mix measurements in base ten with a non-base ten measurement.

.

And yet, if I propose we make the system pure, such that all measurements are base ten, support withers.

.

If base ten really is the end all, be all (and I certainly see the draw), and it is the main reason you support the Metric system; why wouldn't you support a system in which ALL the measurements are in base 10?

.

.

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#25
In reply to #22

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 10:22 PM

Can you give an example?

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#29
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 11:01 PM

Newton, Joule, Watt, Hertz, Coulomb, Volt, Amp, Ohm, Mho, Tesla, Henry, Weber, Farad, Grey... to name a few.

It would be easier to name the ones that aren't comprised of mixed units...base ten not used for all units, or even the base ten used for no units.

.

Basically anything that includes or is derived from measurements of time is not completely base ten.

.

So are you ready to measure time in base ten?

.

1 second is roughly 11.6 microdays

.

1minute 26.4 seconds is roughly 1 milliday.

.

1 hour is roughly 4.17 centidays.

.

.

If you don't like this idea, what makes base ten such a good idea for other measurements, but something we can pass on for measuring time?

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#30
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 11:08 PM

Yeah, let's just stick with the good ole stuff like furlongs per fortnight for speed, or bushels per hogshead for slurry concentration.

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#31
In reply to #30

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 11:15 PM

bushels per hogshead

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#40
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 1:40 AM

You apparently don't fully appreciate the concept of the decimal system. It does NOT mean that the base value of every measurable quantity must be a factor of 10, but rather that all base values can be expressed in multiples or submultiples which are powers of 10. In other words, you can use the decimal prefixes like deci-, mili-, micro-, mega-, and giga- with any base value and still have meaningful and useful values. Another way to say the same thing is that you can create multiples and submultiples of the base unit simply by moving the decimal point!

For example you can use the prefix milli- with every one of those units you mentioned (with the possible exception of the Grey; did you mean Gray?), and any educated person will understand completely. They are all decimal units.

Whether a particular person will have an instantaneous understanding of any particular unit or submultiple thereof depends entirely on their past experience. I have used both systems most of my life, but I would be better off if I had not been encumbered with the divisions of 12, 16, etc. I have enough experience to be able to estimate in both feet and meters, but when it comes to subdivisions, I'd sure prefer to use milimeters than millifeet. With a quality decimal ruler I can rapidly and pretty reliably estimate to a tenth of a division, but give me a similar ruler divided into multiples of two, and I have to start counting lines.

It is indeed time we caught up with the rest of the world!

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#81
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 2:57 PM

It would be to our advantage if the rest of the world caught up with us. We have been (until recently) the leaders of technology. No one else has ever come close. As is the case now, countries that want to do business with us have to adapt to our Imperial system on such items as plywood and other Imperial basic building blocks.

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#91
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 9:56 PM

The Us is indeed #1 in self-esteem. Scores for other qualties are remarkably different,

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#92
In reply to #40

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 10:12 PM

'...You apparently don't fully appreciate the concept of the decimal system. It does NOT mean that the base value of every measurable quantity must be a factor of 10, but rather that all base values can be expressed in multiples or submultiples which are powers of 10....'

.

Even though my comment was intended tongue in cheek, I probably don't fully appreciate the decimal system. I certainly don't appreciate it to the extent you seem to.

.

You see, one of my failure to fully appreciate the decimal system was that I didn't even mention it in my original comment. Gross (an imperial measure by the way: 144) negligence on my part.

.

Probably more importantly, I didn't appreciate that we were already saved from the peril of not utilizing the decimal system (in large part because I had no idea we were at risk).

.

You have made it clear we are, luckily clear of danger:

.

'...rather that all base values can be expressed in multiples or submultiples which are powers of 10....'

.

Wow! That was a close one, but I double checked and we are, in fact, able to express all base values as multiples or sub-multiples of ten. I was buying diesel last night and noted that the measurement in gallons was conveniently expressed in 100ths of a gallon for example.

.

The neat thing is that whatever the base unit is it can be expressed as multiples or sub-multiples of base ten: Even if I happen to misspell the word as you pointed out:

'....(with the possible exception of the Grey; did you mean Gray?)...'

.

You can even use '....decimal prefixes like deci-, mili-, micro-, mega-, and giga- ...'

(with the possible exception of 'mili'; did you mean 'milli'?)

.

(The rest of your message was pretty clear, with the possible exception of 'submultiple', did you mean 'sub-multiple'?)

.

.

OK, in summary, thank you for pointing out that we are safe from a danger that was neither threatening nor being discussed.

.

'...Any educated person will understand completely...' the value of your contribution.

.

.

Just as an interesting side note: The French nationalized a base 10 time system around the time of their revolution. It was complete disaster and they quickly reverted to the time system we use today.

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#54
In reply to #29

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 6:37 AM

Don't forget to mention that the units for time are inextricably mixed with the units for conventional angular measure, both having their roots in the ancient Babylonian Base 60 system. You'll have to re-vamp that, too. One attempt on the angular front is Gradians; 400 of 'em per circle. That's the 'grad' symbol you see on your scientific calculator. I've never had the occasion to use grads, except to run errands. Undergrads are even worse.

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#86
In reply to #54

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 3:38 PM

We're fixing that right now. 100 seconds per minute, 100 minutes per hour, 20 hours per day. We'll be laying waste to your work ethic.

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#94
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 11:32 PM

The current units for time and angular measure have definitely been closely associated for a very long time. Analog clocks mimic sun dials.

Notwithstanding any of Kurt Godel's machinations, is there a compelling reason, beyond mimicking movement of a clock (or spinning of the planet), that time should be associated with angular measure?

A trundle wheel can be convenient for measuring distances, but we don't insist on binding any of the other dimensions to angular measure.

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#27

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 10:48 PM

Use universal units, such as pulgares, or "Just move it over a c.h."

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#32

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 11:41 PM

Using Imperial and Metric systems is no big problem. In Mexico we have been doing it for decades. Although Metric shall be used by law, we use US standard dimensions for many materials such as steel, but expressed in mm. For instance, we can buy screws and bolts in inches or number size (N° 8 x 1 1/4 screw) labeled with the equivalent mm dimensions. Also we can buy metric standard bolts in the same store (10 mm dia x 50 mm long) which of course are not compatible with the closest US standard sizes. Plywood is sold in 122 x 244 cm sheets (4x8 feet) in 13, 15, 19, 25 mm etc. thickness (rounded figures for 1/2", 5/8", 3/4" or 1"). No problem at all.

But using the Imperial system for distances may create confusions: when using miles to indicate astronomical distances, are we talking of Statute or Nautical miles? This detail may be expensive: a NASA Mars exploring vehicle failed because with international scientific cooperation, the approaching speed was measured in metric by some instruments and in Imperial by others. Result? the vehicle crashed on the Martian surface wasting millions of dollars.

About international trade, take in consideration that all countries use metric. US is the only exception. But metric has been invading the US industry without the public noting it. My Chevrolet Malibu has all bolts in metric standard sizes.

There are some international agreements to use mixed systems: Airplane altitude is expressed in feet and speed in knots all over the world (even for european planes).

there is another advantage of the coexistence of both systems: it helps to excersie the mind and delay Alzheimer.

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#33
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/24/2013 11:49 PM

Didn't work too well at NASA, though....

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#73
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 1:26 PM

That also did not work for Air Canada in 1983. Someone calculated fuel in pounds when they should have used kilograms. See Gimli Glider.

USA is still hanging on to most Imperial Units (one of two countries left in the world). But a lot of things use Imperial in everyday use. Soccer nets are 8 feet by 24 feet even though most of the world uses metric. Germany tried to change a few years ago but it was too costly and they needed a consensus from FIFA. In Canada lumber is Imperial for the most part. It is SI units that can confuse things again by adding little twists like Joules unless you can relate. I can relate to L/100km for fuel efficiency instead of miles/gal. It is also much easier to calculate in metric. Also twisted, an American gallon is different than an imperial gallon, grr. Ten pounds of water in a gallon, yes or no?

I would like to see everyone drive on the right side of the road and declare that metric. Metric is right, right?

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#34

Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 12:24 AM

In Australia, we changed to the metric system, starting in the 70's. It was done in a staged way, eg liters for fuel, then km for road signs, then the building industry. Can't remember the exact details. Yes, it was a bit painful at first, but we adapted fairly quickly.

Old guys like me can still "think" in both systems pretty much but the younger generation has trouble with it. They find it awkward to read American material expressed in the imperial system.

The problem you mention with "building blocks" does occur, for example if we buy a sheet of plywood, perspex or steel, it can be 2400 x 1200 mm if it has been made for metric countries, but we can sometimes get the same product that has been made for the American market and then it will be 2440x1220, ie 8 ft x 4ft. You always need to check what you are getting.

You know, it would be much appreciated by us in the rest of the world if you Americans would just bite the bullet and do it, then we will all be on the same page.

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#35
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 12:43 AM

I think that is a reasonable request, to get everyone in line.... As long as everyone else is willing to give up the half-commitment to a base ten system, and fully commit to a full base-ten system...

..

What do you think? Could we commit to having it started in a kiloday and complete in three kilodays?

..

No need to answer right away. Think it over for a centiday, and answer when you feel comfortable.

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#45
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 5:02 AM

The French did try decimal time (and ten day weeks) after the revolution but they soon gave it up:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Republican_Calendar#Decimal_time

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#38
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 1:02 AM

I'm with you sport.

Oz introduced mandatory vehicle seatbelts - no important complaints.

We introduced gun laws - no important complaints.

We introduced metric with very little imperial left - no important complaints.

It comes down to two things, attitude and conservatism.

When UK lost the American colonies, Oz got the characters who used to ship to Virginia as indentured labour, miscreants who mostly turned out to be non-conservative larrikins, and it got run-of-the-mill ordinary joes. The new US appeared to have and to get many conservative groups running from eg religious persecution, who neither wanted to change or adapt.

In Oz, changes have been accepted where the compromises that had to be made were reasonable. It would appear that there is enough conservatism in US that large changes cannot be readily implemented. As China and India rise, and the US declines, this may no longer be a good position.

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#42
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 4:05 AM

I don't see how. Our pages are 8.5x11" and you guys use A4. :-)

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#83
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 3:05 PM

Australia is a small (population wise) country compared to the U.S. A complete change-over to metrics would be a hercullian task for us.

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#84
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/25/2013 3:30 PM

... so the cost of the change will be shared by lots more people, and the benefits will eventually reach lots more people!

It's painfully slow! 50 years ago I thought it would happen in 10 or 20 years. Perhaps it will take most of a century, but as more and more companies and other organizations become international in nature, more and more executives are bound to learn the advantages of a single standard. At some point, we will reach the 'critical mass', and it will be easy from then on. That point may well not be during my lifetime, but I still have hope...

Many modern measuring instruments and production machines can be changed to metric by the flip of a switch, and I'd love to flip them permanently.

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#109
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 4:25 AM

Not only, the U.S. embraced industry and technology wholesale very early on when the Imperial system was predominant and so we have a huge industrial infrastructure to change over. So much easier to pull off when your entire continent's population is that of Texas or, better yet, Mexico City's, no? So much for conservatism and resistance to change. And those stick-in-the-mud religious fugitives' descendants have landed how many craft on Mars again, please? And General Patton's tanks swore by Imperial measure, I believe, for anyone who's interested and who'd otherwise be posting in Deutch? (even if you are from the UK) Somebody called it inertia? No, not inertia, momentum.

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#111
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:00 AM

Nobody here is trying to force the USA to go in a particular direction, they would just like the USA to decide, all on its own, to follow one or the other. Not both.

I personally see no need to convert all drawings already in use or parts (as some spares will still be needed), but all new products should follow the decided route....

The UK made the decision many years ago for metric, and Imperial was even more deeply rooted there than anywhere else! That is where it started!!

Buying Imperial wrenches is still possible, but are usually a special order....

Sweden many years ago changed from driving on the left, to driving on the right, because most of their cars had the driver sitting on the left anyway (and they were also one of the few European countries that Napoleon did not conquer which had made the problem if you will....)

That was a complicated thing to arrange (heavy traffic on day 1, private cars on day 2!!), though having a tiny population probably helped....

Everything is possible.......if you plan properly.....

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#112
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:10 AM

I dislike Imperial measure and far prefer metric myself, in part because in my work I'm rarely called upon to use Imperial measure, working in SI units for the most part. Probably my biggest gripe is personal one; I like to cook, and cookbooks/recipes here use Imperial measure exclusively. Can you say "Royal Pain in the Arse?"

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#113
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 5:39 AM

That's what the internet is for: just download recipes in English from this side of the pond, then all you have to do is translate the ingredients list.

We use empirical formulae for most common recipes. Basic crumble topping for desserts is 3:2:1.5, flour, sugar, fat. Use any grade of flour, any type of sugar, and butter/spread as preferred. Each change affects the recipe, but experimentation to find your preference is part of the fun. It was interesting to see the different measuring systems each child came up with!

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#116
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 10:51 AM

Come on Andy! It would be totally ridiculous, arrogant, isolationist, and short-sighted for the USA to drop everything metric and go entirely Imperial. With the exception of bulk goods, both our exports and our imports could go nowhere but down. The ONLY logical change is for the USA to phase out Imperial and switch to SI. There is no third alternative that I'm aware of, so why don't we get on with it?

Perhaps 'force' is too strong a word, but I can't imagine anyone outside the USA encouraging movement away from SI, and I have to think anyone inside the USA who still does not want to move toward full use of SI is either poorly educated, arrogant, short-sighted, or some combination of the three.

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#117
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Re: Why The Metric System Will Never Replace The Imperial System In The United States

01/27/2013 11:00 AM

'...anyone inside the USA who still does not want to move toward full use of SI is either poorly educated, arrogant, short-sighted, or some combination of the three....'

.

Straw- ad hominem attack?

.

interesting.

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