CR4 and Myth Busters?

I want to see a revisit of the hardened steel hammer myth. They say that 2 hammers smashed together will not explode. I say they will. In their experiments they tried forcing the 2 together. My experience says it is more a harmonics issue than a force issue. A rigorous quick slapping of the heads WILL cause them to explode!

I know for a fact that an Allen type wrench when over flexed will explode violently! An 1/8" tool sent me to my knees, and a 3/8" broke overhead light fixtures.

As for the hammer? If it were to explode it would be a sight!

I also saw them run a Mercedes diesel off straight fry oil. I want to know how many tanks of this stuff before kaput.

depends on how the hammer was heat treated. If it was hardened with out any type of stress relieving, I would agree it could exploded

I once used a hammer from the dollar store, whatever they did to it, it was so weak the claws broke off when I tried to pry off a piece off wood with it. I bet if they did the test on a cheap hammer the thing would explode with out much help.

or the claws bend, or the handle breaks, or the head falls off when you take it out of the package.

(I guess that would be a safety hammer)

Safety hammer !!!! Hahahahhah!

I'm surprised some cheapskate companies haven't yet marketed tool sets (hand) with "some assembly required"!

"I want to see a revisit of the hardened steel hammer myth."

I agree with that choice. The biggest flaw I saw on that episode was that they were always hitting a hammer against another surface flat ( || not /| or /\ ). Since hitting it on an angle is going to concentrate the force in a smaller area, and is more "true to life", that is the way it should be tested.

Hardened steel striking hardened steel will expel high velocity sharp flakes. Hammers used on mine sites around here must all be either annealed or non ferrous due to recurring injuries incurred from driving hardened pins used to hold bucket teeth on their adaptors.

Otherwise I'd like them do investigate the Min Min Light.

What about which side of aluminum foil goes out? And, no, I don't mean to keep aliens from reading my brain waves - that's a tabula rosa and is safe from everybody.

I thought everybody knew that the shiny side goes out. What would be the point of having a shiny side if you're going to turn it in? The food doesn't care what side it sees.

If you use it to wrap yourself in it to stay warm (against hypothermia) you have the shiny bit facing in.

If you use it to keep the heat out, the shiny side goes out.

I have got a survival sleeping bag like that and it is shiny inside and camo green outside. I used it at -20 degrees camping in Scandinavia and woke up every night sweating like a pig. Every morning I had to turn it inside out in the morning sun to dry it out by hanging it over the tent. Proof it really works.

Both sides of the foil are the same. One is more reflective. For general purposes they are the same. Just call the 1-800# on the package, they'll tell you the same.

I've always wondered about toilet paper.

Which side to use: Printed or other.

Also while on the subject, which is more efficient: unrolling against the wall, or away from the wall?

Kind Regards....

Just a little before your time Sparky - but here ya go.........

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/12710/Overshot-vs-Undershot

Hello C_Rummel3,

Thank you for the link.

I had not thought to Search CR4 on the subject, anyway it gave the opportunity to use a nicely animated graphic in my Post.

I have now read the earlier Thread, and had not realised what earnest and pertinent information was contained therein.

Kind Regards....

I read about a couple the other day who elected to reduce their carbon footprint by not using toilet paper at all. Can't imagine how that would work, but for the rest of us, we can get by with a little care by using only two squares per session.

So far as the way it is hung, I remember Ann Landers had an ongoing discussion on that topic which went on for decades. Never was resolved, though as people all had different opinions. In our house, I always hang it with the paper over the roll. My wife hangs it with the paper against the wall. In the early years, I would change it but as I aged I became more tolerant and left it alone.

But, when it comes to the old myth about birds eating their own weight every day, I must admit I'm from Missouri.

Can't imagine how that would work

Well when I was growing up it was the daily news paper reduce to small squares and hung on a nail, good reading to pass the time away. Sherwood Park, got a cousin there, used to be a tech in one of the schools, retired now.

Regards JD.

Hello TVP45,

I had heard "odd and eerie" stories about "mountain living folks" in the eastern US, and dismissed most of them.

Having seen the movie "Deliverance" years ago, then reading your Post above, make me wonder how much of what I read about was actually true, and what they really got up to.

Please note that of course I don't include your goodself, as indulging in any of those "odd and eerie" activities.

Kind Regards....

I had "step-family" when I was little that lived off the river in south Texas. 50lb bag of beans 50lb bag of rice, turtle soup, fish and eel all the time. The father, Ray, would sit around wadding up and unwadding a piece of news print for 10 or 15 minutes after a meal.

"What are ya' doin' cousin Ray?"

"Gittin rid a' them sharp corners boy"

"Oh"

He also kept a caged bobcat in the yard which he collected the urine from.

cr3

Seems to me I heard that same collection idea from Del. Is there something going on I need to learn about feline urine?

Perhaps. Cousin Ray kept rice and beans in dry storage by the sale of that urine.

As I recall, the problem was with the glossy ads in the Sunday paper.

"I've always wondered about toilet paper. Which side to use: Printed or other."

Unless it is water soluble ink it make make little if any difference. If it is water soluble ink, since both sides become moisture it may transfer ink to you nether skin and cause allergic reactions.

"Also while on the subject, which is more efficient: unrolling against the wall, or away from the wall?"

Away from the wall. It is much more difficult to see where, and to tear off the desired amount against the wall. Also minimizes the reach for the paper.

As for the discussions of seat up or seat down, it can be settled once and for all by agreeing to put the lid down when the commode is in standby mode.

As for the discussions of seat up or seat down, it can be settled once and for all by agreeing to put the lid down when the commode is in standby mode.

Absolutely. As a child I trained my parents & sister into this habit. Unfortunately they've lapsed in the ** years I've not lived with them!

Nearest the wall - and preferably on a fixed holder that removes all contact with the wall.

"Nearest the wall - and preferably on a fixed holder that removes all contact with the wall."

Not my preference but it has one advantage for pet owners. The pets cannot roll the paper of and tear through the house with it trailing behind them.

I have read, somewhere, that the rain forests are a closed ecological system from the standpoint of carbon dioxide emissions or absorption. They emit as much carbon dioxide from the decaying wood as they absorb each year. We know that when they burn the wood off, it certainly dumps a lot of the gas immediately into the atmosphere that has been stored for centuries. Burning is a problem. But if the rain forest remains as is without man's interference, what is its impact on the climate change discussion?

If we reduce the CO2 emissions and therefore the CO2 for tree growth, what will we do for the increased needs for toilet paper as the population grows?

Is it good or bad to be "born with a silver spoon in the mouth"?

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/born+with+a+silver+spoon+in+your+mouth.html

Also here:

"Do you ever wonder why the tradition of giving silver baby spoons, silver baby rattles and silver teething rings exists? Because mouthing silver helped babies survive. These are treasured heirlooms passed down through the generations.

There is a factual reason why the wealthy gifted babies with silver to promote their health. Silver disrupts bacteria cells permanently."

Refer:

http://motherpie.typepad.com/motherpie/2006/07/born_with_a_sil.html

Kind Regards....

When I was young (post WW2) there was a lot of Jewish traders that crossed SA regularly selling (wonderful) stuff.

My Granny bought a "solid" silver cutlery set in a wooden box. (that was how i remember his words).

My sister now has the set and the plating on some of the spoons are coming off (56 years of use can be tough).

She also has our silver baby feeding silver spoons with her.

I must admit we don't have allergic problems. My Granny reached 104 and my mother is 94 and drives her own car.

How do silver differentiate between good and bad bacteria?

Before refrigeration silver a coin was put in the milk pitcher to keep the milk from turning as fast. A silver spoon in ones mouth from my neck of the woods means born of privilege.

2 concepts if that was your meaning:

1) a man born of wealth and a low born man reach the same level of success. The low born achieved more with less.

2) many times the low born has the ability but not the means to reach the same level of success.

And every coin has two sides and then there is the edge.

and the edge is too many bosses and not enough workers make a post office.(U.S.)

Brad

The myth I want to see put to the test is the one where a Formula One race car is said to develop so much down-force that if driven fast enough, it could drive on the roof of a tunnel upside down.

I believe this to be true. I wrote a program to track performance characteristics of a car called the Salen S7. The rear spoiler generated enough negative lift to overcome the weight of the car. Since there is a spoiler on both the front and the back of a formula one car I think it is very possible to drive the car upside down. The trick would be how to get the car upside down when traveling at the high rate of speed. The use of a wind tunnel would be very helpful here.

I would like to see Jamie and Adam tackle this one.

Cheers

This would be a great one to see, especially how they go about trying to do it. Although I know it must be true because I saw them do it in one of the "Men In Black" movies.

There seems to be a myth that the first moon landing by Armstrong & co is a myth. (Waving flags on the moon etc.)

I followed the trip on radio (SA were not considered adult enough to have TV at that stage) and it sounded genuine.

If the landing is a myth was the "moon" rock then picked up from the desert?

What about water, gravity draining through a tube. Does it really swirl in opposite directions depending on which hemisphere you are in? Or does the direction depend on manufacturing irregularities?

No NO NO NO NO.... oh and NO

"No NO NO NO NO.... oh and NO"

No what? No hemisphere dependent swirling direction? No irregularities dependent swirling direction? No swirling at all? No Coriolis force?

This has been covered so many times before..Coriolis force is insignificant over small distances. The distance to the earths axis is much less near the poles than it is at the equator.... however within a few hundred miles either side of the equator the diference is negligible. Over the dimensions of a basin or bath the difference is zero.

Coriolis force acts on large bodies of air or water flowing North South or South North and adds an East to West component...

Thanks, first considered denial I see of this, as you say, boring myth. Still, draining water does swirl and I admit being too lazy to check several holes and their directions in order to see if it persists for a given hole and if several holes have different directions. Naively I hoped that somebody has done that. We CAN become taller by being lazy and standing on the shoulders of former giants...

They did this in the "the long way round" with McGregor and Boorman. They did the test 5 yards either side of the equator with nothing more than a soup bowl with a hole in it and it did turn in opposite directions?????? It was shown with a floating match on the surface.

Cannot see how or why they fixed it to fool us

Imperceptibly tilted the bowl in a circle clockwise and anticlockwise?

One that I would like to see Mythbusters do is the exploding oxygen tank. Like the runaway tank, this isn't exactly a myth. I would like to see it done to possibly keep some poor schmuck from getting his/her face burned off.

If even a tiny speck of oil or grease gets on the high side of the regulator when changing tanks it can erupt in flame right through the gages. (weakest point) This is a fact.

It should be of concern because so many people who don't know better use oxy/acetylene rigs.

It would provide lots of pyrotechnics for the pubescent boys watching so they might just do it.

I liked the one on this forum about synchronizing motors (unbolting aligning and rebolting) which was busted. What about "plastic pipes need to be bonded because it says so in the regs"? Or you can't get pregnant the first time, natural salt from the Himalayas is heathier because has eons of stored sunlight, marine creatures never get ill because seawater contains all necessary minerals, aluminium cookware is dangerous, the net is full of lots of new myths reaching a wider audience, try as you might you won't bust 'em.

"Or you can't get pregnant the first time"

I wonder how Mythbusters would test that one on TV.

I saw this one in a Farmers Almanac about 25 years ago...

Does Snake Oil really penetrate the skin (hand) and come out the other side?

Could medicine and treatments be administered in this manner if this were true?

Nicotine patch. Yes they can be administered like this

I enjoy the show when I watch it but I would like to see them handle each topic with a better understanding of the science or engineering involved in whatever it is they are doing.

I suspect other technical professionals when watching the show have similar thoughts to me such as: They ignored this important variable or they need to be thinking about this fault scenario not that one.

I'm not advocating an hour on each detail because for a TV show thats not practical but at times a solid technical background doesn't even seem to be considered.

The effectiveness of the use acetone as gasoline additive, performance/mileage booster. They ignored compression ratios in the motors they used using a low compression mid-70s smog elephant of a cadillac and a newer non-performance model. The advantage of acetone is that it boosts octane in a safe manner and a few ounces (1 to 3 per 10 gallons of gasoline) works. 3 ounces of acetone is much cheaper than the amount of gasoline. 30-60 miles per 10 gallon tank. 1-2 gallons at 2.70-3.20, versus approximately 0.15 to 0.45 for the 1 to 3 ounces of acetone. It allows a higher compression motor to run on cheaper lower octane gasoline. So that is another 0.20 to 0.30 per gallon. 2.70 to 6.40 per tank, plus the 2.00 to 3.00 for lower octane gasoline, 4.70 to 9.40 per tankful versus 0.15 to 0.45 for the acetone.

They checked new and old motors with and without acetone, but not performance motors with high compression ratios that require high octane fuel. The test should be to try low octane fuel on a high octane requiring vehicle with and without acetone! I see a 3-6 mpg increase in my '04 Focus. With the larger increase seen when I have to drive the car harder. The normal loss in mileage from driving hard is much less than without the acetone. A mild performance improvemet is also noticeable. I wanted to test this on my '93 Corvette, but have been stuck waiting for a new ECM for it for over 9 months. Hopefully soon.

I really enjoy the show, and have not been to dissapointed in many other aspects of their tests.

JG

There have been a number of myths on mythbusters that have left me wanting.

The Christmas tree light myth, for example, where it is thought that christmas tree lights could ignite a sufficiently dry tree. What bothered me abut that myth was they didnt try different types of trees, and they didnt try putting the tree in a corner with a low roof overhead to cut down on the heat escaping. Add on a baseboard heater like many american homes have and you have a recipe for disaster.

Another episode that bothered me was the "free energy" episode. While I dont feel they got into some of the more interesting ideas out there, there was one in which Adam built a "wheel" out of propane cylinders that used the evaporation and condensation of gasses to create an off balence in the wheel and make rotation. In the show, the wheel did turn, but it was incredibly slow. What bothered me is that they didnt try and take advantage of the massive torque the apparatus may have generated. What also bothered me was they didnt try and build it smaller, as it is well established that a number of late 19th-early 20th century clocks ran on this principle, using alcohol as the working fluid.

The "using explosives to get dry concrete out of a cement mixer truck" in my opinion would have worked better if they had drilled a few holes and put the explosives IN the concrete rather then on top of it.

Normally I find the show entertaining, but sometimes it just makes me mad. I forget which episode it was but Grant had made some "complex calculations" (his words) to aid them in thier endevor, which basically boiled down to a few basic kinematics equations. Congratulations Grant, you've mastered the first 2 weeks of high school physics. The science on the show is just TERRIBLE.

What I would like to see is a Mythbusters Challenge, in which they pit themselves against real scientists and engineers to test a myth.

Untill then I will continue to watch, if for only to see Kerri Byron...mmmmmm....kerri....

Avery Montembeault

Hey Avery,

You should register. I doesn't hurt.......much.

They may have experience in movie effects, but they kinda remind me of shade tree mechanics.

attempting things without full understanding. one of these times their complex calculations are'nt going to go far enough, and more than thier eyebrows are going to get burned

I want to see the MythBusters repeat their attempts at testing the Minto Wheel heat engine. They really botched their test -- their wheel turned very slowly (less than 1 RPM) -- so they called it "busted" (in the sense of being totally impractical). But not only did they do a poor job welding, they also used the wrong working fluid (they should not have relied on plans ordered from "free-energy" proponents). I know an inventor who has two versions that easily move at 30 RPM (although determining its usefulness will require more experimentation). For those of you wondering what the heck a Minto Wheel is, please see my thread about this device, including links to videos of working models:

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/7432

How about the ever-popular, widely believed (and taught) "hot water freezes faster than cold water".

As an off time Zamboni Driver, I can tell you hot water does not freeze any faster then cold (at least not in any practical sense), however it does form tougher, clearer ice as there is less oxygen trapped in the water.

Avery Montembeault

PS I am registered, I can just never remember my password....

I can tell you first hand a Craftsman ball peen hammer hitting a u joint cross out of old Chevy drive shaft can chip off explosively enough to berry a piece under skin so deep that i could not see it a little blood and guts or was that a red rag later forgot all about it till a few Weeks later when it resurfaced and came out with a pop and more blood and guts no red rag this time a pretty large piece.

this was twenty years or so ago and i still have that hammer with piece missing never broke again ??? maybe week spot??

so hammers colliding is plausible to me any way

Having experienced exploding hardened steel I will not experiment in my garage -- but I say absolutely YES!

Not really a myth, but without them giving any details, it would be interesting to see how many explosives they could make only from items purchased in a department store. I know they like to make things go boom.

my brother was a green beret. he said their are at least a dozen ways to blow up a house from materials found in a kitchen.

That's nothing artbyjoe,

I can blow up a balloon, with the air from my lungs.

Kind Regards....

I'd like them to show how its possible that someone can fall 47 stories and live. Not only live, but be able to walk again.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,2235390,00.html (47 story fall)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17113222/ (Skydiver survives 2 mile fall)

I read an article some time ago that Terrorists can be set into action by calling them via email, telephone or subliminal messages on paper or ad media. Is this possible? Can someone be hypnotized telepathically? What are the implications?

I refer you to: The Manchurian Candidate.

I'll have to rent it and see it again!

Thanks!

That is the basis of all the Sleeper-style stories. There are a number in both sci-fi and spy genres.

The trigger word technique is a form of deep and long term hypnosis. I've seen the effects of this in the short term, as carried out by an on-stage hypnotist (not sure if they're still allowed to do this, I find it concerning). The subject is hypnotised, told that when they hear a particular word, they will do something, e.g. when you hear the word candle, you will cluck like a chicken. They are told they won't remember the conversation and then woken up. Usually they're told that they didn't react under "the spell" and told to sit down. A little while later, the word is worked into the act, and the person starts doing whatever. What's really odd is that they are not aware of their actions. The hypnotist will stop them and ask them what they're doing, and they don't know what it is let alone why they're doing it. a stage hypnotist will remove the trigger before the end of the show (or they should).

Obviously the trigger needs to be more complex in a sleeper case. This is not telepathic hypnosis but rather delayed activation of a hypnosis put in place face to face.

Subliminal advertising was banned in the 60s, after its effects became well documented. It's based on the fact that your brain can process information subconsciously that you are not consciously aware of having seen. It's all down to frame speed and is related to the fact that "moving pictures" aren't actually moving. You see movement, not the series of frames because the frames refresh more quickly than does your optical system. Refresh (play) them fast enough, slide in one frame of advertising, and then ask which brand the watchers prefer and most will pick the one you showed. They won't know why, because they have no conscious memory of seeing the frame. They only way you can find this is to play the film very slowly.

A related phenomenon of familiarity is obviously still used - to best effect by Canon who, before launching any products or advertising in the West, spent two years sponsoring events, sporting leagues etc. so that their name was familiar to the public before there was a connection to any products.

Sir, believe me I'm not just saying this, but this is scary sh&*%&t!!!

Potentially; Anybody can be a sleeper!

What if this has been going on at the White House, causing these men to do some of the terrible things they do, to effect our ways of life in the USA's?

Hello ronald,

If you carefully check, that explanation is the only logical one, for the antics of so-called "elected" leaders.

Loose cannons in charge? You bet.

Kind Regards....

Ronald, I presume you must have a cold...for I am, as the name Rose suggests, female

Be assured, I'm not offended but amused. After all, this is not the first, nor will it be the last, time this has happened to me...I've lost count of the number of times it's happened with my real name (which is obviously that of a girlie!).

And yes, anybody could be a sleeper - even you!

Hi Rose!

Sorry, I stopped looking at the Avatars long ago! It's automatic now, you see a post and you answer with total disregard to the 5W+1Y. Please accept my apologies.

I haven't seen myth busters yet. In SA we don't even have crime busters.

We have a repeating myth that is spread in our schools every year. Mars is coming closer and will on a specific date be the same size as the moon.

and then the classic exam question: How long do the earth take to rotate exactly once around its axes? - their correct answer is 24 h.

Ok I am too late again but can't be asked to read all so if it is in there already I say sorry now.

I want them to lay the lemmings thing to bed. How come a silly myth like that lives for sooooooo long?

There was a documentary on the lemmings story. Apparently it all started when a film crew doing a nature documentary got a bunch of lemmings, put them on a table in front of a moving background and pretended it was the wild (don't ask why, perhaps the weather was bad outside). As for the lemmings jumping off a cliff, they thought the documentary needed some more action. It took a lot of coaxing to get the lemming to jump off the table apparently.

It just goes to show, don't believe everything you see on tv.

We did get some good lemmings-based computer games out of it thou.

I just saw the episode about a freezing pole and the tongue. Years ago, an ex-girlfriend was putting an ice-tray into the freezer of an old aluminum built freezer and got her hand stuck to the sidewall. Holy Crap! It really was horrible. The way she had her hand stuck it was almost impossible to get water to the back of her fingers and hand where she was 'cold fused'. At first I thought it was funny. She quickly burst into tears from the pain. I had to fill my mouth with water and spit it onto her hand many, many times to free her. A trip to the hospital and talks of a skin graft etc. She healed remarkably well with little scarring. All the same, Yikes!

And now how 'bout 'dowsing'? We've debated it here (CR4) with a surprisingly high amount of emotion and opinion. I really would like to see this one. Though I doubt that they would truly satisfy the scientific community either way.

cr3

I saw a film demonstration of dowsing quite a few years ago. An area was plumbed with plastic pipe in various directions and the surface 'dragged' to a uniform texture/appearance. A boastful dowser was put to the test and failed to find the underground water. I seem to remember he claimed it was an unnatural setup to excuse his inability to find the water.

I once heard that we are a centimeter taller in the morning, after a full nights sleep. Something about gravity and muscle fatigue during the day.

cr3

This is definitely true and can be more than that even up to an inch ( I am 6'5" so) .

I always notice it in my rear view mirror in my car that in the morning my view is slightly "lower" than the night before after a "hard days work". During the day the bones and cartilage settles under the pressure. Laying in bed for 8 or so hours you expand again.

Have they ever done the "Weather so cold your spit freezes before it hits the ground" bit?