Dealing with "Big Brother"

Wow!!!........................If I started a thread like this, it would be ripped from the front page within minutes.

I have a cell phone for emergencies only, otherwise I don't use it.

I only use my credit card for online purchases. 3-4 times a year.

I don't ever use debit cards or ATMs.

My grocery cards are under a fictitious name and address.

I pay cash for everything I buy, unlesss it's online.

I completely clean up my computer at least twice a week.

And I'm not even doing anything wrong.....................Have I mentioned that I don't trust government?

People across the US are drinking some bad koolaid, and are willingly being herded into a smaller and smaller cage. By the time they realize what happened, it will be too late to escape.

You paid cash for your house & your car!!! Wow wish I could save that kind of money. Seems every time I get a couple of hundred dollars put aside something major breaks & I have to use my savings to pay for it.

If you're trying to hide you can't really own anything that comes with a title or a deed with your real name on it. You can be found using this information.

Your grocery cards are under fictitious names. You mean you committed fraud when you filled out the information. No wonder you are hiding.

Don't ever plan on getting a tax refund or any government benefits of any sort. Your social security # will give you away. Its also used by credit reporting agencies to verify information.

This kind of personal information has been available for a very long time. Before computers were used for everything you had to sort through tons of paperwork. Now you can do it from home over the internet. The average person may not be able to get to your information but the government and any serious criminal can get to it if they put in a little extra effort.

I'm not really that hidden. My wife uses all those cards. Old habits die hard. I have a mortgage on my house, but yes, I pay cash for my cars. Last one was a minivan that I paid $1800 for about 5 years ago. It's still running fine. I have no vanity when it comes to vehicles. They just have to run. Not so with my wife.

I don't think falsifying a grocery card is a jailable offense, I doubt it even constitutes fraud. ( Reminds me of the song, "Alice's Restaurant",.................What are you in for?.....................'Oh, I lied on my grocery card application'.)

My concern with the grocery cards is mainly, that my purchases are nobody's business. Also, don't be surprised, (if it isn't already happening), if health insurance companies get access to people's buying habits, and use that information to raise premiums. They probably would consider drinking scotch, for example, an unhealthy habit.

I think the best answer to this line of paranoia is the cartoon of the little boy being shoved out the door into the snowy yard and blurting out "I'm so dressed up that I can't play!"

I think, OP left out the everpresent cameras on the highways, in the Big Apple, stores, and the X-ray scanners, if you want to fly. It is not your grandfathers environment, quite certainly. Where technology exists, abuse follows as sure as night follows day. A simple example. Some people living in apartments overlooking the main artery to the New York airport got hold of some specialised scanners, then snatched cellphone ID's from passing cars. Sold them cheap. People made thosands $ worth of calls charged to the unvary. It took a year or so to shut that one down.

I think one of the outcomes of the Patriot Act in the US was giving law enforcement agencies access to the tons of marketing data collected. In Robert O'Harron's book No Place To Hide ^(disclaimer) the author nicely articulates the distinction of things you may say to a law enforcement agency and what you would freely put down in a store survey. Using heavy duty marketing tools in law enforcement? Apparently the system works well until something goes wrong like your identity is stolen. Trying to UNDUE the damage is akin to trying to erase something from the internet once it's out there. Practically impossible. The author again relates stories about people this has happened to.

The question is: why do we need it?

Loved kramarat's comment about loyalty cards. Made me laugh. I don't bother with the damn things.

I don't worry about it. I don't anything or have any friends that do anything that warrants government scrutiny of my or their activities. The only thing that could put me on the radar is my army combat engineering field manual that I was supposed to turn in. I figured I would need it when the zombie apocalypse happens so I kept it. Besides, these electronic signatures would be used in my defense if the cops ever try to frame me for something. I can see them using someone that is hiding from the world as the person to frame for a serious crime during some election year. Kramarat is probably already on their list of potential candidates to be framed.

Probably. Those big, black, dark tinted SUVs keep slowly driving past the house.

Hey, just because I'm a little paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get me.

Let's consider the grocery cards.

I don't think that it's such a far out scenario that insurance companies get a hold of that data.....................Drink too much beer? Don't eat enough fruits and vegetables? Eat too many biscuits or processed foods?...............Time to jack up your premium.

Now consider the fact that, if all goes according to plan, the US government will be very heavily involved in our health insurance...............including who gets treatment, when, and if it's justified. With the IRS working as the enforcement agency on insurance purchases.

Sounds pretty scary to me. Do I think the government would tap into our buying habits when determining treatment options? You'd better believe it.

With the shrinking number of government employees, we don't have enough time to keep such a database. It would be very extensive. That would require tax returns to determine household size, stores reporting what was bought on which loyalty card, those stores that don't have loyalty cards providing what I bought and so on. It would be overload. As an example, for my house, there are 4 people (My brother-in-law, my daughter, my wife and me). There are two separate tax returns filed for our address. We mostly shop at Costco (membership tracks purchases), Trader Joes (no card here other than credit), Target (same as Joes) and occasionally Whole Foods (same as Joes). The stores are not allowed by law to store our credit card information. This would require credit card companies reporting our purchases. Plus, we all have to remember that each government agency is its own entity and there is not much if any cross communication between the agencies. I have the same problems that the public does finding information from other offices in my agency let alone other agencies.

Privacy laws prohibit stores from selling your information to other companies without your prior consent. loyalty card fine print does not allow them to release your name and address, only what was purchased at what location and how it was purchased.

If the insurance companies were to use this information as a basis for our rates, yours would be higher than mine due to lack of information. It is what many of the auto/home insurance companies are doing. They claim they can't gather enough credit information on the person and then raise their premiums. One of my coworkers just switched insurance companies because after three years of being with one, they tried pulling that BS on him.

This is all hypothetical of course. Don't forget, that while overall government empoyees are starting to shrink, the IRS is growing. As far as the traditional grocery stores, and the reward cards that go with them, the databases are already in place.

A few things to keep in mind:

http://www.creditcards.com/credit-card-news/credit-card-purchase-privacy-1282.php

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2005/loyalty_cards.html

http://www.nocards.org/news/supermarketnews.shtml

Another thing that's been bugging me lately is Linkedin. I'm getting suggestions for people that I have met in my life, and barely know.................but there is a connection. I have no idea how they are compiling these lists.

Someone puts your name on the list - I suppose they have some program where if you suggest x number of names you get a gold star.

I keep getting those and keep deleting them.

I read yesterday where the number of friends you have on Facebook says how large some part of your brain is. Guess mine is small as I only have friends there that I actually know and like.

I delete them too.

I also turn away a lot of people on facebook. Like the people that think we should be friends because we went to the same high school..........................20 years apart.

There is a company in Conway, AR called Axciom. They gather personal information from everyone that has purchased a magazine subscription. They are a warehouse for personal information and sell it as names lists. You're categorized by your interests. I was there installing back up power sources for the company. We had to shut the power off for one hour to transfer from their current powersource to the new equipment we just installed. That one hour being shut down cost them $26,000. The building is not very big. They always had baby dolls working the reception area and they provided daycare service.

The reason we don't have to worry about government coming to get you is because there are too many of us to worry about. They will only come after you if you are influential enough to cause a movement that threatens the government. Our little comments, conspiracy theories or what ever might be entertaining to them but not enough to be a threat.

That's true too. I'm sure my little rants aren't garnering any attention from anyone. _{Maybe the moderators sometimes.}

As we we speak, the US government is suffering from data overload. They don't, (and probably never will have), the human capability to sift through the immense amount of data that comes in on a daily basis, that is coming from potential credible threat sources.

There was a show on TV about this a while back. The NSA, as well as others, have the computer power to pick up on keywords or phrases that are used in communications around the world and across the board, that may indicate a threat, but the amount of data is so overwhelming, that there's just no way to put human eyes on each piece of information.

Not to mention, the real bad guys are probably encrypting their communications. Not blowing off steam on CR4.

In addition to the NSA, there's the NRO and the DIA that gather electronic data that utilize banks of CRAY super-computers to intercept and capture all types of electronic transmissions using "key words".

The agencies that you really have to worry about are the one's that no one has ever heard of before that fall under the "Black Ops" umbrella and budget..... what Constitutional Rights do you have with them? ZIP, NADDA. Because they don't exist and cannot be held accountable. "Plausible deniability", and "need-to-know", as well as "National Security" are the key watch words for the day and beyond....

Men in Black......Area 51/Groom Lake.....they too do not officially exist either!

Like I said, my best defense at this point, is to remain uninteresting.

I'll never be a, "person of interest"...........................and that's just fine with me.

What I don't like is the new and possible growing trend of the automobile insurance companies giving out electronic gizmos that track your driving habits so that you can demonstrate to them your ability to lower your auto premiums.

A certain large insurance company advertises this intrusive device on network, satellite and cable TV. I won't mention the company's name here. Many of us in here have probably seen the commercial one or more times within the past few months.

My worry (not that I have to worry because I have a spotless driving record) is that the insurance companies will all jump on-board with this hyperbole and make eventually dictate it's use mandatory in order to keep or get automobile insurance coverage.....that you MUST DEMONSTRATE YOUR ABILITY TO GET INSURANCE COVERAGE........ditto with "liberal or progressive" state governments, MV departments and courts....... Ummmmmm, doesn't this sound exactly like "proven guilty of a crime before proven innocent?".........IMO, this smacks of Big Brother invasion/encroachment into our privacy. Shades of George Orwell's "1984"!

I believe the only time this device should be mounted in your motor vehicle is when it is by court order following a conviction of DWI/DUI, driving with a suspended license/ vehicle registration, found guilty of texting/cell phone use that caused a MVA of any type, horrendous driving habits that caused a death (or deaths) and/or serious bodily injury to others (both pedestrian and vehicle occupants), and any other grievous felony conviction resulting from poor driving, etc.

I thought it was a good idea for the voluntary program and discounts that they are offering with it. Although, I don't think I would qualify along with any other person who drives the streets and interstates that I drive on a regular basis. Quick accelerations and people constantly slamming on the brakes are the norm.

From what I can tell, the device doesn't have GPS to determine location or speed limit. It just monitors braking, speed and acceleration.

Just you wait, as it'll be a short matter of time to tie this device to a GPS and provide real-time surveillance......you can guarantee it happening!

The police can already access your cars so called crash computer, the one the car manufacturers installed to monitor air bag deployment in a car crash. It will have speed and braking info for several seconds prior to the crash.

All this surveylance, whether legal or not, is all about having power over you.

Remember the one element that gives them all this power is also their weakest link. Take out that link and they are powerless and have to go back to Fred and Barney methods. Namely take out their power grid.

Don't look now, but we have already lost all our freedom. The answer is, don't become a person of interest unless you really mean it. I believe that my address is already on location because of my Marine son. The VP was expected in town. He noticed the SS on the roofs and street corners as he drove past the civic center. Decided to have a little fun and drove around the civic center three times before he picked up that black suburban with tinted windows. He gave them a run for the money and lost them but they already knew who he was by that time. His car is registered at my address. About a week later, someone from the CENSUS was knocking on my door. Hum. So much for low profile. Did I mention that we are directly under the aircraft landing pattern? What is that black helicopter doing hovering over my house? A grocery card is the least of worries. Oh, did I tell you that he was driving down the highway when his BMW shut down? i hooked u the trailer and went to get him. He tried the car one more time and it started and had never had a repeat problem. Be careful who you play jacks with.

You're right.

We've already handed waaaayyy too much power to the government, or allowed them to take it............same thing. It will never be reversed. In fact, as we are witnessing, they will only continue to seek more. All the better if they can get everyone's guns away from them.

I know I'm not hiding anything from anybody. It's just a little game I play with myself.

My only defense at this point is to remain uninteresting.

We've slowly become a Fascist society since the passing of the 14th Amendment. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled that the 14th Amendment also applied to the Corporations.

It became intentionally polluted by progressive thinkers.

While not quite on the topic... I knew a guy who kept all the credit card offers he got (and all pre-paid, return envelopes) and he would stuff them with their own marketing BS and send it back to the company. I wonder it that's mail fraud?

<...mail fraud...>

Nope. That's called "fun".

With the new tracking tech. instruments comming into the market place we can track our younger generation from baby to drivers to college and beyond. Giving us their location, what they eat and how they drive or who and when they visit the many places of ill-repute and have it in nano-seconds on a spread sheet. Why, pray tell me does the powers that be,'big brother', not turn the terroist loose with enough sensors to track him to their source. Probation,Parole,incarceration, be damned and use this and other devices to let the out-law, in-laws, and mother in-laws sentence them selves. GPS on your car could be dropped as GPS on the convicted should cut the repeaters to the bone and the new man on the crimial docket convicted could choose Jail or Job..

As an enabler of Big Brother's networks I am well aware of the amount of data that can be garnered on any individual if desired.

Duly signed NDAs and all....I use cash only, do not engage in online banking, don't use Faecesbook, don't have a website, and don't connect anything to the internet or a phone line that I really want to keep personal......If it is really confidential then talk in person.

I limit my exposure. You have to exist a little to enjoy life. I'm not that worried about BB its the bad guys that I am worried about.

There's tracking technologies and there are counter measure technologies (that are illegal in the US. Hmmm.)

Legal safeguards? It's too late by then isn't it?