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World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 8:30 AM

The World Health Organization has reported that processed meats, like bacon, hot dogs, sausage etc. cause cancer and were placed in the same cancer causing category as cigarettes and asbestos.

http://www.bbc.com/news/health-34615621

Would this risk extend to other processed foods, like canned soup, peanut butter, cookies, etc. Is it the added salt in the process that is leading to this finding and/or is it the cooking process?

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#1

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 8:58 AM

According to WHO and California life causes cancer.

Relax, go have a BLT and forget about their bogus studies. If you read that article, the first line is the hook, the second states that there is "limited evidence", the third says meat has benefits, the fourth says cut down rather than give up meats, and the fifth says what I said - "go have a bacon sandwich".

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 9:17 AM

I agree. If you don't eat anything, drink anything, and don't inhale anything, you will not die from cancer.

As for me, I'm going to enjoy a breakfast of bacon, eggs, and pancakes (with plenty of gluten). Afterword, I'm going to light up a cigarette and drink my first cold beer of the day.

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#3
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 9:19 AM

So true....

reminds me of a story I shared here a while back.

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#4

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 9:42 AM

So, tobacco and asbestos are no more dangerous than bacon and hot dogs. That's a relief!

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#7
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 10:34 AM

I would not want to smoke asbestos though

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#5

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 10:12 AM

Malthusian theory said so, it is necessary.

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#6

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 10:18 AM

By George I think you've got it Ollie!

We start dying as soon as we are born and everything we consume can be blamed for the aging process as well as the cause of death!

My Grandpa Sipes succumbed to the vile practice of eating bacon, ham, eggs, and biscuits for breakfast, a cold bologna or ham sandwich for lunch, and some kind of red meat (usually beef) for dinner every day of his life.

He was up and working before the sun came up and seldom went inside until after the sun went down.

Given that most of the meat he consumed was home cured in a smokehouse and the processed meats had simple salt as a preservative.

Oh! He also chain smoked a pipe throughout the day up until he went to bed. (I so miss the smell of Cherry Blend tobacco and his smiling, leather face.)

The poor soul died at the young age of 96 due to natural causes.

Why he might have lived at least another year or two if he had not eaten any processed meat what-so-ever.

I do agree with the study in that the preservatives being used in our food are causing severe health issues including cancer.

The part I am having trouble with is:

Why do we not just eliminate all of the bad preservatives instead of coming up with a hair-brained statement that cooking and consuming meat is causing the problem?

I do remember that adding heat to any chemical process can severely affect the composition and structure so why not eliminate the chemicals?

They will have to pry the grilled steak or hamburger out of my cold dead hands. (Or figure out some way to get my burial shirt and jacket on over it.)

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#8

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 10:55 AM

The article doesn't specify but I'd assume the nitrates and nitrites in processed meats are the suspected culprit. I can't speak to the cancer but cured meats just about always cause asthma attacks in my kids due to the nitrates. We shell out extra $$ for uncured bacon and cold cuts.

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#9
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 11:00 AM

I also suspect as well as the smoke flavoring (both from a smoker) which contains carcinogens. If liquid smoke was used, even though it removes a lot of the carcinogens, the concentrate itself still can be not so made as lethal, but bad for you.

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#20
In reply to #9

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 9:42 AM

Since they make 'liquid smoke' by running the exhaust of a 'smoker' through a condensing unit(1), it is literally all the particulate matter from whatever is being burned to make the smoke. so at the concentrated level it's sold at, OF COURSE, it's going to be bad for you, one small bottle contains 'all the smoke' from a typical Weber grill running for six to eight hours.

Notes:

  1. Some as simple as a bundt pan set on the chimney, with a stainless steel bowl inverted and placed in the bundt pan, and a pile of ice loaded into the base of the inverted bowl. You can learn some interesting things from Alton Brown.
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#22
In reply to #20

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 10:13 AM

You have the basic process idea.... except there is farther refinement. We have a number of different process.

After the liquid smoke condenses, it is run through a Wiped Film Evaporator, which we can strip it molecule by molecule to an acceptable levels.

I agree the liquid smoke is highly concentrated, hence very bad for you as it is in the concentrated form. How concentrated?.... where a single ounce of liquid smoke can flavor 100 lbs of hamburger.

I watch Alton Brown on the food network, he brings chemistry to the populist. Very entertaining and informative.

I also like to add, there are other results that we do, and that is basically for aesthetics proposes and that is the production of Hydrogen Acetate that is used as a browning agent.

Now that we touch off on browning agents I have to bring up the Maillard Reaction, which is very interesting, and food science owe a lot to this pioneer French chemist Louis-Camille Maillard that made cooking an actual science.

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#26
In reply to #22

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/29/2015 3:25 PM

Before Alton Brown did that episode, I had no idea what 'liquid smoke was made of; it could have been rainbows and unicorn farts for all I knew.

I also remember one time, when I was a young child, seeing a bottle of liquid smoke and putting a dab om my fingertip to taste. MAN did it taste bad; no 'smokiness' no 'flavor,' just bad, bad, BAD.

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#27
In reply to #26

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/29/2015 5:39 PM

You used too much....

When I eat at a restaurant (Longhorns), I can tell if they use liquid smoke on their steak, If I see a lot of oil on the plate. The first few bites are good, then it gets overwhelming....

And that is the problem with everyday people using liquid smoke.....

That add a little bit, and don't wait long enough for the taste to migrate through.... so they add a little more.... still not enough... and they keep doing it until they taste it and it way too much.....

We were working on a water soluble smoke.... were you dose it on like worcestershire sauce but it is difficult.

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#28
In reply to #27

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/30/2015 9:29 AM

As I said, young child, put it on my finger and licked it off like I was testing the strength of soy sauce.

"I was a kid then, what did I know?"

Nowadays, when I want to add a 'smoky' flavor, I use the charcoal grill, much better control over trying to 'fake it' with an 'add-on.' (Only lump charcoal, by the way, no briquets in my BBQ "Never had it, never will. Ah-ha-haaa." to steal the catch phrase from Geoffrey Holder in those 7-Up commercials.)

Well, that, or I add a little Kikkoman soy sauce to a batch of Sweet Baby Ray's BBQ sauce (original flavor), not sure how or why, but adding that faint note of soy kicks up the 'smokiness' of SBR. It's not much, something like a teaspoon of Kikkonan to a cup of SBR, but it really helps to add a unique taste to my summer grilling.

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#29
In reply to #28

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/30/2015 10:15 AM

Frankly, I don't care for liquid smoke..... but here's and interesting tidbit.....

Do you know where imitation Vanilla come from?

From a Beaver's butt is a good guess,.... but not quite correct, (but it could.....).

Chinese Red Pine has the highest level of vanillin, but white oak has a pretty decent level.

As a matter of fact, that is why, Jack Daniels only uses their barrels once, (Wine Makers also use Oak Barrels) People thought it was a government sanitary requirement, but actually by charring the oak, that process of charring releases the bonds that holds the vanillin, and when the vanillin is released, it flavors the whiskey (or Bourbon).

Of course, some Irish Whiskey makers using used barrels, that not a problem......

Which brings us to the problem of where does one draw the line of processed foods....

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#18
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 9:18 AM

Nitrites and nitrates when heated (over cooked as in charred) form nitrosamines with the amino acids in proteins. Nitrosamines are known human carcinogens last time I checked (many years ago). I am always suspect of research ever since I read a an article that stated there was an effect from a treatment. When I looked (as well as the professor) at the graphic presented to show the difference, it graphic actually showed no difference (i.e. Did not reject the null hypothesis). We're any of the researchers vegetarians?

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#19
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 9:40 AM

"ever since I read a an article that stated there was an effect from a treatment."

Would you mind providing some details, or a link to, the article? I'm not sure what you meant, but it sounds interesting.

Thanks

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#21
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 9:46 AM

Sorry this was almost 20 years ago when I was getting my MS in biomedical science with a concentration in Toxicology.

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#23
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 10:16 AM

Petor2 is correct on that, benzene variants is a nasty one.

No data to back it up at this time thou.....

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#10

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 12:43 PM
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#11

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 12:56 PM

The bed is a very dangerous place. Well over 99% of people die in bed!

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#12
In reply to #11

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 1:48 PM

Its time we ban beds then..... but we have to start in phases.... I laid out a plan here;

First we ban

  1. the single bed.
  2. Then Double beds,
  3. Then queen size,
  4. then king size,
  5. then the California king size,
  6. then bunk beds,
  7. then futons
  8. Then couches,
  9. then la-z-boys
  10. then pajamas (guilt by association)

That will be phase I

Phase II is .....

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#13
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 4:17 PM

"Its time we ban beds then..."

You can't do that. The environmentalist will protest as you will be destroying the habitat of the the bed bugs.

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#14
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/27/2015 4:20 PM

ahhhh yes,... the Colorado spotted back, yellow belly bed bugs...... crap

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#32
In reply to #11

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/09/2015 7:54 AM

Especially hospital beds!...something very wrong there...

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#15

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 5:45 AM

Well believe it or not all pork was banned from federal prisons a few weeks ago claiming it was the result of survey the bureau of prisons performed and found that prisoners did not like pork, so they banned it.

The only positive response came from CAIR.

It was withdrawn and reversed after an immediate call of BS by everyone who heard of it:

http://toprightnews.com/obama-forced-to-reverse-his-sharia-prison-pork-ban-after-national-outrage/

Now they are going to try to ban it coming from the WHO, soon we will all be eating halal meat.

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#16
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 6:10 AM

Great!

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#34
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/13/2015 3:04 AM

You sound much like a song lyric from way back:

The court's in session(x2), now here come de Judge(x2) [Sung by Pigmeat Markham]

Well dammit, now I can't stop it spinning! Must be my punishment for knowing the lyrics to such uninspired music.

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#17

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 6:42 AM

Bacon is on that list? Tell that to Susannah Mushatt Jones, the 115 year old lady who eats bacon for breakfast, every day! http://www.foodandwine.com/fwx/food/world-s-oldest-woman-still-eats-bacon-every-day-115-years-old

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#24

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 12:40 PM

According to the book "The China Study", which I highly recommend, it's the combination of animal protein and a carcinogen that causes cancer. Even with high levels of carcinogens, plant protein does not promote cancer. Also the nitrites in procesed meats can cause memory loss and other problems.

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#25

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/28/2015 5:04 PM

In my opinion, and stated by others here.

I truly believe that the commercial preservatives are to blame for the up-tick in cancer related to cured meats.

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#30

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/31/2015 2:33 AM

Lack of Thiocyanate precursors in the diet lead to damage of host cells by white blood cells trying to do their job. Thiocyanate blocks oxidation of host cells by neutralizing the H2O2 and -Cl that the body uses to kill and clean up bacteria and normally dying or damaged host cells.

The people who seem to be controlling the world's foods right now have figured out if you take out a single gene from food plants that is responsible for the production of amygdalin in the plant and replace it's plant protective powers with anti-fungals in the spray that you can make practically the entire human race deficient in Thiocyanate and sell them the resulting medical care at multiple times the profit.

http://www.pnas.org/content/106/48/20515.long

Only 14% of Americans get enough fresh fruits, veggies, nuts and non-processed grains and beans.

Only 14% of Americans are NOT on maintenance meds.

Is there a correlation here?

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#31

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

10/31/2015 2:43 AM

Salt or cooking process?

Basically, part of the problem is that the salt used in processing foods has no Iodide in it which the body uses to kill viruses. Neither does a lot of the now trendy Sea Salt. Read the label.

Cooking food at temps higher than 210F destroys the Thiocyanate precursor Amygdalin from the foods. That's why in older generations the beans and soups were simmered and not boiled, keeping the temps just under 200F.

Searing meat (or burning it) creates carcinogenic products that the body can easily get rid of if the metabilic system has enough Thiocyanate. Otherwise, it is the action of non-protected WBC's that creates even more problems when they can't oxidize the toxins without self-destructing themselves, spilling the whole mess out into the bloodstream again.

The WBC's essentially become single-use cells without sufficient Thiocyanate stored in the liver.

Food isn't poison until the metabolic mechanism to properly utilize it breaks down because it has a missing link.

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#33

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/12/2015 9:52 PM

The World Health Organization is considering our health, but how can we control our eating habit? We are discussing the food or the transgenic food problem. Could it be said that we eat nothing is the most safest way for us?

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#35
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/13/2015 3:06 AM

No! You get anorexia from eating nothing....

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#36

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/16/2015 1:44 AM

The bacteria is everywhere. It plays an important role in the process of cooking. Metagenomics is a study which can learn the relationship between micorbiomes and specific circumstance, and further study on the microbial ecology of cooking process may find the answer to your question.

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#37
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/16/2015 7:10 AM

one trend that's becoming an issue I see is people are raising kids in a contained controlled (a more sterile) environment.

And not be or limiting the exposure to germs, bacteria this weakens the immune systems at an early age that when exposed, the immune systems is so stressed that now they/we are more reactant or susceptible to diseases, allergy's and even pathogens.

But this would fit into a whole new topic.

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#38
In reply to #37

Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/16/2015 8:15 PM

The strategies of metagenomics, is not to keep things in a sterile environment, but to take advantage of bacteria to regulate the environment. Not every bacteria is bad for human beings. And sterility does not mean "safe" based on the metagenomic studies. The bacteria is in a constrained condition.

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#39
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Re: World Health Organization - Processed Meats

11/16/2015 8:23 PM

I agree

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