Why Cell Phones Make Educators Grumpy (Texting Time Bomb: Part 3)

And Shakespeare said Amen.

Roger,

I agree. But I think the problem is that schools don't do those things because, if I'm not mistaken, the school boards have to answer to the parents. If the parents bitch enough about the need for their kids to have cell phones in the classroom, then the board caves in.

I think so many parents just see school as a baby sitter and don't really whether their kids learn anything or not.

You said "If parents feel these rules are too much, they can send their kids to private schools "...the sad thing is that most of the parents that I know (myself included) would like to see those rules, but we don't and therefore are forced to send our children to private schools or to home-school.

I agree with the "Fail them" idea. Our society needs to learn to conform to our society's ideals. That statement may seem conflicting, but its not. Every one wants kids to behave better, people to be more honest, politicians and celebrities to stop being so dang unfaithful. This is our society's ideal. The way to do it is to learn how to be better ourselves and enforce the standards upon our children. If you do not conform and succeed in school YOU FAIL. That's it, failure is an option. Then the school boards need to do the job they were elected to and stand up to the parents when they whinge about their complaints.

I am not a fan of socialism, but somebody needs to get involved and enforce the standards. If parents don't support the schools rules, remove the privilege of school from the kids...but enforce the standard that the children must be educated.

An uneducated society is doomed.

Drew

You Wrote:"But I think the problem is that schools don't do those things because, if I'm not mistaken, the school boards have to answer to the parents. If the parents bitch enough about the need for their kids to have cell phones in the classroom, then the board caves in."

I suspect what you're saying is true. If it is, then I think we ought to loosen the power of the parents over the school board, maybe by making school board terms longer. I'm open to suggestions as to how we can empower schools.

I'm not sure if longer school board terms are the answer. It may help if you have a the right (whatever that means) set of board members, but what if you have a largely incompetent group? I can see that the members may be more inclined to make less decisions based on reelection if they don't have to go through campaigning as frequently.

Here are a few ideas:

1. reduce the size of school administration and replace them with teachers or use their salaries to give to teachers
2. Provide a voucher program allowing parents to move their kids to schools (public or private) which are not afraid to exercise some basic level of discipline. Therefore schools that do not provide a disciplined learning environment will have fewer and fewer children being taught in them.
3. Move the power from the school board to the teachers. Even if corporal punishment is not tolerated, if the teachers have some level of authority (such as confiscate cell phones during class session) without having to worry about getting in trouble a vast majority of problems might go away.

Those are good ideas. I'm not going to pretend I know the answer. I just definitely feel like something fundamental needs to change.

And people can't believe my wife and I home school our kids...

But somehow I don't have to worry about this or many other issues associated with schools (public or private), and amazingly my kids can do math (and even maths), nor do I care about the school board....

And then when we decided to move to Malaysia, I did not even have to worry about school transfers, because the school came with us...

I agree but here's another approach that I saw from one of my college professors (probably the smartest person I've ever met).

He hated students using solutions manuals for homework or cheating on tests. So, he gave us a warning about the solutions manual and then bought one of his own. If the solution looked identical he would lower your grade. This approach is a little crude but it did get our attention. I'm sure readers here can see some loopholes but the professor was diligent enough that he failed the right people (ie. the students that fail tests but get 100% on homework).

For the tests, he knew that students would keep old tests and the sell/hand them out to next year's class. What my professor would do to counteract that is hand out his previous tests for the last 5 years 1 week before our test. For the actual test, he would make sure that not one problem was identical to a previous test. Sometimes he would make problems very similar by changing only 1 variable just to catch us off guard.

I think what I'm trying to say is that the teachers should try to outsmart the students. If you complain that the morning class is taking pictures of the test and then selling it to the afternoon class then give them 2 separate tests. If you complain that texting during a lecture is disrespectful then take a mental note of the lecture material and make sure to include it on the test (with excruciating detail).

Unfortunately, as mentioned before, these methods aren't as effective in public school as they are in college.

You Wrote:"Unfortunately, as mentioned before, these methods aren't as effective in public school as they are in college."

Exactly right, because parents or the students themselves have to pay for college and people fail out of college all the time.

You hit the nail on the head: the problem is parents and state laws to some degree. Some of my sons went to public school and some private (their choice), and it was easy to see that students not disciplined by their parents pushed the limit to see what they could get away with.

In private schools, if the parents were not involved and did not assist in discipline, the students were expelled. In some public schools, undisciplined parents and students hid behind poor laws and administrators which would not allow permanent expulsion (and they knew it).

If we do not get involved and right these wrongs, our children, our communities and our nation will continue to suffer and fail to educate competitively.

Cell phone issue is a major one in all institutions.

*Cell phone entry is to be banned from students' usage and be in the rules and regulations of the institute apart from written instructions

*Some institutes apply jammers to automatically inactivate mobile phones.

*The teachers should not carry cell phones to class rooms and use during class hours thereby setting role model.

*Sensor scanners are still a decent choice.

*To prevent students play with cell phone during class hours- the teacher got take on move rounds during class hours. If you just confine to black board and mind lecturing alone, then comes the scope of mischief from students.

The vigilance also play a vital role.

New age and new problems, back in the real old days, 'Son if you come in here check your gun at the door, if you cause trouble that big guy will put you in the street, you come back sober you can get your gun'...Texting is fun for the new age, solutions for control are available with a little foresight..20 students, 20 boxes, one overseer, don't want to leave it don't bring it..'Don't take your gun to town boy' leave it at home...

I still like the idea of failure of any kid who cannot cut the mustard, for any reason. The use of any device to permit cheating should be expelled. If the kid succeeds at not interfering with others in class by using the cell phone and successfully pass the tests, then one has a different problem. This kid is not challenged enough. For this kid, contact the parents to have the kid transferred to a more difficult class. I expect you will get a very different response from the parents saying Johnny can learn more if we give him a chance.

But for those who constantly use the cell phone and don't know the material, just fail them.

You might inform the parents that the in class cell phone usage might be the problem Johnny can't learn. You may also ask the parents at that time if you could take Johnny's phone away for your class the next time he uses it in class. A permission note to do this from the parents before confiscation would certainly clear things up. It would also support the teacher that by asking for this permission you did try to help Johnny learn. But, teachers cannot force miracles. They can only permit them to happen.

A lot of good entries and reading here so far.

One thing I rarely ever see in such a discussion is the matter of children's "rights". In the case of high school and younger most of these kids are "minors", or, another way of saying it, have not reached the "age of majority".

In a historical context (until the last 20-30 years or so), these young citizens have virtually NO constitutional rights in the USA. For some reason, with thanks to the ACLU, we have somehow imbued them with full constitutional rights, thereby effectively minimizing control over them in many aspects.

Until we return to the realization that citizens of this age are still being socialized and do not possess the wisdom or experience to make critical decisions without close supervision, we will not be able to reverse many of the detrimental affects we're seeing in schools today. Children should NOT have rights without equal responsibility and the possibility of suffering the consequences of bad decision making just as an adult should (which could be a whole 'nother argument in itself).

I also feel (in my grumpy old f*rt way) that the age of majority should probably be 21, maybe even 30 in some cases (like me ).

Hooker

You Wrote:"I also feel (in my grumpy old f*rt way) that the age of majority should probably be 21, maybe even 30 in some cases (like me )."

I willing to bet you agree, though I could be wrong, that if someone is old enough to fight and die for their country, then they are old enough for full rights. That would place the age of majority at 18.

You are indeed wrong, Roger, I would not agree.

I have been in the position of fighting and risking life and limb, and not having the right to drink or vote. Back then, I suppose we considered it a right of passage to full citizenship, and most of us were no less patriotic because of the limitations. But, then, I could be biased because I grew up in the military.

Besides that, you have to get 'em young and dumb to get the best fighting physique and mentality. After 21 or so they start to realize that they're not immortal and become much less effective. It's no coincidence that the military tries to recruit them as young as possible, particularly in the combat arms.

Lastly, I would not be against the idea that the right to vote might be conditional on completion of a stint in the military or corresponding public service in a third world environment.

Hooker

You Wrote:"Lastly, I would not be against the idea that the right to vote might be conditional on completion of a stint in the military or corresponding public service in a third world environment."

I would be ok with that.

I strongly disagree in you assessment of 18 year olds being able to vote.

Older citizens suffer notable brain degradation, if 18 year olds are too young and inexperienced, then surely people over 60 have declining mental capabilities. Would you be in favor of revoking their right to vote? I wouldn't, not after all that they've done for the country.

I think once you're an adult (18), you should be able to vote. Some may disagree, but that's democracy.

Roger,

I am not opposed to mental capacity being a requirement for voting. However, I think comparing how an elderly person's mental capacity affects his ability to choose who to vote for with that of an 18 year old is not exactly comparing apples to apples. The reason 18 years olds may be considered too young, hasn't as much to do with mental capacity as it does with utilization of said capacity.....the ability to evaluate multiple complex issues and form a reasonable conclusion. While you may be correct that sexagenarians and older have declining mental capabilities I think the degradation has more to do with speed of processing, not quality of processing. I would expect there to be more data supporting poor decision making by 18 year olds than by sexagenarians, septuagenarians, octogenarians and nonagenarians.

Oh....actually maybe restricting those over 60 from voting isn't a bad idea...that would eliminate the vast majority of votes on Capital Hill. Hmmmm something to consider.

The problem as I see it is that there are responsible intelligent 18 year olds that can in fact make informed decisions. I don't think it is fair to punish them because some other kids are knuckleheads.

Obviously for the same reason, I wouldn't want to stop older citizens from voting.

I agree.

What is going on with the world today? Not too many generations ago, we were considered adults at a much younger age. Even though scientists show that our brains are not fully developed into our 20's, men and women acted more maturely and were running businesses and raising families.

I think it may be due to the coddeling that occurs in our schools and many of our homes. "Dont tell Johny he is wrong when he says 1+1=3 because it will hurt his self esteem".

If someone is old enough to fight and die for their country, the have been through basic military training and learn many of the traits required for being considered an adult.

Drew

You sparked a memory.

When I was about 12 (about 1960'ish), and the neighborhood parents wanted to go out and party, and none of the neighborhood girls were available, I often got flagged to baby sit the younger kids, even toddlers.

Nowadays the 12 year olds and even older seem to need baby sitters. Or is that a perceived need, not a real one?

Hooker

INTERESTING!!!

I sat on a jury yesterday, and we were requested to surrender our cell phones such that no information might be obtained outside the courtroom. We did this quite willingly... (in fact the Bailiff forgot to bring a container for the cell phones, so one of the jurors donated his hat). During a break, I was not allowed to go outside to smoke a cigarette (Smoking is not allowed within government buildings)... another case of no communications.

There are places where communications must be denied and mine was only one. Public Schools is another... for the same reason.

What if I need to get ahold of my daughter in an emergency?? This procedure has been handled by school administrators for decades without cellular phones. Call the school office!! Cellular phones should not be allowed within the classroom.

Options are... "turned into the school office on arrival, and retrieved at departure" OR "Kept in your locker" OR whatever. Posession of a cell phone in the class room should be handled by immediate confiscation... with the device only being delivered to a parent or guardian. Second offense would be with confiscation by the school until the end of the school year. Further offenses would be not allowing the student to continue within the school system.

I live with rules... the kids must learn to do the same.

Bill