Energy, Food for Thought

this should answer most of your question http://www.gizmag.com/artificial-leaf-self-healing/27004/

Comes out of a packet. Snip off the corner, pour into a deep bowl, add two cups of water and leave to stand for 2 hrs.

All very interesting. Not sure how Chinese tariffs on solar panels is any different than the tariff on steel imposed by "the decider", the predecessor of the current man in office.

It should come as no surprise to anyone that China is playing fast and loose with manufacturing costs.

It's just politics, as usual. Only the skin color has changed.

As for the swimming pool saving the world, I'll stay connected to the big, bad grid for now.

Solar concentrator produces fresh water, AC and energy 25 Sep, 2014 \\ No Comment Summary: IBM Research and Switzerland-based Airlight Energy today announced a new parabolic dish that increases the sun's radiation by 2,000 times while also producing fresh water and air conditioning..... http://www.wattelectricalnews.com/IICA/Solar-concentrator-produces-fresh-water,-AC-and-energy/20276/14 Are you talking about the same thing here?

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/09/140916132519.htm First water-based nuclear battery can be used to generate electrical energy Date: September 16, 2014 Source: University of Missouri-Columbia Summary: For the first time using a water-based solution, researchers have created a long-lasting and more efficient nuclear battery that could be used for many applications such as a reliable energy source in automobiles and also in complicated applications such as space flight. A few of these little gems would be handy. Also see: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/06/130619195221.htm A battery made of wood? Also: sliver of wood coated with tin could make a tiny, long-lasting, efficient and environmentally friendly battery. A battery made of wood? Date:June 19, 2013 Source:University of Maryland Summary:A sliver of wood coated with tin could make a tiny, long-lasting, efficient and environmentally friendly battery, say scientists. Plug into a tree near you!

Energy-dense sugar battery created Date: January 21, 2014 Source: Virginia Tech Summary: A new sugar battery that could be on the market and powering the world's gadgets in three years has an energy density and order of magnitude higher than others. So why are the Chinese doing all this inventing and why are we not seeing these items on the market?

your links could be improved

I agree they could, Pity Editor works sporadically and messes up the paragraphs. It does make it a pain in the behind to read. But you are intelligent and can work it out by careful reading.

Alas, their is someone else in control conforming me to their ways. Hopefully this turns out just fine.

I resisted saying it, but he doesn't have a clue about posting links and activating them, and often only one convoluted paragraph......

Almost unreadable!! Not they are worth reading usually!!

So..........here's an idea.

We've already got pipelines running all over the US, right?

We know that hydrogen and oxygen burn nicely, right?

We know that we can generate electricity with solar panels, but only when the sun is shining, right?

Why don't we run salt water pipelines from the east coast, west coast, and the gulf, use solar panels to make hydrogen during the day, liquefy and store it, and use the hydrogen to run turbines at night?

I'd suggest that the reason we're not already a hydrogen nation is because, due to it's simplicity, there are no patents to be had, there is no possible way to create a monopoly, and because it's so cheap and abundent, the utilities would only be able to charge people $50 -$75 a month, regardless of the size of the home.

No profit motive..... and without big profits, politicians can't be bought.

I really don't want to hear another word about global warming.

yes! hydrogen burns

Browns Gas does not burn really....

It explodes!!

and leaves a dangerous residue.

Water!!

Joking, but it does explode!!

To get Browns Gas only to burn require some clever tchniques.

An easy one is to keep the two gases separate, therefore its not HHO anymore.....

Wiki says:-

Brown's gas^[4] and HHO are fringe science terms for a 2:1 mixture of oxyhydrogen; its proponents claim that it has special properties.

A pure stoichiometric mixture may be obtained by water electrolysis, which uses an electric current to dissociate the water molecules:

electrolysis: 2 H₂O → 2 H₂ + O₂
combustion: 2 H₂ + O₂ → 2 H₂O

William Nicholson was the first to decompose water in this manner in 1800. The energy required to generate the oxyhydrogen always exceeds the energy released by combusting it, even at maximum efficiency, the input energy of a closed system will always equal the output energy, as the first law of thermodynamics states. (See Electrolysis of water#Efficiency).

I rest my case.....

The cost (even in China) for enough Solar cells to make large enough amounts daily for any countries electricity supply night and day would probably beggar that country....plus the area needed would be huge....

A dramatic increase in the efficiency of the cells (reducing the area needed), combined with a dramatic drop in their manufacturing costs (far cheaper!) are needed before its worth buying. It will hopefully come, there are some signs from various areas, but not yet deliverable....my bet is on graphene....but other techniques are also being studied..

We know that hydrogen and oxygen burn nicely, right?
Wrong!!!!
As well illustrated...........hydrogen, YES...........oxygen, NO
Oxygen does not burn, but, it supports combustion.........no oxygen........no burn, even hydrogen, which is highly flammable. It also has a wide explosive or flammability range, from about 12-74% (this depends where you look, as variations occur) by volume in air...........but, no oxygen - no bang.........me so sorry!!!

Kram, remember this entire thing was motivated by 3rd world poor people. a machine/device that can take polluted water and in an afternoon convert it to potable water and stored energy for on demand use including at night is a major break through for millions that have far less than you

Yes Fredski, and Lockheed Martin is world renowned for their humanitarian efforts...when they're not building weapons of mass destruction for the US government.

Just sayin'.

The only way I'll feel assured that this is truly altruistic, is for Bill Gates to get involved.

as a collective you guys disappoint me. in my post #21 beginning around the 40 minute mark you see how Star Trek-like this is as it self cleans and reassembles like nothing before it in any type of water no matter how dirty the water. at about 50 minutes you see the magic of water splitting with mere sunlight. you're getting oxygen and hydrogen! this is not as simplistic as a home generator. think space travel and colonization. why this zipped past everyone baffles me, must be the boring chem lecture this is amazing stuff! I hope you open your mind and watch this video again, its really powerful information that will affect our lives. I suggest to take the time to check it out

<unsubscribe>

I'm back. The martini's caused a mental short circuit over the weekend. Oops.

I just watched Nocera's entire talk, and he promised to smash the grid and personalize energy with a solar panel and a $100 generator for the average home.

Here's todays news on Lockheed's acquisition.

http://www.bethesdamagazine.com/Bethesda-Beat/2014/Lockheed-Martin-Buys-Company-Developing-Power-Grid-Batteries/

Nocera's message was the polar opposite of developing massive flow batteries to place into the existing grid.

I rest my case.

I still maintain that if it's too cheap to produce we'll never see it at all, and Lockheed will be rewarded for their loyalty with fat contracts in other areas.

If the president gets both houses again in November, Cap & Trade will be the next Obamacare. It will hit us so fast it will make our heads spin, and it will be the single most massive ripoff of the American public in history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqHL404zhcU

If Nocera is right about his flow battery, which looks like it was already ready to be mass produced for the homeowner...all of that money goes out the window.

With the global Cap and Trade that the elite control freaks are proposing, and with the blessing of the UN, we are talking about trillions of dollars. I believe that this is the reason that the climate change rhetoric is ramping up to a high pitched squeal.

A lot of work has been put into this monumental theft, the money has already been earmarked to fuel the socialist agenda for decades to come, and they are getting scared that it's all going to collapse.

ok Krameister. please watch thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J556uXwrjII

and yes, the website explains all their projects including flow batteries, that isn't what will make the fortune!

I think we can rest assured that the "grid" isn't going anywhere.

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/us/news/press-releases/2012/january/isgs-0124-dominion-edge.html

Maybe Lockheed just really likes grids. This sounds like a hostile takeover with a little help from Washington:

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20121022/C4ISR01/310220011/After-snagging-4-6B-contract-Lockheed-plans-8216-cyber-kill-chain-8217-Global-Information-Grid

From what I could tell, Lockeed bought up everything...which would include the artificial leaf technology.

Can you imagine Nocera's shock when he read his NDA and saw that he was precluded from ever mentioning "personalized" energy again?

Oh well. Just another jaded cynic I suppose.

I'm far more a fan of the power of science to allow myself to huddle in the dark recesses of a cave of pessimism. hydrogen from water is in our future, electric autonomous cars will be seen and used by us in our lives,

How can you say that you're not pessimistic?

You started the thread with a video of a guy that I would consider a hero, and now we know that his vision of "personalized" enegy will never be a reality.

Lockheed has been tapped to buy up every bit of his technology, with the express purpose of keeping us all tied to the grid.

I went from elated to disgusted.

WHERE ARE THE FACTS TO SUPPORT ANY OF YOUR STATEMENTS?

If you had ONE single verifiable fact to support your "theory", you would have posted it.

But you didn't!!

It smacks of the start of a new conspiracy theory to me.....

But do not forget, even if Lockheed eventually decide that it isn't worth following up in some way, THAT IS THEIR CHOICE IN A RELATIVELY FREE COUNTRY!!

NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT! Even just complaining is a waste of YOUR energy!

Inventing your own version may be a way to go if it gets forgotten by Lockheed.....

I find it most fascinating that you accept something should be done about using clean energy, yet deny others the right to support the notion. You have Google, use it, look things up yourself rather than demanding proof. There is more than enough proof out there. Bias! My goodness. Divide and conquer, they have achieve this easily and they have your full support.

I think that the best answer I can give to anyone who thinks as you do, is the following:-

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,

to have the courage to change the things I can

and the wisdom to know the difference!

Its obviously something you have neither heard about or thought about!!! You should change that, its actually a life changing and character forming quote, or better said, it can be!!

Have a great day anyway.......

From my earlier link:

The renamed company, Lockheed Martin Advanced Energy Storage, will report to Lockheed Martin's Missiles and Fire Control Business

Nocera didn't seem as interested in getting rich, as he was in changing the world.

Assuming Nocera wasn't lying about his technology, it's a shame that it couldn't at least be released to help bring cheap electricity to people in third world countries.

Well, one thing is spreading across Africa, and it ain't cheap electricity.

http://trendsupdates.com/radical-islamists-spreading-across-africas-sahara-belt/

So I guess I should stop sounding like a left wing tree hugger, accept the things I can't change, and remember what Lockheed's core business is.

Armed conflict is a necessary component for healthy profits. Go America!!!

http://dailycaller.com/2014/09/30/admin-loosens-restrictions-on-syrian-civilian-deaths-video/

Sadly, these types of "Radicals" have always hidden themselves next to families of civilians, knowing that the US would think twice before attacking them.

It was a policy developed by the Nazis in WW they sometimes put POW camps around important military installations, hoping to put off attacks by the Allies.....but RAF precision bombing kept casualties down....usually!

I still don't understand your point here fully, but thanks for the two links.

As of now, Lockheed has bought this technology by buying the company, right?

Have Lockheed in any way shape or form said that they want to suppress it? Link please. I do not see that anywhere mentioned.

Do not forget that in a free(er) society, a company has the right to develop or not to develop something that they own. Its their choice. Not yours. Unless you buy the company!!

Thats what you get for having a basically "free" society.....S.I.U.

In the second link, what Obarma said, may not have rocked your boat in a nice way, and it may spur on many to make themselves more energy careful and self sufficient, but its not a lie, it appears to be the truth and not just for the USA either!!

I have over many years changed lighting and heating styles to reduce our usage of electricity and fossil fuel. We have saved more than 50% on heating costs alone over 28 years, not even taking into account inflation, which would have made it even more impressive....

If I had been younger and more interested, I could have done even better, but what I don't want is my own generator anywhere near me, or one from my neighbours running say late at night because Dallas is on a re-run and the house batteries are low!!!

As pointed out on many sites, a grid tie allows slightly simpler electronic control of power and frequency when generating your own power and can reduce the need for storage systems to zero! No poisonous huge amounts of lead acid batteries for example. Dallas can be watched in the middle of the night without annoying the neighbours!! As long as its not too loud!!!

Or a windmill going "chuff, chuff, chuff" night and day.....I like my quiet.....so I stay on grid.

I know I am not alone....

We can argue about percentages all day long, but I would be VERY surprised if even 10% of the population would accept that noise and possible smell from a private generator nearby.

Nor the noise of a windmill when you are 500 yards downwind of one and the wind is blowing hard enough to turn the blades, as I already mentioned. THEY ARE LOUD!!!

I quite liked this Wiki article:-

Living off the grid

But generally in the USA, you are prevented from going off grid it would seem, so you either have to accept that, or get the law changed, or fight city hall, or leave!!!

What a choice????

See here for example:-

off grid survival

I personally have no interest in going Off Grid.....I am sure that many are of a similar idea.....

By trying to fight city hall head on (as many want to do it would seem!), I am reminded of an old, old joke, that I was too young (4 0r 5 maybe!) to fully understand the first time I heard it:-

Kid number 1 to kid number 2.

"Why are you banging your head against the wall?"

Kid number 2 to kid number 1.

"Its really great when I stop!!"

Lockheed is going to take technology that was specifically designed to allow us to go off grid, expand it, and implement it into the grid.

The product that was originally mentioned in Fredsky's OP, will never see the light of day.

Maybe I'm the only one that watched the video and noticed Nocera's passion for enabling people to get off the grid, which he described as "stupid".

Maybe I'm the only one that heard Nocera talk about "personalized" energy, and having come up with cheap, easily producible units for the home.

Maybe I'm the only one that has noticed that the entire narrative has changed.

It seems obvious, but maybe not.

http://storage.pv-tech.org/news/lockheed-martin-buys-into-mit-flow-battery-spinoff

Nocera signed on with India's Tata Group in 2010 to commercialize his product, which he said in his video would be ready in a year.

Now it's 2014, nothing has been built or commercialized, and Lockheed owns everything.

These guys actually use the graphic from the video, and then go on to say that Lockheed doesn't seem to be interested in the hydrogen, just the flow battery.

http://americanmachinist.com/news/lockheed-buys-hydrogen-capturestorage-venture

"...These guys actually use the graphic from the video, and then go on to say that Lockheed doesn't seem to be interested in the hydrogen, just the flow battery...."

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You are using the opinion of Robert Brooks, a writer for American Machinist, as evidence to support your theory that Lockheed is definitely going to suppress the artificial leaf technology?

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Here is the quote you seem to be referring to:

"...Its description of Sun Catalytix as a company "developing an affordable, durable, safe and scalable energy storage technology" suggests its interest in more focused on the potential fuel cells than on the hydrogen capture possibilities...."

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It seems pretty clear that Robert Brooks does not have an inside scoop on the intent to suppress the technology. Rather, he is offering an interpretation from Lockheed's description of the company. Even if we were to believe his interpretation held some special insight, he did not say they were not interested in hydrogen, only that they seemed more focused on potential fuel cells.

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You seem to be going to great lengths to convince yourself that what you suspect is a possibility is a foregone conclusion.

This should pretty much sum up the reasons that I've pointed out, along with the cost.

I want one of Nocera's $100 units, but a defense contractor has made that an impossibility. No more talk about climate change being the single greatest threat to the US and the planet. It's a lie.

http://solarpowerauthority.com/how-much-does-it-cost-to-install-solar-on-an-average-us-house/

You'll notice a picture at the top of the page that is representative of a standard installation. Does it appear to be configured like a basketball hoop or clothesline?

Since the panel doesn't allow rain through, it's considered an impervious surface. I'm already over my allotted space, and putting panels on my roof would require, not only bringing my structure up to handling it, butting cutting down about 7 old growth oak trees, which I'm not willing to do.

Inexpensive electricity for everyone!

Hmm..........maybe not.

http://aviationweek.com/defense/insitu-lockheed-pursuing-fuel-cell-power-uavs

reviewing this breakthrough on Youtube I see many copycats claiming credit for getting hydrogen from water. only Nocera is using cobalt in his catalyst but the cat is out of the bag now. low power from solar panels split water. so far only Nocera has a self cleaning design. all the others have build ups that require cleaning/maint. its only a matter of time now for a hydrogen revolution to be a widely available cheap used fuel. will we have home electrical stations? probably not anytime soon

I'm leaning in the other direction. As far as the US government has moved toward a command and control, revenue collection, self preservation at all costs attitude, I don't think they will be able to suppress this technology.

I haven't had time to look up Nocera's patents, but if they are still available, anybody can copy his design as long as it isn't for commercial use. Somebody will put this stuff out on the internet and the US government won't be able to stop it...it's only a matter of time.

I agree wholeheartedly with Nocera. It's time for the grid as we know it to be torn down, and while they can control the US population, they can't stop the rest of the world from moving on.

http://privatepowerplant.net/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEpvVxeZUkg

Eventually the hard core radical greenies will go nuts, march on Washington, start bombing power stations, and whatever it takes to get "the man" to tell the truth.

http://www.greenoptimistic.com/2010/03/14/cobalt-catalyst-water-oxidation/#.VCxoWRbKTjY

I'm not smart enough to do it on my own, but Nocera has left a pretty good trail of breadcrumbs.

http://phys.org/news/2013-12-catalyst-solar-powered-hydrogen-production.html

Don't be surprised if China embarrasses the hell out of us by claiming that they have solved the looming specter of global warming planetary death.

http://chem.scichina.com:8081/sciBe/EN/10.1007/s11426-010-4081-1

good stuff! I think I converted you! love thw ACTA, its tiny @ 4KW/day.....needs to be around 30 for US

I didn't need converting.

Nocera's was very convincing, and if it had no merit Lockheed wouldn't have bought it for a huge, (undisclosed), sum of money.

I knew immediately that Lockheed had no intention of supplying us little people with a way off the grid, and I seriously doubt we will see it at all.

I'd guess that the flow battery is a good way to keep drones flying.

An update you may like to hear of, the link you provided for Hydica, I have followed up with the MD. He is in Norway. He has just informed me that they are busy in the USA with sales. Might be worth looking around, as it is on the go there. So it is available for you to buy and use.

Oh no! What are you going to do, Kramarat? What if it actually is available to you?

You must be devastated. My deepest condolences for your loss...of something to feel wronged about.

I know you probably feel it is too early to even think about finding something new to feel slighted about, but cheer up, hold you head up. In no time at all you will be bringing around a new conspiratorial delusion of persecution, and you will have forgotten all about how you were unfairly denied this vital bit of technology.

bring on the hydrogen economy and kiss gas burning cars good-bye!

Update:

I think I've found a Lockheed "partner" that may be able to help pressure them into telling the truth about their plans for Nocera's technology. Anything less than "personalized" energy, is unacceptable.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/12/us/12burlington.html?ref=&_r=0

I've just emailed the editor of the Burlington Free Press. I included a link to Nocera's video from the OP, along with links to the Lockheed aquisition, and have asked them to cover the story.

This isn't a right or left issue. If Nocera's device works, (and I think it does), and the US government/ Lockheed is deliberately suppressing it, it's time to shine light on it.

actually... the link you posted about Vermont was telling. I think they were carefully selected. I bet Lockheed will be heroic to that area very soon with widespread acceptance of their "energy division. not necessarily their entire business.

The proof will be in the pudding.

There will be acceptance if the hydrogen concept is implemented. Don't forget, this acquisition has been folded into the Missile Division, not the energy division.

Seems to me, that even if this technology were going to be used as a grid based solution, it would would be front page news and splashed across every TV station as the answer to global warming. I hear nothing but crickets.

Why isn't president Obama holding a press conference, or using an executive order to make this technology available to everyone...as Nocera envisioned?

good points but as you know our economy is intertwined and energy is deep within the fabric. Exxon wont cease tomorrow and be replaced by 2 solar panels on your roof. its a progressive transition, patience Grasshopper

I stand corrected. Tinac has been right all along, he just had his "wings" mixed up.

Rush stated today that only a few black people and far left idiot progressives believe that the the US government has/ had anything to do with Ebola.

So there you have it. I was wrong, and Rush and Tinac nailed it.

I see that colon cleanse worked for you

Yep. Hanging out with colons on online forums makes me feel dirty...a good cleansing works every time.

I've managed to find the most information yet, in one place.

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/519316/startup-shows-off-its-cheaper-grid-battery/

Here's another that has shown promise.

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/424211/startups-battery-could-provide-cheaper-grid-storage/

They are currently tied up with the DOD and Raytheon.

http://www.virtual-strategy.com/2013/01/23/primus-power-receives-department-defense-energy-storage-system-demonstration-contract#axzz3F6nKu3Qt

What happened to climate change being the biggest threat?

I don't think Nocera had anything to do with selling out to Lockheed....

http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512071/sun-catalytix-seeks-second-act-with-flow-battery/

The goal is to produce an inexpensive, self-contained system that could be built from abundant materials. Nocera has long advocated such devices as a means of bringing electricity to billions of people, mostly in the developing world, who now have little or no access to it.

http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2013/artificial-leaf-efficiency-0304

The original paper, or one of them:

http://www.pnas.org/content/110/12/E1076

Cool!

You can download and save the entire file as a PDF here, which I just did.

http://www.pnas.org/content/110/12/E1076.full.pdf+html?with-ds=yes

Lockheed is "all in", energy....including batteries

Dude!

Look at the links above. I was just wondering how they integrated the hydrogen into a flow battery without the need for storage, or very little storage, and I think I found it!

http://phys.org/news/2014-02-proton-battery-advances-hydrogen-power.html

Can you tell that I want one of these systems?

At least Nocera found a good home at Harvard.

http://phys.org/news/2014-01-mega-battery-breakthrough-renewable-energy.html

The grid based talk is fine for the big cities. I still say that a grid that is comprised of millions of suburban and rural homes would be the ultimate answer.

looks like a lot of LED lights for your home are in your future(DC current). a quick look shows me the OZZIES have your best system, in any way you look at it hydrogen from water is hust about to burst onto our way of lifehttp://www.gizmag.com/proton-flow-battery-hydrogen-electricity-rmit/30818/

We're gonna look pretty silly imposing a carbon tax to fix Washington's spending problem, while the rest of the planet is running on hydrogen.

Uh...let me be clear! Will will lead the world in stopping climate change, by imposing a huge new tax on our citizens.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/papers/2013/03/12-carbon-tax-gale

At least he understands that being the world's arms supplier and dropping bombs, is good for America's bottom line.

The drug war is still in full swing too, including harsher penalties for simple possession.

http://reason.com/blog/2012/04/17/obamas-new-drug-control-report-calls-for

I have read most of your weblinks (thanks) on HHO and although I still disagree about your take with regard to Lockheed as to whether they will bury it or not (let us wait and see!), the method certainly seems to work and depending upon cost and possible life, it could be a great technology for energy in the future...

Even if Lockheed goes nowhere with it, it looks as though the technology is understood by others and it won't get buried....let's see....

Thanks for drawing my attention to it.

Sweet! I just put in my "buy" order.

http://www.standard.net/Business/2014/09/27/Defense-Firms-in-U-S-Rising-to-Record-on-Syria-to-Ukraine-Wars.html

Life is good. Obama rocks!

you're buying AN f-22?

if you think the neighbors have issues with hanging solar panels just wait till you park this in front of the house!

Stock son! I was talking about stock.

Lockheed Martin is a publicly traded, (fully transparent), company.

God bless President Obama, and God bless America!

Your update on carbon tax: Australia dropped that silly tax last month. Reduced the costs on families. They also dropped the mining tax.

I think you'll look good in this one

Once I buy a few shares of Lockheed stock, they'll send me the plans. They have to be completely open with shareholders.

for the Raptor or the electrolyzer?

I love the look of this aircraft, that is one really "BAD" boy!!! It simply looks dangerous just sitting there!!

I would be proud to be able to annoy the neighbors by parking one in the yard.

But my wife would have a fit!!! WHO CARES?

Dear God,

Is it normal to masturbate to war pigs?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nxgtk_3qwXw

Yes my Son.

Dear God,

Is Obama the man to deliver death to these sand fleas?

Yes my Son. He is the one.

But God. They told me Bush was a murderer...how is this different?

Collective salvation my Son. Hundreds of millions will die, but it will be for the greater good of mankind.

Oh.

I hope a few eyes and minds were opened by this thread, a revolution in energy is just beginning even as closed minds fail to grasp the obvious......I'm glad I posted this thread

Great thread. Loved it. Learned much and it opened an avenue, had fun and some great craic.

Great thread Fredski. I learned a lot.

I guess an outsider could read between the lines and educate themselves, but why skip over the entertainment?

I dare anyone to find anything on TV this fun.

PS- I don't ever want to hear anyone talk bad about my president again.

He's managed to turn Bush's wars into a guaranteed perpetual mess, and the true salvation of the once threatened military industrial complex.

Buy Lockheed stock now! It's better than gold.

Feeling a little sad about civilian casualties?

DON'T

President Obama has relaxed the rules. Yeah baby...my president.

Lets roll!

Tinac, tornado, solareagle, Lyn and anyone else that I've offended by talking bad about our president...I'm truly sorry. You guys were right all along. He's a real cowboy!

Ebola in Texas?

Not a problem. FEMA's got it covered.

Wait...is Texas a blue state?

No kramarat, but the president has just ordered a protective dome to be placed over Austin. He likes the music.

"...and anyone else that I've offended by talking bad about our president...I'm truly sorry. You guys were right all along....."

.

Oh, Kramarat, I doubt anyone is incensed specifically at any 'bad' things you say about the President. There is a perturbing quality about your tendency to assign opinions to others that they have not indicated, in no small part due to the fact they do not actually hold these opinion. Your nearly non-existent standards for vetting an accusation or hypothesized motivation of others, before making such a claim, is becoming tedious, particularly in that you show negligible interest in modifying that unfortunate shortcoming in your MO.

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'Offended' doesn't capture it. Closer would be embarrassed for you at the degrading lack of respect you display for the integrity of your word.

GA

Talking of GAs, look at the number of GAs that K has received in comparison to yourself for example!

More people have supported you than them (especially if you take away a GA for every Off Topic scored!!)

You have 6 x double or more GAs and 12 single GAs

Kramarat has 1 x double GA and 14 single, so he has at least one fan!! I wonder who?

Well done.

I always wonder how much mentioning something like voluntary recognition/rating system, like the GA voting here in CR4, affects the results of such a system.

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Apparently, in the time between you making note of the GA rating tally, and my looking at the tally just prior to posting this, the count changed drastically. It appears that the change could have been accomplished by just that single fan of Kramarat's argument. In my count, itt appears 5 of the double GA were reduced by one to just a single GA and a couple single GA also were countered. The popularity of Kramarat's lead his single GA count to jump up into the 20s. Note that no new double GA occurred. Certainly seems like the work of someone who had already upvoted Ks comments.

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I do appreciated getting a GA rating for a decent comment, but I very rarely look at my GA tally under my name.....though I did just now, and noticed it was the same number as another number on my page.... your GA tally. So for the moment we are cosmic GA tally twins.....back to the point: I don't care what my total is, but it is interesting to have another data point which would suggest mentioning GA tally might be a strong motivator for some people to attempt to influence that tally. I'm glad we have the opportunity to notice the evidence of the correlation.

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WOW!

It looks like I tallied your GAs JUST IN TIME, (something I have never ever done before) to show that there is probably just a single person at work......naturally, he won't stand up to be counted!!! Those sort never do...... but I have a REALLY good idea who it is.

No great brain power needed for that either!! I am sure that you know too!

It actually demonstrates fully, that Kramarat has probably only one true friend for his conspiracies and ideas....that may hurt him just knowing that at last....so his "friend" has actually shown himself to be completely unthinking!! Obviously he thought that there was more support than there actually was...

Even if in fact there are even two or three "fans", its still a very poor showing!!

There is hope for CR4 after all!!

I totally agree with your comments generally about GAs, if we were here just for the GAs, that is simply the wrong reason....

.....and as demonstrated here, they are not worth the paper screen they are printed on anyway!! At least in the long run it would seem...

But I have to admit that I truly like using them when I see something worth reading....at least for the short time they sometimes show!

This by the way, is the reason that I usually tell the person concerned that I have given them a GA as nobody (except Admin of course) can erase that!! I feel more could do that, then you know who your friends are.....but its not a requirement of course.

Now of course, if there is a fan or two of yours reading this, they could add some GAs just to show support for (in this case) your excellent posts....let us see if Kramarats support can rise to that? It might be a quite interesting "battle"!!!

My money is on you!!

Have a great day!

IQ made you aware. Assumption!

The best chuckle of the day so far. Thanks, Andy. You are indeed a masterful puppeteer.

I can only say that "Its a pleasure", which may incorrectly imply (wrongly!) that I am brilliant!!

Totally untrue....I am simply average....

As I believe I have already written here (or somewhere else on CR4), its like shooting fish in a barrel.....with a shotgun full of BB loaded cartridges, you hit one even with your eyes closed!!

See such pictures as this:-

here:-

Idiots Shooting Fish!!!

NRA members and Yes they REALLY do it, and I never ever knew that before!!!!

How kinky is that then?

"...Totally untrue....I am simply average...."

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That is an excellent example of a less frequently noted aspect of the Dunning-Kruger effect.

From Wikipedia:

'...Conversely, people with true ability tend to underestimate their relative competence...'

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It would seem like a version of implementing 'under-promise, over-deliver', except I don't think there is any intention to game the system in your case.

Fascinating!!!

Thanks for the link!!

RC Christian, mysterious fellow who had the monument built with a message. Note No1.

1. Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.
2. Guide reproduction wisely - improving fitness and diversity.
3. Unite humanity with a living new language.
4. Rule passion - faith - tradition - and all things with tempered reason.
5. Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.
6. Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.
7. Avoid petty laws and useless officials.
8. Balance personal rights with social duties.
9. Prize truth - beauty - love - seeking harmony with the infinite.
10. Be not a cancer on the earth - Leave room for nature - Leave room for nature

Mayhaps, ElRon Hubbard was behind this precisely located time warp continuum portal of blue granite rock???? The cracked ones, dey let in d light!

Georgia Guidestones

I thought the monolith/Stargate was supposed to be in 1:4:9 ratio.

I love technology Fredski.

Last night I passed out with an E-cig in my hand, and today I'm here to talk about it.

It wasn't too long ago that I would have been dead.

Locheed isnt wasting time.......fron the Sun Cat website MECHANICAL ENGINEER

This is a full-time, technical position to aid the development of Lockheed Martin Advanced Energy Storage's novel energy storage technology. The successful candidate will design and fabricate prototypes and then transition those designs into production. The candidate will also model and analyze multiphysics processes in support of those designs.DEVELOPMENT ENGINEER

This is a full-time, technical position to aid the development of Lockheed Martin Advanced Energy Storage's novel energy storage technology. The successful candidate will develop experiments, automate experimental set-ups, and execute test plans involving electrochemical systems.

Of course, this has to be just some misdirection in an effort to throw Kramarat off the trail, in hopes of preventing the discovery that the primary objective in buying the company was just to bury the innovation.