Round Lead Shot for a Shotgun - Without a Shot Tower

I have no idea what a shot tower is.

I assume the lead is melted and alloyed prior to dispensing. If you could adjust the dispenser to drop the correct volume of lead into a hot oil bath? I know, you need lots of the little beggars to charge a shell. Maybe you are handy enough to hook the dispenser mechanism to some type of drive device? Maybe a wheel with lots of little bumps to push the handle "open" rapidly and let lots of balls drop during a single rotation of the handle?

How many clays does it take to make a "mess"?

Happy Shooting!

Molten lead is poured into a sieve at the top of a tower (80 feet or more for producing large shot) the droplet size is a direct function of the sieve mesh or orfice size, and as the lead droplet falls through the air, the surface tension of the lead causes it to form into a fairly round ball for small shot.

I thought lead shot had been outlawed for environmental reasons.

Yes. I hear that they're using a combination of renewable switchgrass and parsley now.

Nah. Lead shot is still used for trap, skeet, sporting clays. The ranges are so polluted that they've been grandfathered by most of the regulatory agencies. States like California and Massachusetts may be different. SC allows lead shot for everything except waterfowl, which is covered by the federal government, and that's to keep from polluting waterways -- not the birds or people who eat them.

Yeah, you would have thought so.

Thanks! Now I understand.

How many pellets do you expend during a round? I only send one downrange per target.

But, my targets don't move.

Good answer. A more simplistic form might say, that dropping molten metal for an appreciable distance (depending on intended shot/molten droplet size) simulates (as closely as was practical) a weightless (zero gravity [+/_]) condition...permitting the molten...congealing...solidifying, in-transit sphere to assume a near spherical shape under the influences of surfact tension....

The shot tower depicted in another thread would not have been for firearms shot but for cannon shot...such as might be deployed and used about US Frigate Constellation, of late decommissioned and moored in nearby Baltimore inner harbor.

From an aerodynamics/nautical standpoint, perhaps it could be deemed appropriate to think of Baltimore's and like shot towers as the 18th-/19th-century historic counterparts to 20th century wind tunnels.

Greetings lynlynch - this Shot tower is only 20 or so miles away from the house - great area, and in case your interested about this, there is a link to download a lot more detail on the process & structure here:

http://www.dcr.virginia.gov/state_parks/shottowr.shtml

GENERAL INFO: Overlooking the New River, Shot Tower was built more than 150 years ago to make ammunition for the firearms of the early settlers. Lead from the nearby Austinville Mines was melted in a kettle atop the 75-foot tower and poured through a sieve, falling through the tower and an additional 75-foot shaft beneath the tower into a kettle of water. For a small fee, guests may ascend the tower which is on the National Register of Historic Places.

This one in Baltimore was build in 1828. At the time the highest structure build in the US until the Washington Monument. Now a National Monument.

Emphasis: that would be The Washington Monument, located also (updown) in Balmer City...not the obelisk of later fame in D.C..

Nice pic/view of the shot tower.

this--the first one (at xmas season)

When Baltimoreans proposed this tall column in 1809, it was extraordinary - no American city had dreamed of anything like it. But the first proposed site, downtown, made residents afraid it might fall on their row houses. So it was built in remote Howard's Woods, land given by one of Gen. Washington 's officers, Col. John Eager Howard. Rising 178 feet on a hill 100 feet above sea level, it became a landmark for ships sailing upriver from Chesapeake Bay and a landmark on America 's first urban skyline. As the first monument anywhere to honor the great George Washington, it put Baltimore on the world map. Baltimore has been "the Monumental City " ever since. To view the city, foreign visitors flocked to climb the same 228 steps that you can, spiraling up inside the column. Still one of the best views in Baltimore.

Hi, bwire!

If the staircase was spiral, were the Balitmorians making use of the column to creat shot? You didn't specify.

Mark

Does that mean, "Huh?"....as is, shot tower and monument tower are different things?

I suppose given a fixed shot size one could build a specific tower...

Large fan below, just short of suspending the droplet, and then a side blower to collect them....

It's not nice to change the "subject line!"

I liked it the way it was!

By the way, I mentioned that I had considered other ways to do it, and the suggestion you made is one of them. The shot still needs to be chilled by liquid, so just impeding the fall through forced air is all that's necessary until the shot has hardened enough to not be deformed by hitting quench liquid.

Thanks . . .

All lead shot for a shotgun is round, so it was stupid to change the name.

Look in to the Bleimeister process uses heated water instead of air. Some shot manufactures use it.

You are asking for novel ways to make lead shot. The following suggestion may not be for "home" use, but should be suitable, but probably not practical. It may however lead to some other more worthy suggestion.

Silver and precious metal rivets are made from wire that is "cold headed" into the necessary shape. The wire is fed into the cold heading die with enough momentum to form the shaped head, then the wire is sheared, the die rotates to next position and the next piece is formed and so on.

Is there some way to perform a "cold forge" ball?

The other option that I thought of seems to already be here and that was to use oil at a temperature slightly below lead melting point with sieve on the fluid surface so that the droplets do not have to go through the surface tension. It would be good if the oil had a temperature profile of hot at the top and progressively cooler to the bottom of the tank.

There is an old shot tower in southwestern Wisconsin used during the Civil War, it is a vertical shaft drilled down thru a cliff with a side shaft for access at the bottom, where there is a pool of water. There were lead miners in SW WI.

So the existing towers used air to make spherical and cool the lead blobs. If a higher density gas (vs air) were used the "tower" could be shorter in height, if the molten lead could be blasted thru a strainer and up at a slight angle then fall back into a cooling pool the height could be cut in half.

There was a table top shot maker patented and produced called the Shannon Shot Master. They have not been made in years but you might find one on Ebay. It used diesel fuel as a coollant and the lead droplets came into round passing over an inclined plate.

I actually made an 80 ft shot "tower" to make shot up to size 4. I hired a company that digs foundations for buildings and bridges. Their machine is basically an auger 3 ft in diameter. They augered a hole 36inches wide 80 ft deep. A 30 inch diameter pipe 82 ft long with a cap welded on the bottom was lowered into the hole and held plumb while the hole was back filled. I built a 16x24 ft building over the hole.

An electric winch was used to lower a 55gal drum 1/2 full of water into the hole. A large sieve lowered into the drum from the top caught the shot and was easily retrieved and replaced.

A standard lead casting pot was modified to hold an interchaneable sieve in the bottom. I made the sieves out of 1/4 inch mild steel plate. The hole size and pot temp determined the shot size.

I could make any lead alloy I wanted from dead soft to Brinnel 24 [Hard!] in appreciable quantities very easily.

Yeah. I'm a handloader.

How about switching to a whole different material? metal, ceramic, composite?

for clayshooting is it just important that the pellets have the same mass?

The pellets have to be round as well as having a specific gravity close to lead. Metals either have too high a melting point ie tungsten or too expensive ie gold. Ceramic is too light as well as being abrasive to the shotgun barrel and loading equipment. Composite? Yeah you can buy bi-metallic shot at 4 to 5 times the cost of lead shot, but that defeats the purpose.

hm, maybe certain plastics could do the job, maybe like stone balls encased in teflon?

just brainstorming here

I have a 280'-300' well hole dog in my yard. Could I use that as a tower alternative?

That's a big dog!

Link to Shannon Shotmaster I mentioned above. Hope this is helpful.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?p=316229

Hi, Bill!

Good thing you don't live in Canada, where lead shot is now illegal because it poisons the environment with lead. You'd have to find a way to make your own steel shot.

Mark

Hey Mark, is this a new law cause I just purchased a box of 2.75 lead shot for small game last week. I know it's illegal for migrating bird but all together?

Hi, Simple1!

You're right about Migrating Birds. The Canada Gazette reports:

"Non-toxic Shot Regulation

In August 1997 the Migratory Birds Regulations were amended to prohibit the possession and use of lead shot for hunting most migratory game birds in Canada. The ban was implemented in September 1997 in all wetland areas. It will apply across Canada in September 1999.

The non-toxic shot regulation was implemented in response to scientific evidence of the detrimental effect of lead shot on migratory game birds and their predators. The four types of non-toxic shot that have been approved for use in Canada (steel shot, tungsten-iron shot, tungsten-polymer shot, and bismuth shot) are more expensive than lead shot, and will increase the average migratory game bird hunter's total seasonal expenditure. The actual amount of this additional cost will depend on the type and quantity of non-toxic shot purchased."

As for small game, there appears to be areas where lead shot is still permitted, although all the regulations discourage it in favour of the other varieties, and these may vary by province.

"On the Aulneau Peninsula (Ontario) (WMU 7A), from September 1 to December 15 and from April 15 to June 15, [for example] you must not use a shotgun loaded with ball or with shot larger than number 2 lead shot, steel shot that is not larger than triple BBB shot, bismuth shot that is not larger than double BB shot or a rifle of greater calibre or projectile power than a rifle known as the .22 calibre rim-fire rifle. The calibre limitations do not apply to flintlock or percussion cap muzzle-loading rifles."

Hunting migratory birds is the chief use of shot, and although its use for rabbits & hares, squirrel, etc., stretches far back into history, its composition has not been a concern in this area because small game is less likely to feed on lead shot; and the varied shooting areas for small game have not been so well used as concentrated migratory bird hide areas to poison the water and earth with the shot as yet.

So, when the discussion centered around the use of lead shot, I was referring to the banned use for it as ammunition for migratory bird hunting (except for woodcock, a bird more often found inshore and away from major migratory routes).

Most of the hunters I know have chosen to no longer use lead shot anywhere or on any kind of game as a conscious gesture to aiding conservation. Even when shooting skeet as a warm-up to field or brush hunting for pheasant, partridge, etc., lead is no longer approved for use by the guys I hunt with.

Mark

At 10 bar (10 atmospheric pressures) the boiling point of water is hotter than the melting point of lead: so maybe you could make a shot tower entirely of water.

Although this looks a bit dramatic: maintaining a temperature differential from the top of the container (about 330°C) to the bottom (nearly 100°C) wouldn't be that difficult if you poured the lead slowly.

Of course I accept no responsibility when you destroy your kitchen with superheated steam and molten lead.

.

.

The cylinder is full of pressurised water. It's kept hot at the top with the heater and cold at the bottom by standing it in a bath of normal water.

Duck hunters have been using steel shot for some time now...the hole lead thing. The shells cost as much if not a little more then conventional ones. I use copper clad "BB's" for duck and turkey hunting, works well. For sporting clays, I have found that steel milling media used in mills designed for grinding and sizing pigments etc work very well. 1.25 - 2.0 mm works well for me. I have used Tungsten shot in the past, but very expensive. My best load was using 5mm Tungsten shot stuffed into a 3 inch full charge shell. It's great for removing car doors since the Tungsten shot doesn't deform on impact.

The parts that you need can be cast in a centrifugal spin caster. I use one for casting lead and pewter parts every day. The casts are an exact one-to-one copy of the original parts, with a small piece of mold sprue which is easily trimmed.

-Mike Lynch

A guy I knew when I used to shoot Black powder used to make is own shot.

He used various Fishing Sinker moulds to produce roundish shot and then tumbled them in a home made Steel Drum tumbler to "Round them out" as he called it.

Worked very well judging by his results.

For really small shot, he had made himself sets of swages and used sheets of lead to press them out.

Not overly sure on the details as I only had the opportunity to see his setup once when I bought a rifle off him.

Regards,
Sapper.

How about using fine water mist in the air - that should suck out a lot more heat quicker so your tower could be short. To generate such a mist simply, use a pressure washer with the nozzle on its finest setting. Use together with a moderate air current up a short chimney and I would have thought you'd be there or thereabouts.

Must admit that I don't like the idea of people (you included) shooting lots of lead particles about - nor of the idea of you heating the lead in open containers - the fumes are poisonous too.

DP

Using a fine mist with forced air is one of the methods I conjured up to reduce the height of a shot tower. I don't like the idea of melting lead in open pots either, and I have only done it outdoors and in a very small quantity for one experiment.

The "idea of people shooting lots of lead particles about . . ." has and probably will go on for many years to come. Shooting ranges, especially skeet, trap, and sporting clays, are already polluted with lead shot, and there are companies who collect such lead shot and a good amount of dirt in the process to reclaim the shot as well as the dirt.

For the record, I'm interested in making # 7 1/2 and/or # 8 shot, which is 0.095" and 0.090" dia, respectively. Using molds for making such just doesn't make much sense -- there's 350 pellets per ounce of shot for # 7 1/2. One box of 25 shells requires 8,750 pellets, and for that, one would save only about $2.75, and for that much money, I don't think I would trade hours of labor for it.

"My" idea (shortening tower with updraught + cooling water spray) has already been usurped presented - but as an aside, what's the law over there (US/Canada or anywhere else) re. lead fishing weights? They've been banned over here for years.

... feel free, guys, to mark this OT.

Could you not punch cylindrical blanks for lead sheet or perhaps sheared wire then swage them in a press between two dies with hemispherical cavities and then tumble them to remove any flash? Probably a significantly lower production rate than a shot tower but without the whole shot tower thing. or cast them in a mold not unlike bullet molds? making really small shot like that would be difficult though.

Got an airplane? Ever heard of the vomit comet?

Shot towers are old technology, obsolete by the end of the 19th century. Commercial small shot is made these days by the Bliemeister method. You can buy that as a Littleton Shotmaker, and make your own from scrap lead. http://littletonshotmaker.com Larger shot is swaged from wire.

Another source for cheap shot is trap and skeet ranges. Once a year or so, they "mine" the shot drop zones with a special machine that sifts out the lead; it is then resold or recycled. It's not as round as new shot, and tends to be a mix of sizes from 9 to 7-1/2, but its good for practice. I've loaded a couple hundred pounds of it over the years, bought from the local trap and skeet club. I've never broken 25 skeet with it, but have done a 24 and several 23's.

All of the lead alternatives cost a few to many times as much as lead. All but the tungsten bearing shot are ballistically inferior because they are less dense, and tungsten is astronomically more expensive. All but Bismuth, tin, and zinc are much harder on gun bores. Here's a chance to make your fortune - find a non-toxic inexpensive alternative to lead shot that works as well and doesn't ruin guns.

Most of the elements above Bismuth are radioactive, and many are also toxic heavy metals too, so the likelihood of that is nil. Your best option is straight Bismuth which has a higher atomic weight, but whose density is only about 86% the density of lead. Gold and mercury are denser, but gold is expensive and mercury is toxic.

Hi Bill!

There is the way to produce shot desirable size as a resonance dropping of very equal pellets of Lead in electromagnetic field.

Look this on: http://leadshotmachine.com

Capacity is 25 - 150 kg per hour. It take 3 minutes to change shot diameter!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq3jzxTJWkE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6ZLTgIRweE&feature=related