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spacecannon
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Shipping Container Housing

01/16/2010 12:05 PM

I have a civil engineer friend whoose dream it is to design and build shipping container housing for general use and for emergency use, like an instant city for Haiti. Im trying to motivate him to live his dream, so what does everyone think about container housing?

spacecannon

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Transcendian
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#1716
In reply to #1714
 Find in discussion

Re: Organizational Ideas That Can't Be Contained in a Standard Housing

04/12/2010 3:12 PM

It's my fault, and I'm proud of it.

First I said Shipping Containers were made for something else.

Then I reversed myself and said they could work better than tents.

Then I said like most all on CR4 it would be an insular discussion doing nothing for anybody outside our own little world.

Then I reversed myself again and started calling or writing people in governments or NGO positions.

Now I at least want peace and focus amongst ourselves.

We've had help from CW that was focused on the good work.

He has been a fine example for us here.

Haiti is one screwed up place. Mali and Haiti make the French look bad, not to mention Louisiana. The UN has simply not changed when the end of the Cold War called for it to adapt. My most powerful support in France for Transcendian agendas has disappeared. Ky insulted me for asking for real support.

The thread has been moribund for weeks now. CR4 and Globalspec have some agenda that is nearly incomprehensible.

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packrat561
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#1715
In reply to #1713
 Find in discussion

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 2:50 PM

Hi Stuey,

I hereby volunteer to fill the position of Minister of Zealous Political Orthodoxy Enforcement.

Now, I know we haven't firmed up the actual political philosophy this little rodeo is going to be , but i don't think that is necessary.

It will give us more freedom to help the regime people by being able to invent and implement as we go.

Whether it becomes socialist, communist or national boshialist, the main concern is loyalty to the regime. I feel, based on my delusions of grandeur, paranoia,vindictiveness and complete collection of National Lampoon Magazine,1971 to 1975, that i would be well suited to root out those that are less than sincere in their devotion to the cause.

I would like to suggest to whomever heads up the Ministry of Peace, that our first order of business is to assemble a mighty armada and sail up the Hudson River and reclaim Redhook, which has historically always been a part of East Minehead, Haiti.

This will bring the volk together and divert attention from the perception of possible irregularities in their new benevolent gubbermint.

The second concern, and quite possibly the most important, is to make sure we all have really cool uniforms.

The proper outfits, combined with accessorizing can set the tone of our endeavour early on, and ensure its success.

Signed,

Major Malfunction

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Anonymous Poster
#1721
In reply to #1715

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 7:37 PM

Oddly Mister Ratpack, that is just about the role I had in mind for you. Enrollment and recruiting local people and skills. The uniforms are and important issue as we would need to appear 'different' to the organizations, so folks know who is actioning, who plays fair and who to join their effort to. Also for those who do join to have some badge of belonging, and some decent clothing.

And you would be doing a fair bit of "peace keeping" at the interface of locals and the group - and among the group when things get "debated" - as they will - with this lot.

Equally oddly I see near perfect matches in just about everyone on the thread for required roles. All we seem to lack is a Super Bean Counter for banking and finance, preferably with international trade experience - but if we were receiving government funds - they'd have one they'd love to donate - and we do have someone capable of the international procurement and logistics part.
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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1722
In reply to #1721

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 7:55 PM

I would love to design the CR4 uniforms! Hmmm...perhaps a nice puce jacket with epaulets...

packy should be in charge of all police work...at least there will be entertainment! Now we need someone with OCD...

BTW, I am NOT Sue...I know her, and she me, but we are not we but she and me....

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cwarner7_11
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#1723
In reply to #1722

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 7:59 PM

I am partial to something along the lines of the old Sgt. Pepper's look- and I wanna be President! But I get to define the job- Purely ceremonial- all I do is sit in a throne all day looking important in my Sgt. Pepper's uniform and greet foreign visitors and refuse an audience to the likes of Sean Penn...
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Transcendian
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#1725
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 8:10 PM

Better to look good, than be good.

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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1726
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 8:10 PM

SPLARF! Kind of "Moon over Parador", with you as Richard Dryfuss? Love it! Esp the refusing to see Sean "Punch 'em anyway" Penn....

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Anonymous Poster
#1732
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 8:30 PM

Oh dear guys, looks like the first task is the Air conditioned Container Palace so President Charlie don't get too sweaty in his clobber.

Kyzine

(and he'll want a bleeding fountain)

P.s. Mrs R - Hawaiian shirts with epaulets?

an' what's this; you are not Sue? Come on, everyone with half a brain knows you are so two too!
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cwarner7_11
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#1736
In reply to #1732

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 9:28 PM

NO NO NO!!! No ai conditioning in the Presdential Container Palace! Air conditioning causes all sorts of problems with my sinuses, and dries out my contact lenses...

But I do request (respectfully) a fountain in my courtyard...
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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1738
In reply to #1732

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 9:32 PM

Done and doner...Yes, hawaiian shirts, burmuda shorts for the men, coconut bras and grass skirts for the ladies (she said "ladies"...) Whaddya say, Ms. Sue? What shall our uniform be? No french maid outfits! altho fishnets and stilletos do sound intiguing....

And, Our Prezidentae should have a fountain! A peeing cherub, perhaps?

Ah, nurse...may I have more Thorazine, puhleeze....thank yewwwww.........

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sue
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#1743
In reply to #1738

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 9:50 PM

Culottes and tank tops. (not)

I hereby nominate myself as Minister of Beverages, Proper Comma Placement, and Wild Life Surveys.

Am also capable of some heavy lifting; not afraid of hard work; good cook; no dancing.

C.V. available upon request and after a fine repast that involves crustaceans. To consume. Not as dinner companions.
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Stueywright
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#1744
In reply to #1743

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 9:58 PM

Yer On!

Yeronna.

Aint phonetics fun? (Phonetics= {new, abridged by careless youth} acrobatics performed whilst engaged on mobile phone)

GHOTI spells 'fish'!!!!!

Stu.

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sue
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#1746
In reply to #1744

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 10:09 PM

Dunno if the Haitains will go for it.

OK, have passport, ready to jump in.
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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1751
In reply to #1746

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 10:43 PM

Ah,,,does that mean I have to learn a new language?

Trying to learn Celtic...Fish is f-i-s-h, not a gobbley blend of whatsits...too hard (whine!)

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sue
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#1752
In reply to #1751

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 10:46 PM

Is Commissioner of Wine and Cheese a cabinet post?
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cwarner7_11
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#1755
In reply to #1752

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 11:04 PM

Most definitely. I do believe Commissioner of Wine and Cheese outranks President, but I have to check my protocol references to be sure...
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Anonymous Poster
#1757
In reply to #1755

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 11:29 PM

You 2 do realise that the Commissioner of Wine and Cheese from BBT may pull seniority. Sure we have thought this through are we?

Kz
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cwarner7_11
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#1759
In reply to #1757

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 11:43 PM

As long as there is sufficient wine and cheese, does it matter?
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packrat561
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#1767
In reply to #1757

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/13/2010 6:05 AM

Well, then we will just have to deny ol' moss licker a visa.

an elaboration can be requested on the e-letter spam telegraph.

signed ,

wisenheimer

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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1771
In reply to #1755

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/13/2010 10:36 AM

Oooohhhh, I'll be the official taster! You never know...someone may try and poison you or sumptin'...I will limit myself to the cheeses and liquor tasting....

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Stueywright
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#1756
In reply to #1751

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 11:07 PM

No, No, NO,

Its only in English that these aberrations occur. Yooo Dooo speak English?

GH is 'F' as in 'enough'

O is (short) 'i' as in women (wimmin)

TI is 'sh' as in position, ignition, etc.

See...... Fish!

Also, ghydoux???????

Stu.

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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1772
In reply to #1756

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/13/2010 10:40 AM

Oh TIIT...

Yes, I get it...easy as 1-6-95

give me time...

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Anonymous Poster
#1748
In reply to #1743

Re: Inmates That Cannot be Contained in Standard Asylum Housing or Straitjackets

04/12/2010 10:18 PM

Yep that sounds like the the Ministry of External Affairs, just factor in you also will be co-scripting the Doco series Trans is doing, following the whole process 'live' for the world of donors. "Transparent Aid" so to speak.

Kz

(Yeah, yeah - Happy birthday Drew - good grief)
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Stueywright
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#1734
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 8:59 PM

OK!

You're now, officially, PreZ.

Packy can be, as Mrs R has suggested, The Top Cop.

I have to approach Kyz To see if he'll spin all of this.

KYZ! WHAT'RE YOU UP TO, IMPORTANT?

Garth and Russ. You in too?

Me?

I'm the shyte-kicker. I know it's the bottom of the pile, but, it's a very important role and it's more fun. (And, as every Military{ oxymoron= military intelligence) knows, it's the 'must have' shyte-kickers who really rule.

To those who're now fed-up with all of this levity, can I say, that it's you who've caused it.

Hard to see what more can be said constructively in the realm.

ALL of us here now know the best designs, where to get the product from, how to transport and move it, minimum mods, important base requirements, how to place it, how to stabilise it, and how to entice folk to take shelter in it, and ultimately how to transform the installation into attractive urban domestic dwellings

Next step, which I know is progressing, but at 'beaurocratic pace', as NGO's, and others, jostle for the spoils.

Disgusting!

That's why I proposed ( veiled, I know, due to the sensitivities of some) that a core of worldwide "Disaster Fixers" be established and be permanently in place to attend 'problems', as they arise. Rather like a modern day Red Adair org.

But a little more benign.

What say ye?

Stu.

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Garthh
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#1735
In reply to #1734

Viral Housing Ideas That Can't Be Contained

04/12/2010 9:23 PM

Contrary to what some would have us believe, there never were more than minor technical questions.

The threads were [are?] just to raise awareness.

The real challenge is how to leave the policy makers no choice but take a chance & do the sensible thing.

Can I be the Minister of Truth [mounted division]?

Can we wear Pith Helmets?
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Anonymous Poster
#1741
In reply to #1735

Re: Viral Housing Ideas That Can't Be Contained

04/12/2010 9:45 PM

I don't mind what you name your "ministry" so long you produce the cans for Stuey's "ministry" of "SK' to turn into villages - and the Rabbitess makes sense of the transport, paper and stops limits heads being banged together.

Kz

(Now back to contemplating post the outfits and 1739)
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Transcendian
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#1769
In reply to #1735

Re: Viral Housing Ideas That Can't Be Contained

04/13/2010 9:30 AM

Reports out of Haiti sure don't make it appear as if much influence has yet, or if ever will be achieved there. The old saw, "You can lead a horse to water, but can't make 'em drink." Seems to apply.

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cwarner7_11
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#1737
In reply to #1734

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 9:31 PM

ed Adai- now theree is a role model for those who want to solve problems...
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cwarner7_11
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#1739
In reply to #1737

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 9:34 PM

Whoops- my computer ran out of "r's" on that last post, and added an extra "e". That should read, "Red Adair- now there is a role model for those who want to solve problems..."

Why is the edit button deactivated???
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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1740
In reply to #1739

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 9:38 PM

Oh thank God...I thought you meant Idi Amin....close one.....

OK, no A/C...pretty native women with giant fans, then? With or without tops...up to you, Sire....

Oh, crap...this'll be pulled for sure...just watch...

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#1742
In reply to #1740

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 9:47 PM

From what I have seen on some clothing-optional beaches, I think maybe tops might be preferred, although I am willing to judge each case on its own merits...

As for the fountain, I am a bit more partial to a dog with lifted leg...
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ky
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#1753
In reply to #1742

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/12/2010 10:57 PM

You aint seen nothing yet. But would they wear them? Is the position for fashion police still available or has such a position ever existed? Imagine how they would look with an AK47. IWPMSL, Ky.

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Mrs.Rabbit
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#1770
In reply to #1753

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/13/2010 10:32 AM

I would like to nominate myself for that position...fashion police! Do I get a gun? Pretty pleeeese??? I've been watching What Not To Wear a lot lately, so I am overly qualified.

And my mom is an artist (or so she keeps telling everyone....) so there's that....

I like these outfits, but the pants need to be shorts (Haiti is hot...and muggy...ew) and you need the epaulets!

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#1745
In reply to #1739

Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/12/2010 10:07 PM

I thought you got a new [different?] keyboard?

We need a good deep pocketed sponsor

The "Just Do It" ERT [emergency Response team]
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cwarner7_11
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#1747
In reply to #1745

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/12/2010 10:16 PM

This is a laptop. I got a new keyboard, and every time I plug the new keyboard in, the laptop keyboard starts working again. So, I put the new keyboard aside. Then, after a day or two, the laptop keyboard starts dropping "r's" again...Very wierd situation. If I let it go long enough, it will start dropping 4's, f's and v's, as well, but only lower case usually- when it started dropping upper case letters as well is when I got the new keyboard....

But this has nothing to do with Container Housing, does it?
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Anonymous Poster
#1749
In reply to #1747

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/12/2010 10:24 PM

Big poblem fo a Pesident Chalie though

Can the fountain dog be called Phydoux?

Kz
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cwarner7_11
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#1750
In reply to #1749

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/12/2010 10:41 PM

Phydoux is fine, but I was thinking more along the lines of a Bull Mastif rather than a toy poodle...But, everyone knows, Presidents aren't allowed to make decisions (except in the case of whether our female companions shall be allowed to parade about topless), so, you can name it as you see fit. Or is this a question of sufficient import to be decided by the legislature?
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Geoff Daly
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#1761
In reply to #1750

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/13/2010 12:11 AM

Charlie,

How about the MACK truck mascot is he good enough?

How big?

Geoff

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#1762
In reply to #1761

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/13/2010 12:30 AM

What we are after here is maximum effective volumetric flow...
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#1763
In reply to #1762

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/13/2010 1:04 AM

How about a large dog urinal urinating?
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packrat561
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#1766
In reply to #1750

Re: Contained Ideas That Can't Be Standard

04/13/2010 5:58 AM

Legislature? We don't need no stinking legislature!

I humbly suggest , Prez. for life , Charlie the First declare a permanent " State of Emergency" right out of the starting gate. Will streamline the process of " helping the people"

I also suggest Kyzine as whatever the proper title is for the dude that ensures, that whatever NGO, corporation, nation or individual that does business with our little goat rodeo, pay the proper Graft, Bribe , Palm grease, respect that we are entitled to.

Signed,

ClosetTwerp

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#1754
In reply to #1747

You Can't Contain Ideas or Why That Be?

04/12/2010 10:59 PM

No more off topic than

bellicose bellowing

or the plaintive wail of the slighted...
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#1768
In reply to #1734

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/13/2010 9:21 AM

Of course I'm a supporter.

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#1765
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/13/2010 5:36 AM

Dear cwarner,

Awesome suggestion on the uniforms,,,,you've got my second on your nomination for prez.,,,and excellent job on laying down the ground rules on your job description,,,,at least some of us understand what's truly important in getting something done on this site. check it out, 6 emoticons, 1 more than you know who's post. beat that cap'n dingleberry!

Signed,

Closet Clown #2

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#1806
In reply to #1723

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 3:49 AM

for all you raucus rebels, I would like to recommend watching the movie "Pirate Radio", if you haven't seen it.

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#1810
In reply to #1806

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 8:37 AM

There are no rebels around here, Chris.

To a man, or woman, we are united to the very same cause you are.

I, for one, was getting fed up with the situation and I said so.

Synchronicity? Subliminal?

Soon as I start 'mouthing off' in a little 'specifically directed' fun, hey presto, we see the very response I was wanting to see for a very long time.

We all know the mechanics and the logistics, ad nauseum.

Along with yours there are some very significant talents here, which deserve to be given the air and allowed to run, in the quest we're all on. There is no point further regurgitating the stuff which has taken 1800 odd post to gel.

Your present track is the correct one.

But.

It needs to be recognised that to run an efficient organisation on the scale of that proposed, some serious administrative talent will be neccessary.

No point re-inventing the wheel either.

Admin is a mature science. Some of us have very long and successful experience at it ( no, I'm nopt looking for a job, neither do I need the accolades nor kudos. I told you my position in this alreasdy)

Best get the CVs out and vet them.

I said before, and again, mistakes will not be permitted.

Transparency is paramount.

And personnel need to get paid. Remember, you pay peanuts , you get monkeys. I do know what happens if you don't pay. We, and I use the term in the most benign manner, can't afford to go down that track.

This will need a sustained long term commitment from all personnel,( will you give the next 15 years of your life to the cause for free? ) Don't even think of signing on for two or three months, you'll only get in the way of those who do know what they're doing. This need committment from those who wish to join, and then, continuity.

Why is it the US army has to take the fall avery time a disaster happens in the world. Oh, yes, I know, the humanitarian philosophy. But where's the money coming from. It's only going to further increase your taxes. Not fair.

In fact in all the scheming we've done thus far to get a viable solution to the problem, which will eminently apply to all areas of the world, the commodity lacking so as to allow the proposal to gestate and live, is money

Without great piles of that, all of our forgoing is just a lot of hot air emitted by a bunch of dreaming 'old farts' ( my wife's description of me, sorry) and wannabe engineers.

By all means write all the documents you wish, but it won't amount to a hill-o'-beans without money.

And where's that to come from?

Anyone approached a young man called Gates? He's in computers, I think.

As an example, I support the ramblings of our old mate Kyz, in respect of establishing industry in the community of Haiti ( or any other stricken zone) so that they may succeeed by self help. It's clear that they're not administrators, otherwise the country would not have been in the mess that it was before the 'rumble'.

I see that's where we come in.

Application of good honest simple technology that they can do, and then improve on , with guidance, to rebuild not only their nation but their self esteem. Give them effective admin, and education and they'll beat the crap out of the criminals eventually.

Simplisticly put here I know, but I'm not about to write a thesis, I don't have either the time or the inclination. I do have the technical ability to help and , I hope has been demonstrated all through this thread, the desire to see the disadvantaged lifted to health and happiness. There's not a body in the Nation of Haiti who deserved to suffer as they have done through this.

Don't get me wrong.There will have to be a very detailed Ops Manual. And someone will have to see to it. It needs to be as succinct as humanly possible. It'll take a very special person to do that job.

No, I'm not preempting the position to anyone in particular, but whoever wishes to take it on will need a reserve of resolve.

Gotta go again,

Stu.

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#1811
In reply to #1810

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 10:04 AM

Dear Chris, Geoff and C-W:

Many thanks for the congrats that you individually threw my way. Unfortunately, the degree won't be "official" until I step up on the stage to accept my diploma about 4 weeks hence. I just hope that the Graduation Ceremonies do not coincide on the same day or weekend with my oldest daughter's Graduation from NYU where she'll be receiving her diploma for MS in Speech Therapy (High Honors/President's List and National Honor Society).....let's just say I'm a very proud Papa!

Anyhow, it's been a gruelling 3 1/2 years getting this and I'm glad it's finally over....the best and worse parts were the long days spent in the laboratories, then the entire Thesis process which is very very difficult and time consuming.

Yes Chris, Advanced Water Filtration Techniques.....lots and lots of microbiology.

In regard to the Chapter paper....I do have a hard copy of it buried somewhere in my storage boxes. I just have to locate it and dig it out. Give me a week to try and find it, okay? IF I can't locate I can contact a friend that'll have an electronic copy of the Master. As for me writing the dang thing, I frankly am wiped out writing papers so I'll leave it up to the blog community as a whole to pick it apart and go with the changes.

Someone is still going to have to fill out the IRS paperwork, etc.

Have a great day!

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#1813
In reply to #1810

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 10:58 AM

I agree Stuey

The structure I was beginning to reveal is based in a standing executive (paid) dedicated and available to liaise, plan, prepare, research and develop technology, methods, strategy, logistics, recruit and train, manage finance and produce ongoing media.

These are full time intensely active jobs. Key people (a lot) need to be available anywhere in the world, for any amount of time, on no notice. That means they are otherwise unemployable - so how do they eat?

Nearest model is "emergency services" - not a Lawn Bows Club

google "Emergency services organization diagram"

Take your pick.

B

Add in a media division (inc a paid full time web geek)

And ref several posts above - this is an international operation - you pick your location, tax and articles laws to suit - hence my comment about the international finance experienced person.

However I'm not surprised my posts on this direction are being missed as they all seem to have been voted down. Well done to the usual politics I guess. Will it ever leave us to get on with this?

Kyzine
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#1816
In reply to #1813

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 2:11 PM

well you get a GA from me. (whether I agree or not) because you have written a well thought out perspective, constructively, and provided pictures. I do not trust permanent positions, and agree with Nigh that term positions will likely work best, but on everything else, all the evidence points to you and stuey being right.

as for you being voted down, I don't see that kind of activity recently for you?

Chris
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#1822
In reply to #1813

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 11:10 PM

K,

similar to chart Chris showed in his posting, al input is relevant.

Good chart for such an organization.

l

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#1814
In reply to #1810

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 11:26 AM

Dear Stuey, I am in general agreement. The old joke about what makes an airplane fly? - Money. comes to mind.

I have in the past found that Foundations like the Gates Foundation, and specifically the UN Foundation in my case seem to have prescribed agendas from which they will not, and do not wavier. I can see both sides of this for an organization to succeed at one thing, it needs to know what that mission is. In a way this does make Mr. Penn's organizations singular focus on Haiti practical.

Geoffs post reporting on some actual events there in Haiti, and the land where another tent camp is to go, reported as vulnerable and unsuitable imply again that there are issues of who owns what in Haiti that show again needs for deeds, and law. I have doubts about reasons for hope when considering the state of the Haitian Government.

Frankly I'm not surprised that internally displaced refugees there are shunted to less valuable locations.

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#1818
In reply to #1814

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/15/2010 2:46 PM

Hi Transcendian,

I agree money works.

I don't think it is the only way. Barter, Volunteer, and Donation can do a tremendous amount, and can also stimulate the flow of money. Money is an artificial construct. It isn't real. Nature provides the materials, People provide the Design, labour and transportation to prepare the materials. People provide the labour and knowledge to create a product from the materials. People create Tools and processes. This is all Value. Money just makes it easier to translate value to other people.

I'm not saying a foundation can be run without money, but I am saying a hell of a lot can be put together without it. Too much money focus leads directly to power mongering. If we focus on getting the job done, and acquiring tools, materials, and labour, the flow will be improved.

As to how to get money, I answered it once, but will explain more thoroughly how I think it can work.

  • Step 1) Creation of leadership team with decision making capability (Volunteer to start)(Vts)
  • Step 2) Implement NFP (not for profit) documentation & registration (Vts)
  • Step 3) Acquire & Develop IT resources for web system (Vts)
  • Step 4) Create Web Project Management System (WPMS) online (Vts)
  • Step 5) Project Proposals documented on WPMS
  • Step 6) Prepare Marketing materials and presentations
  • Step 6) Everyone is a potential fundraiser, using the WPMS to present to family, friends, neighbors, acquaintances, or other.
  • Step 7) Store, Manage, and Track all donations as per procedure. If project terminates, Donor is consulted for resolution of their contribution. (different project?)
  • Step 8) Review processes, and assignment of Project Managers and Volunteer Team.
  • Step 9) Implement Project, Commission, Verify, Validate, & Document
  • Step 10) Publish results to WPMS continuously.
  • Step 11) Conduct meetings & seminars to raise awareness and stay connected.

I think CR4 represents some tools that could be duplicated in the WPMS, such as the PM system, and discussion threads, in context of project proposals.

Also, I have been asked by admin to create a new thread to gather support for the decision making features plan. (voting) so will link to that shortly.

I defer to people with more experience than me for practical knowledge on how this all gets done, but I don't want to fall into the same old traps, and end up in the same corrupt inefficient place as others have. We are all so frustrated with the status quo that it is time for something new.

As for contacting other foundations, I think that if they had the vision and will, it would already be done. Penn is a shining example. Gates have dedicated to vaccinations. We are people of vision with something different to offer. I think simply by making the NFPF project based, we accomplish something radically different. Here is an example. (nothing new under the sun)

Chris
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#1829
In reply to #1818

Re: Shipping Ideas That Can't Be Contained in Standard Housing

04/17/2010 1:08 PM

The Forum sponsors and creator refused to support our vision.

I've tried Barter, Vounteerism, and have requested Donations. Robbing banks as Stalin did, apparently works better.

Selling addictive substances like tobacco, and drugs apparently works pretty well too.

Control of the food supply is another hardball tactic.

Money is a triumph of conceptual art. I've posited that valuing and basing it on life would give labor leverage in relation to capital. Imagine the power we might have if we all bought insurance policies together?

Look at whom has the most power, and it isn't even the banks, but the Insurance Companies.

Every real business, or real organization has to have an insurance policy.

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#1836
In reply to #1818

We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 11:42 AM

what about setting up a shipping container conversion company in Haiti?

a for profit, the profits being reinvested in the companies expansion, or setting up subcontractors that would build CEB foundations, Manufacture/recycle anchoring systems, build the rainwater catchments.....

use as many local vendors as possible, pay taxes...

as the local labor force gains more skill, turn over more control.

The initial investments being paid back over a longer than usual schedule

The intention being to enable, not charity
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#1837
In reply to #1836

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 11:59 AM

Garthh-

This sounds like a good idea to start Chrisg's polling process. With appropriate preparation, and minimal renumeration (to cover costs and part of my normal living expenses), I would be willing and able to spend a few months in Haiti setting up such a project. One might think in terms of a team of activators, rotating on some fixed schedule in and out of the country. Of course, there is a whole lot of work that would have to go in to the project before putting anyone on the ground.
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#1863
In reply to #1837

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 12:13 AM

I've created a preliminary survey question in SurveyMonkey, mostly to test the survey capability. It wasn't too bad to create.. see what you think.

Chris
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#1865
In reply to #1863

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 1:05 AM

Chris - survey questions are hard to write.

Garth's and mine are the same embodiment - not for profit.

Mine is only distinguished by my re-suggesting the University umbrella for the Garth model, in answer to your V.B.C. proposal.

Yours is the Volunteer Based Charity

Geoff's I'd see as the other choice of form a new NGO

Presented chronologically; Geoff is 1), mine/Garth is 2) and yours 3)
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#1868
In reply to #1865

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 2:25 AM

I didn't explore too far in the surveymonkey, and the single multiple choice style only allowed 3 options, at least in the free version. but we can learn a lot from a vote.. your clarification is adding a lot of clarity already. (for me)

Chris
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#1873
In reply to #1865

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 8:43 AM

I saw Kyzine's as an extension of the for profit proposal

The suggestion of affiliation with an existing organization reasonable

I just think that the non profit status brings along negative baggage in the community we would be trying to help.

We would be a target for theft of various types, which would be justified as "free form charity" by the perpetrators

The paying of taxes is a gesture of good will for the community

& would help the new company acclimate more quickly...

There are grant & loan options [in the US at least] unavailable to non profits

The "depreciation" procedure is also beneficial to lower the tax burden
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#1867
In reply to #1863

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 2:14 AM

Chris-

You should add "Other" and "none of the above" to your survey question...
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#1869
In reply to #1867

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 2:30 AM

hopefully we can acquire such tools here at cr4.
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#1870
In reply to #1869

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 3:33 AM

Well that (3) being the limit then, as CW says, embarrassingly correctly, that makes it A or B or "other" (~ = "none of the above").

So you need to carefully think what the opposing essences of A and B are.

E.g. You could survey NFP verses VBC, and other would tell you if many are waiting for a better approach. One would assume on publication that "other" would then be the focus of discussion. You could then survey A & B approaches within the 'winner'.

My second wrong was to "quantify" Geoff's idea (as above, or at all) - I've actually no idea what the structure is, or the 'type', or if it's stand alone or umbrellaed or "other".

So, you might add to your protocols; check the Q. synopsis with the key proponent/s.

Kz
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#1875
In reply to #1870

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 1:19 PM

agreed (care to post these suggestions in the questionnaire thread?)
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#1877
In reply to #1875

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 4:46 AM

What is un-clear about what happens?

Kyzine
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#1878
In reply to #1877

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 6:46 AM

I'm not sure what you are asking?

at any rate, here are the survey results so far. (5 for Garth 2 for Chris/Kyzine)
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#1879
In reply to #1878

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 8:41 AM

I've made up the mind of Transcendia. Best solution in relation to Haiti for Transcendia is a for profit enterprise that supports the non profit enterprise.

Can't take care of others, if you can't take care of yourself. Note Gates, had fortune, & goes into Foundation work. Penn has money from work, and goes into Non Profit work.

Details of the founding of the international Red Cross, and its founder, are an interesting story. Founder was on business, ignored business and went out to aid wounded soldiers, ignoring business. He got sued by stockholders? etc,.

Some of Shipping Container work in Haiti is non profit, and some is for profit.

Water boxes are to be sold by makers for profit. Water is a business in Haiti. There may well be lessons about non profit, and for profit realities there.

Standardized housing is an international need that if filled will make some profit, and benefit the disadvantaged by overcoming some of what causes slums.

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#1880
In reply to #1879

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 12:11 PM

sort of a Get-Poor-Quick scheme for those who have money AND a heart eh?

what sort of For Profit business are you thinking of? Consulting? Products? Modification of Containers?

A quick start for you and your wife might be to write and publish a book? (How To on Gaffing?) Lots of pictures please. Safety is going to be an even bigger business than it is now...

Chris
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#1881
In reply to #1880

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 12:17 PM

Combining safety & gaffing

gaffing for the living
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#1884
In reply to #1881

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/23/2010 1:10 AM

Cowa-bunga! Leave ya'll be for a few weeks and whooowee! What ya'll got going!!

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#1885
In reply to #1884

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/24/2010 2:25 PM

Kooks like we're stuck.

All low tech, and High tech aspects covered. Fights have broken out, but peace made, sort of.

There it is, nothing for it! -no money to be voted to spend from here.

I vote Globalspec give CW money to go to Haiti and scout. I say we need our man on the ground. All Cheery Honor to the Shipping Container President. elected by consensus.

Where is that Kitty?

Crazy Cat, Crazy Cat, Whose the Biggest Crazy Cat?

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#1882
In reply to #1880

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/21/2010 9:06 PM

By now you ought to know I want an airport under my flag that is a free trade zone with some manners, and anarchistic operating procedures. The spirit of the law, is more important than the actual law.

Two things a government is to do: Defend and Educate.

Haiti, has done neither for its people.

There are limits to what an island nation with too many dependent on limited resources , along with language barriers, and ignorance that comes from lack of schools.

Modification of Shipping Containers could be an industry for Haiti, up to a point.

Textiles are suspect due to natural resources. Last I knew they didn't even grow good pot in Haiti.

Scout needed to determine really what could benefit all around.

Took awhile to get even Puerto Rico on track, and they are ripped off by the US as a Territory for taxes paid, and not given back in services like Medicaid. Warning for My Daughter is a book I wrote. Honest was the name of a mag we had in mind. Best RSD

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#1886
In reply to #1879

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/24/2010 4:41 PM

benefit the disadvantaged by overcoming some of what causes slums.

Slums are caused by and uncaring, over-bearing upper class.

I've been contemplating a trip to Haiti, the opportunity is there; I'm amazed by the technologies being employed by some private aid groups. Overall mantling will take a generation to begin forming homogeneous societal benefits.

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#1887
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Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/24/2010 5:47 PM

Somewhere in the thread it is mentioned that building is less efficient because standardized housing is hated, and homes on the block are to be unique and different. This is reported to slow and increase the costs of housing so that it cannot fill the needs. This is reported as acutely evident in slums, and evidenced by slapdash buildings, that are often way too unique.

We look forward to your report.

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#1889
In reply to #1887

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/29/2010 1:31 PM

The lyric 'picky-packy little houses'; JC Mellencamp comes to mind...with the realization we've lost our sense of style. I've decided not to go for now but do expect a report too...(: What a horrid life most in Haiti must've had prior to the quake, much could be discussed of a topic centered on the unprecedented growth and expansion of slums throughout various economies in the world.

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#1838
In reply to #1836

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 12:04 PM

I basically agree, although I think we will run into a wall with 'permissions' and legalities, because the infrastructure is more than decimated.

Along those lines, I thought of a school/university that teaches construction skills, either shipping containers, CW's pressed bricks, water filtration essentials, solar energy installation & design, and agriculture as well. It could be the kind of university with many affiliations, so that spin-off projects are conducted.

Again, I can only imagine labour scenarios (having no experience there), and I don't want to offend people, especially the Haitians. I think the teaching institution could be a major driver, if it was like a company, but was open and approachable in the dissemination of knowledge, and tuition was perhaps, labour in the spin-off projects.

I think the company you describe could work, but might still be inclined to implement it as a charity. First, you can write the by-laws for the thing to work the way you want, so that all money goes to reinvestment, and also, so that you have other sources of capital. A business is great in an economy that has money, but they have none. What they have is Value (labour) so that necessitates a different plan. (I think)

ga

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#1842
In reply to #1838

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 9:12 PM

Chris,

Morissett St.Preux who is from La Coteau (SW side of Island west of LaCayes) was in the process of building a tech school on his property there; when the earthquake hit and he had many thousands of $$$ stolen from a 20 foot shipping container nearly 18 months ago in PAP by a bunch of thugs...found opened up least than a couple of hours of arriving and they were allowed access....all his own personal money in the containers contents.

He has been here in Boston at the Boston Tech center teaching and has students going to assist in the curriculum for Plumbers, Electricians, Carpenters, Masons, Welders and Fabricators etc. He also sees an industry in the shipping containers as well...likes the idea of exporting to New Orleans as finished items ready for installation based on some of CR4 postings.

He knows Father Marks Orphanage where they now have 12x 20 fooot containers awaiting conversion...Richard Martin is working to help using his prior work in Gonvaise where he has done a whole school set up (one is two stories).

CaptMossoe maybe you can suggest a course in water treatment and the use of the Clay pot system I posted below the Zanaqua...sure you saw similar in Iraq when there.

Good idea for a tech type school for the future Haitian needed trades.

Geoff

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#1874
In reply to #1842

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 9:12 AM

Geoff,

I'll take a second harder look at the Zanaqua water filtration technology and see where it stands in terms on implementation and ease of use. As far as I'm concerned whatever water filtration system we may settle upon it's got to be KISS. I do know that this system cost a small fortune @ $20,000 a pop. I don't know what unit cost of the replacement filters are.....

I never saw the Zanaqua system being used in Iraq during Desert Shield/Desert Storm and Desert Saber back in 1990-1991, probably because it wasn't invented yet.....that was 19 years ago Geoff. I left the Army in Nov. '91 about 5 months after returning. I never got back to Iraq and Gulf War II (ie, Op. Iraqi Freedom). We utilized the packaged water filtration/treatment plants that I've told you about, and that the US Army still employs today.....everything is in a standard MIL container for ease of deployment and set-up/breakdown. No way could we use that type of equipment due to the very high purchase costs, even if the DOD allowed non-military procurement.........just isn't going to happen due to National Security and military secrets.

Let you all now soon enough what I can find out more re this system.

BTW Geoff, where do we stand with the P&G people regarding the PUR water filtration system? Has that fallen to the wayside for some reason?

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#1876
In reply to #1874

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 7:42 PM

Well, All Righty then! I hope we can get along.

Far as I know the Potters for Peace designs are cheap, and better than no system.

Far as 20 grand systems, or 50 grand systems, or a new lake, like done in Puerto Rico et al, its not like people in Haiti are going to of a sudden not need clean water.

So what the hell, how long are they going to fly it it in plastic bottles?

It would be interesting to know what the government of Haiti actually does spend whatever money it does have, on.

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#1845
In reply to #1838

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 10:51 PM

Hi Chris, Clemson has demonstrated access.

It has all the other things you note.

Universities can and do run business satellites to operate IP ventures.

This "emergency response" has interests for Faculties aside from Architecture and Engineering. It involves Economics through to Anthropology

It is potentially a multi-discipline gold mine of new studies.

Universities are also set up to receive donations, grants and funding, handle legalities and tax etcetera. They are not seen as competitors for charity turf.

What they lack in the "emergency response" situation,is the ground team, the Garth's and Stuey's and Packrat's, i.e. the team and functions I was laying out - to make practical construction happen.

So, most of what you sight is due to the push to form yet another NGO and being a 'new kid' struggling against the existing ones for funding, recognition, so access.

That whole approach remains a mystery to me.
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#1846
In reply to #1845

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 11:16 PM

I have much the same take. That's why I continue to pound on the problem as being about law and politics, and not technical or of an engineering nature.

That's why I say that the solution is same for Haiti, as it was, and is for Puerto Rico.

Not that even Puerto Rico, or Mississippi, or Louisiana is in prefect shape, but they are better off than Haiti, since labor can leave to do work and live somewhere else.

The Cubans are even now allowing US aircraft to overfly to Haiti to help Haitians.

This is unprecedented in my lifetime.

It's almost a secret that people can get along and help each other live.

It's one secret, I don't want to keep.

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#1848
In reply to #1845

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 11:57 PM

Hi Kyzine,

That fits like a glove to what I was imagining.

unfortunately I have to admit a lack of knowledge and know how. I'm unemployed and fund-less. I'm not sure what I can actually do to advance this plan, or a NPF org, or a company, etc.

Any suggestions?

Chris
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#1849
In reply to #1848

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 12:40 AM

What I imagine would in fact be a non profit, structured as a for profit company. The difference is mostly psychological

helping someone by giving them an opportunity, instead of a handout, is only subtly different in fact, but worlds different in intention

Respecting sweat equity.

favoring practical education over, formal education

being a good example by paying taxes, unlike nonprofits or mega corps

instead of trying to build an organization that would be all things for all situations

better a series of smaller businesses, built with similar structures & organizations

Does anyone have opinions about what is the optimum size for a working group?

I know it depends on the function
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#1851
In reply to #1849

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 12:50 AM

Optimum size for a working group is 4 to 6 individuals...
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#1853
In reply to #1851

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 1:22 AM

6 or 9 sound good

I like teams of 3 for physical stuff, pairs sometimes

once again depends on the work

it get harder to be in sync & requires more time for larger groups to gel.

you gotta be a good assistant to be able to be a good leader

being a good assistant is more than doing what you're told,

it's knowing what's next & why..
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#1854
In reply to #1853

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 2:15 AM

you gotta be a good assistant to be able to be a good leader

being a good assistant is more than doing what you're told,

it's knowing what's next & why..

That is so true.

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#1855
In reply to #1853

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 2:17 AM

agreed.. ga
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#1856
In reply to #1853

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 2:48 AM

Guys, this company may be of interest in terms of working group numbers, project interface even base principals of establishment.

Pentagram is named for 5 people coming together to start it. It's bigger now.

"New" might also be of interest

But remember they don't do what we are wanting to do - it's just about "successful management information philosophy in the problem solving arena".

Our count may be greater than 5 but the principal is the parts are equal and roles assigned to ability. It means you (Garthh) would be on that 'level' as what you're expected to do must be resourced to your needs - and who knows better what they are, than the guy hands on doing it?

Equally the "President" (CW) is a role assigned and group resourced - in this case as the "visible head" for things people expect of normal Presidents in normal corporations. "At the table" it's hats off equality - project comes first, attitude - who does what can change. I.e CW is not "confined to matters Presidential" he can input as CW, any and all of his range of skills.

As a structure it does not suit megalomaniacs, decision forcer's/controllers, compartmentaliser's and blame gamers.

It suits individuals who are willing to resource their partners with the extra critical talents needed to round out their effectiveness - and see no individual left holding the baby. It works because information is uninhibited and all can see what's happening and get in and help.

And it fits with that model I linked - well fits with more like that diagram actually works in a real fire situation.

Kyzine

(remembered this time)
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#1857
In reply to #1856

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 3:18 AM

Hi Kyz,

I like the concept that the structure can change as the task changes. Plus team members can be added or subtracted from the task, as needed , while maintaining a task leader. Allows resources to not be compartmentalised so rigidly,as to hinder the effort , and yet prevent duplication of effort or working at cross purposes.

ratty

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#1861
In reply to #1857

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 7:59 PM

Hi Packy, yes it's a bit of a favourite of mine

"Allows resources to not be compartmentalised so rigidly, as to hinder the effort, and yet prevent duplication of effort or working at cross purposes." - nice capture, I'm stealing it.

And viewed in counter-point; you have the "power pyramid" and the answers to #2 to 6 on this thread; Ten Red Flags for Innovation

Kyzine
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#1862
In reply to #1861

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 8:59 PM

Looks like you could have different functions under the same structural umbrella

An Iso based structure is fine, as long as it's meaningful.

I seen this be so general as to be worthless, or so detailed there's a written procedure for going to the bathroom
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#1864
In reply to #1862

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 12:44 AM

True Garth - it's more about attitude ambiance than some diagram.

So;

Looking around our table; who should author "the written procedure for going to the bathroom"

Kyzine (is looking at Ratty)
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#1866
In reply to #1864

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 1:35 AM

Last steps of the procedure:

The job is not over until the paperwork is done.

Wash hands.

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#1871
In reply to #1864

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 6:00 AM

Due to the recent economic downturn, we feel that some innovative cost cutting measures are in order. We have retained the managing consulting team of Ratwerp, Ltd. The following are the " thinking outside of the box" suggestions, designed to enhance our productivity and make our organization "leaner and meaner".

1) Starting tomorrow, all employees will be assigned odd or even numbers.

Use of the company rest room facilities will follow these simple guidelines:

Employees with even numbers will use the facilities on even days, those with odd numbers will use the facilities on odd days. To prevent non-compliance, employees will be issued badges that will be used in a bar code reader at the facility door, in addition , a bio-metric hand geometry device will prevent employees from using another employees badge.Any one not needing to use the lavatory on assigned days will be allowed to request a form at the HR dept to allow them to be credited with the unused days on the following basis: for every 10 unused days, the employee will receive a bonus day that can be used on the employees un-assigned day.

Example : An employee, that has had the perseverance and determination to avoid using the toilet for 10 of his assigned days will be able to use the toilet once on his un-assigned day, Any bonus days , accumulated and unused at the end of each quarter will be forfeited.

Our management team working " synergistically" with Ratwerp, Ltd., has determined the savings in toilet paper, paper towels and water alone, will allow us to amortize the cost of the restroom security devices in only 47 years.

Any comments to our management regarding these measures should be deposited in the " you are not just an employee, your part of our family" suggestion box.

All suggestions or comments will be read when management returns from its team building seminar in Bali.

Please sign this sheet and return it to your supervisor.

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#1872
In reply to #1871

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/20/2010 8:18 AM

While Ratwerp may be joking about the subject

The procedural characterization is not far off the mark

The signature sheet is often used as weapon by management

"you signed the sheet, we're not responsible!"
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#1859
In reply to #1856

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/19/2010 9:29 AM

Excellent organizational philosophy. Team leader deals directly with client, draws on group resources as required to meet project needs. no administrative interference...
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#1839
In reply to #1836

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 12:07 PM

Gartth-

I do believe this one deserves a separate thread. One of the beauties of this idea is that something viable is left behind after all the do-gooders go home, or on to their next crisis...
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#1840
In reply to #1836

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 1:31 PM

We discussed that eventual progression of the Shipping Container Conversions a good while ago. Such work is suited to the educational levels of the available labor.

Certainly you would expect that once Haitians got good at converting containers through filling their own needs, it would represent an exportable business for them.

However there is a theory of business operations and profitability that makes converting containers and exporting them for profit, as an export, problematic, and returns us to the advanced purpose built folding concepts made by a company such as Habitiflex.

Essentially Shipping Containers are left over packaging, best used close to the ports where they pile up. The value added of the conversions is diminished the further from the market, most markedly affected by transportation costs.

Hence it would appear to me that while the use of Shipping Containers is a highly practical solution to some of the needs clearly apparent in Haiti, as an industry for an island, the industry as an export prospect dependent on Shipping Containers, has some disadvantages that recommend the sort of things Habitifex has designed and built.

A company like Habitiflex may well find that production of their purpose made folding designs in Haiti may make economic sense due to low labor costs that may offset transportation costs.

Mostly however it would appear that for islands such as Haiti, Tourism becomes their best bet. My study of Puerto Rico implies whatever has happened there, would be best for Haiti, and their economy is based on Drug manufacturing and Tourism.

They also benefit from aspects of education, law and status as a US Territory that make economic investment more secure, than the political situation in Haiti.

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#1841
In reply to #1840

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 2:36 PM

These images are ones that I made last year and the year before, but it occurs to me that they could also be made with Reinforced Compressed Earth (RCE) as per CW's presentation earlier. (instead of reinforced concrete as I had originally imagined them.) I think the geodesic panels would have to be thicker, but didn't someone say that the RCE was stronger than concrete?

At any rate, there are lots of things that could be implemented in a school or business. As my father used to say, "There is more than one way to skin a cat." (oops sorry del/blink)

Chris
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#1844
In reply to #1841

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 9:35 PM

Chris,

Could you use the "concrete canvas" material as part of the Geodesic panel design with some ali edge joints...very sturdy in high winds if only made 2.5 metere high ...could even make into a quonset type shape using the triangular shape?.

Again thinking outside the box along with the use of shipping containers for Hospitals.

Geoff

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#1847
In reply to #1844

Re: We Should Play To Our Strengths

04/18/2010 11:49 PM

Hi Geoff,

I have no experience working with the stuff, so I have a bit of difficulty designing with it, but I suspect that you are right and it, or similar strategies could accelerate the fabrication of pre-fab panels, or cast-in-place strategies equally.

What I am showing for the the geodesic panels has some very precise angles to it, to have the 'curve' of the dome, and the circumference of the plan circle come out right, and that is where I thought that the RCE might work as there is a mold which can ensure those angles.

Same for the cast walls of the other plan.

Chris
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