Older Tools: Do You Use Them?

I am fond of my Yankee screwdriver with the spaghetti fork bit.

You must be careful to properly regulate the speed to avoid a mess on the wall.

Indeed. I have fashioned a translucent shield affixed to the body of the tool.

I regularly use a plumbline, a bubble level, and a folding wooden carpenter's rule.

Had a fellow who had installed (poorly) a very large steel door frame. The large steel doors didn't hang correctly; I checked the frame with the plumbline, discovered one leg was more that 3/4" out of plumb in 8', and the jambs were out of plane with each other by more than 1". This yabozo tried to tell me the mass of the building (which was quite a large building, I will say that) was causing the plumb-bob to give a false reading. The laser he had used was correct, my old-fashioned technique was faulty. I rejected his explanation, didn't need to check here at CR4.

[edit] Ah, yes, the Yankee push drill. I have two... somewhere... don't use them often, but can't bring myself to get rid of 'em.

I occasionally resort to bashing things with a rock. Where does that fit in?

In your case, probably under 'Spousal Abuse'.

That would depend on what culture you are using as a base line.

Does it say "Fred", "Flintstone" or "Fred Flintstone" on it? He loaned one from the quarry and hasn't seen it since. Apparently the guy he loaned it to loaned it out too.

Good Luck, Old Salt

• Back saw and mitre-box. Home-made "bench hook" cutting board. D-handle drill with a ratchet. Coping saw. Piercing saw. Fret saw. Hand-held planes from a block plane to a Record/Ridgway (other makes of metal plane are available) metal no.5 jack-plane and a wooden try-plane. Claw hammer, Warrington-pein pin hammer, ball-pein large 'bonkometer' for heavy hits (a bit of a cheat as this one has a plastic handle with a rubber sheath over it) - it goes nicely with the log-splitting wedge, which is definitely nineteenth century. Carpenter's square. Hand chisels various, all with wooden handles. Carpenter's rule, marked only in inches and fractions - none of this metric stuff. There are several long carpenter's auger bits in the drawer, to go with the D-handle above, and they are all in inch sizes.
• In a nearby town, the Saturday market is frequented by a local secondhand tool vendor, who redistributes things from people's workshops, either industrial or domestic. He is always worth 20 minutes or so to have a look at what he has got, even if a purchase is not immediately forthcoming.

Some of these do things that the modern stuff either just doesn't do or is too fiddly and time-consuming to set up. However, most carpentry can be executed using about fourteen basic tools when one has the skills.

Owzat?

I found an oddly shaped contour gauge at a thrift shop that turned out to be a wear gauge for Baldwin locomotive drive wheel "Tires". The workmanship and quality is impressive.

It would be easier to list the ones I haven't used. I've never used a milling machine, lathe, transit, or welder.

You make a distinction between a brace-and-bit and a crank-action hand drill. I assume by 'crank-action' you mean one of those egg-beater style hand drills. Either way, I've used both kinds.

I have a fair number of power tools - but I always preferred watching Roy Underhill's 'Woodwright Shop', where all the tools are human-powered, rather than watching Norm Abram's 'Yankee Workshop' where he has a power tool for everything. There was no 'cleverness' involved in the work Norm did, just careful planning and power.

I've heard that the latter comes in very handy when one is celebrating one's country's surrender to the latest invader, but let us not fail to also mention the stick from which one dangles one's hanky.

Pretty sure the white hanky functions as the case in tool roll fashion.

I think you missed some important ones.....come-along, chain hoist, ladders, hand truck, file, powder activated nail set gun, hammer drill, hydraulic floor jack, aluminum yardstick, clamps, vise, torch, molds and jigs, and one of my favorite, IR thermometer...

I purposely left out many others 1)If included all that I have CR4 might limit my posting to 100 pages and I would still have some more to go 2) Your list is very good, looks like you do automotive and rigging type stuff among other types. 3) I call myself a too collector or at worse a tool hoarder. My wife calls me a tool whorer. I try to limit her visits to the "shop". She has trouble with screwdrivers, she breaks all that she borrows. I haven't broken one since I was ten. I was trying out a new 4# drilling hammer!

I'm sure that the women "visitors" are a common problem.

Good Luck, Old Salt

It would take some time to list all my tools, I would say simply, I have a lot of them, and more than one of most....I do woodworking as a hobby and was an HVAC, mechanical and electrical contractor by trade for 30+ years, had muscle cars growing up and liked was forced to work on them, so plenty of experience on just about every electro-mechanical device you might come across....

Looks too clean and neat for my shop!

Now that is a very realistic shop! None of this Class "A" personality crap. In mine I get around easier if I use my pogo stick.

Good Luck, Old Salt

And you use the boomerang for felling lesser trees ?

Even though I have various new and improved mechanical types. They seem to get lost in the shuffle of things. Sometimes I have to break down and use an archaic one.

what's that?

looks dangerous, does it come with operators manual?

The first one I had included a tutorial... it was called 'First Grade'.

It would not be allowed in the workplace without a safety guard.

That's so funny you would say that.

I was trained as a technical illustrator. My first drafting job, only been there six months or so, I was drawing away when SNAP! the tip of the lead breaks off and jumps up into my eye. Rubbing, irrigation, manipulation... nothing worked, so the boss takes me to the hospital.

Yup, a lost time work related injury... working in a steel door factory... pencil lead.

I still have a few of those pencils about too, I think. And a Tru-Pointer.

Well, we won't get into paper cuts then.... That sounds it could be brutal

That's an "analog" pencil (as opposed to the digital ones, with a pushbutton to advance the refillable leads through the mechanism).

Are the digital ones called that because you use your finger to push the button? Would that make it a digital analog pencil?

Never understand how these (and similar drawing weapons) get through airport security.

A compass can be useful for troubleshooting motor windings and wiring problems, also if you are lost.

Certainly preferable to running in circles.

I've used every one mentioned and then some. I have a 1937 drill press and a 1943 machinists' lathe that I'm especially fond of. They are in excellent shape and see use almost every day. I've been a tool junkie for around 70 years so there isn't much I haven't used or seen.

"... a 1943 machinists' lathe"

Trade you my first-born?

A hand powered jitterbug for concrete finishing and a heart attack.

Keep a firm grip on it.

A little pen shaped device with a neon tube inside to check ignition spark.

A "wiggie" voltage tester that would explode if not properly maintained.

A Briggs & Stratton shutter-offer screwdriver tool for use when you loose that little blade on the spark plug.

The fill/drain tube on a lawnmower that does not literally mean "Fill".

The magnet that increased gas mileage.

The rubber bladed fan on the rear window deck of a Hudson that when your finger was inserted would make a noise that would cause your dad to slam on the breaks.

Vise grips that upon release, would cause blood blisters.

No one mentioned all the thousands of precision measuring tools needed to make all the above mentioned tools.

Apes were the first to use tools. They sure taught us right.

We are still apes, as were our fathers and mothers. I agree, they taught us right.

Mostly.

Just saw "Quest for Fire" for the first time. I had thought it was a silly adventure movie, so I never bothered. Great movie with the most current knowledge of that time of what it might be like to be halfway between chimpanzee and human, with some using fire, some using weapons, some monogamous, some cannibalistic. Desmond Morris was a consultant on the film.

I can envision the distant future, when the robots inherit the Earth, and they say, "Apes were the first to use tools. They sure taught us right." We had better teach them to be kind to their ancestors.

perl: the sysadmin's Swiss-army chainsaw.

I'm relatively young, 54, but I have used all the tools listed and then some. lets step into an old realm of relay logic, no plc's, no micro controllers just contactors, relays and timers (pneumatic as well as analog clock) and oh yeah! lots and lots of wires. that's what I cut my teeth on at the beginning of my career and I am still called out when some of the "ancient" machinery goes down. ah yes the old analog Simpson VOM was the tool of choice, and a pocket full of contacts. Nothing like it (shudder).

As an automation electrician I was involved in the transition from relay logic to the digital world. There was great resistance to this change which meant that the line foremen could no longer manually actuate relays with a pencil to "see what happens".

There was a marked improvement in timing from pneumatic to digital due to the fact that the pneumatic timers having a felt filter on the intake that would grow a mold that would change the timing.

The main drawback for digital logic at that time was the effect of inductive reactance on the output cards.

There were even experiments with bubble logic.

Wow! I had forgotten about that one (mold in the filters) but yes I much prefer the "new" digital to the "old" analog, troubleshooting is much less hazardous.

Hurdy Gurdy? Use it.

"Power Jam Saw: Cross cut saw held flat and parallel to the floor"

That's the only thing in your list I don't remember using. But then, I'm a journeyman machinist, with training in tin bending, model making, welding/soldering, glass blowing and rigging.

It's been fun, but hopefully there's more to learn and play with.

Of course this exercise could be repeated on the electrical/electronics side of the world. That's fun too.

Hooker

Still using my grandfathers Vanadium wrenches from the 1920's; his complete set of Brace and Bits up to 1.5 inch; his Stanley planes and Draw knife from the 30's; Ace tap and die set from late 50's, nail sets from the 30's;and my Rogers monster table saw (14") from the 50's.

They work better than that new fangled stuff.

Vanadium wrenches

we had a set of those, very well made..... except for 1/2"-9/16" offset box end.

That one were in a barn fire, and it lost its strength.

a couple of additional things I use about twice a year weren't mentioned...butt gage and spoke shave.

Adze and froe haven't been mentioned yet, for making cedar shakes. I still have Grandpa's drill index, with maybe half of the original HSS drills, which hold up better than many of the newer coated ones. I don't know what happened to his breast drill (no, not a mammography implement). A surgeon friend of mine has an obsidian scalpel, and has done some flint knapping. It's great to remember the classics.

The most important tools I have and use are; saw set, file, honing stone, hammer, pliers, screwdriver and vise.

While doing the wiring in the new shed, I hit a nail with a 1" spade bit. Dulled it and bent it...vise straightened it, and a file sharpened it. My young carpenter was impressed that I didn't just toss it out and grab a new one. It took a lot less time to make the old one good, than it would have to even find a new one!

I acquire and repair/restore many antique tools and I try to be sure that I use them before I sell them...or sometimes (way too often the wife says ) just keep them to use, because it nice to be in close contact with the work surface. Most of the old tools I find are in good shape except for some rust, and they all need sharpening! She told me the other day that I have too many tools...I said I just don't have enough space for them...hence the new shed!

I still use my scythe.

jhammond

Did you just barrel through that guy in the red shirt?

Yeah, I'm not fast but I'm not the slowest one out there. I also use my old chainsaw.

jhammond

I have collected quite a few older tool making and machinist tools, and keep them in perfect working order by using them to build molds every working day. I still use inside and outside calipers for fitting parts, and mic over them for dimensional measurement. I still build my own cutting, forming, carving and scraping tools. Sure the company relies heavily on solid models, cam software and nc/cnc equipment. But when they get a physical part from a customer in lieu of a computer file my old skills can be pretty handy in getting them dimensions to create a computer model. They no longer have a duplicator mill or lathe so I don't get to make cast patterns anymore for cavity building :-(. But sometimes the fancy machines just can't seem to get the job done, and I get to play old school tooly again. But as for the actual old tools, I have a nice collection of the very earliest indicators by Starrett. The earliest being a simple +-.003 needle type, in it's original box, the first model of the "Last Word" and several subsequent improved models. I also use a set of Union Tool Co. micrometers that are from the 40's, and still work well. And an array of little measuring tools from Lufkin, Brown and Sharpe, Starrett and a host of other lesser known manufacturers. I still get people's comments on my 24" vernier height gauge and vernier calipers. My mechanics tools are an odd ball collection of accumulated stuff, but has been polluted with some Harbour Freight additions in recent years due to financial constraints and the absurd prices by American brand names (many still built by Asian manufacturers). Tools are the greatest investment any working, skilled person can make. Once purchased they eat very little and are rarely bothered by the tax man, and are always ready to serve. And as I am now into my 60's I am looking forward to passing them on to another person who can make use of them as I have all these years, if I can find someone that is.

I've seen quite a bit of good old stuff that people still use, how about a SLIDE RULE.

Mine's still on top of the book shelf in it's leather case.

Mine's in my drawer for nostalgic stuff, along with the two yellow instruction booklets.

How about the flexowriter and the NC mill?

My first CNC was a woodworking CNC router made by Wadkin. That machine taught me more about retro-fitting, upgrading and jerry-rigging than any other tool I've ever worked on with. Prior to that, I didn't know there were any Cro-Magnon machine designers in GB.

Ah yes, the "good ole days". Many of the mentioned tools I do own and/or have used. All the new fangled stuff is great for keeping costs down in the modern day when competition is tough, but to the craftsman, his tools are his trade. There is no better feeling of accomplishment when you do it "by hand". I prefer using the older tools when available and have done so on many a project.

One of my suppliers is a machine shop that is 100 years old, with all the original equipment still in place, and running very well on it's line shaft. Yes they have some "newer" equipment that is only about 50 years old, but that really isn't "new". Without all the fancy gadgets and attachments on new equipment very intricate parts can still be made by a true "machinest". Nothing is more impressive that watching a complicated piece of machining being done be a true craftsman, except that you get to learn how it is done and not calculated or programmed.

Clamps. Bar clamps, pipe clamps, spring clamps.

I think I must have a hundred clamps. Some for wood ONLY, some for welding. Anything from 2" to 4 feet. Strap clamps. Corner clamps.

For the first time, this week, I bought one of those new-style one handed clamps. It's all plastic and closes by squeezing the handle. I bought it to hold long enough for me to get a real clamp in place. A poor stand-in for my son who has grown and moved on to his own projects.

-A-

A mortice gauge and tenon saw are rather handy for joinery.

That's all we use is Fred and Barney Technology where I work. We generate enough work to justify investing in a Laser and even our own Powder Coating Booth but the owner won't budge. He would rather complain about our quality of work not being up to par with CNC produced parts, rather than resolve the problem.

Of course. Add a spoke shave, and probably others that don't come to mind. How about a hand drill that I wouldn't let the kids play with--had ratchets, both left and right ratchet, high & low speed, good quality. This and many of the hand tools my father purchased in the 1930s (I think) are still in use when needed. My wife still uses a hand powered meat grinder which clamps to the table. What about the wheel used to measure for the metal "tires" on wooden wagon wheels? Have seen, but not used, these.

My Grandfather had a circular saw made to cut circles--barrel heads in his case since he was a cooper. Blade was shaped like a Belleville washer, but larger and with cutting teeth.

Old technology can be great!

In newer stuff, some welder's pick that look like heavy duty dental picks are extremely useful for a multitude of tasks.

I still use my "monkey" wrench with the TVR marking on the handle. (TVR = Tuscarora Valley Railroad - went belly up in 1934) Works better than the new style ones.

divining rods, are they for real?

"Divining rods" are real, not "for real".

Believing that they can find water is imaginary.

Some people swear by them, which may explain why they don't work.

I know a fella, water well driller in Montana, swears they work. Doesn't want to poke a hole unless the land has been witched. Tells some interesting success stories about water witches and their tool. He doesn't have any stories (that he wants to tell) about their failures. He's a believer, unshakable it seems. Church goin' man, as I recall.

As I've heard here at CR4 once or twice, 'Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while'.

See, that's what I meant, you can't swear around divine things....I think.

The driller in Montana probably only swears when he can't find water.

"you can't swear around divine things..." Prolly why he calls it a witching rod or dowsing rod... he swears quite a bit, pretty much all of the time.

He's especially colorful with a snootful of whiskey and ditch water.

Well, coming from the hills of Arkansas I've heard tell of people who could witch for water.

So, there's witching, and divining, for water. Is that......................what is that? Not an oxymoron, I think, although moron might be what I'd call someone who believes that you can find water with a stick or two.

People who divine for water probably name their wells using a Ouija board.

There may be an opportunity for LynDoor™Industries Technology Group here, ya think?

I've been considering opening a new line of camel toe and pigs feet manicuring salons here in Sinaloa. We could launder wash convert some of our American tax based companies, move them down here to hide cover up use those assets to benefit the local bio-diverse farming operations, struggling from the northward migration of product.

Our ice cream and bee breeding operations are taking off for us in sub-Saharan Africa and Las Vegas so we have an opportunity to further our strangle hold philanthropic commitments in under developed markets such as these, with other charities.

Lyn said Camel toe, funny

And a camel toe manicuring salon to boot...... I guess this is no longer the 70's ..... Man

Man, you have lead a sheltered life. The 70's ended 36 years ago.

Nixon is dead.

What? Does that be I have to shave off my pornstar mustache and side burns.

Nope. Keep livin' the dream.

My stepdaughter just explained 'camel toe' syndrome to me, yes that is funny...over the last 50 years I've run into quite a few that could have used a good scrubbing rather than just a manicure, probably why rubbing noses is done up north.

For Some it just went over their head..., but I thought the manicuring part was pretty hilarious...

I had a camel toe washing service one time, but my help kept eating up all my

profits,and I was always going in the hole.

My wife made me shut it down.

As for pig's feet: down south they eat them,pickled in vinegar and hot peppers.

Usually sitting on a bar beside the pickled eggs,peanuts, pretzels,and toothpicks that are stuffed in a small Tabasco bottle.Very ingenious, really.
Just shake one out of the tiny spout.

I'm from the old school, and I still use them all,including a corner brace,which is a

brace and bit designed for drilling in corners,a slide rule, a jack plane, a block plane,

A saw tooth set, a star wheel for truing up my grinder wheels,a circle square,

A pipe square for drawing a straight line around a pipe.

V blocks for drilling holes through the center of round objects.

A 16 speed drill press with Morse chuck.

A 12 inch wood planer,made by Foley Belsaw.

A ShopSmith overhead pin router

A wood lathe by Craftsman, circa 1960's(Made by Foley Belsaw)

A band saw by Foley Belsaw

A cabinet shop grade table saw.

A radial arm saw.

A miter box.

A reversible compound angle electric miter saw.

A folding carpenter's ruler,a carpenter square with a 100th inch scale (Which I cannot see to use anymore).

A spokeshave ,an axe,an adz and a crow bar and a wrecking bar, and a Johnson bar.

A stick welder.

An oxyacetylene set with cutting torch.

A tack welder(home made).

And my favorite tool, a water level.(This is Egyptian technology).

Sadly,most of these things will be lost in the fog of time,and no one will even know how they were used,like the Antikythera Mechansim.

I just took an inventory of my hammers thinking that I knew that I had many but I am somewhat embarrassed about it. I have most of the hand tools mentioned and many of the power tools. Some of these power tools. I must note there are some that I hardy use because they were my father's and my father-in-law's, both tool geeks.

Back to the hammers. Here are the 116 or more hammers I have:

Ball Pein: 8 oz- 1

12 oz- 2

16 oz- 1

20 oz- 1

24 oz- 2

32 oz- 2

40 oz- 1

60 oz- 1

Various sheet metal - 4

Punch hammer- 1

Cooper's- 2

Brass 16 oz- 1

32 oz - 1

48 oz - 1

Self made brass 6 oz - 1

8 oz - 1

24 oz- 1

32 oz - 1

Tack - 4

Rawhide, various - 3

Lead, various - 3

Carpet - 6

Plastic Faced, various - 6

Slag hammer (welding) steel handle - 6

Slag hammer wood handle - 6

Machinist (Starret) - 1

Carpenters, straight claw - 9

Carpenters, Curved claw - 7

Dead blow - 3

Engineers - 2

Electricians - 1

Framing, 24 oz - 1

Bronze - 2

Rubber hammer - 3

Drilling, 2#, 3#, 4# - 3

Brick layers - 1

Shingle hammer - 2

Hickory hammer - 2

Coopers - 1

Rock (geologist) - 1

Maul - 1

Punch hammer - 2

Slide bar - 1

Scaling hammer, pneumatic - 1

Club hammer - 2

Sledge 4# - 1

8# - 2

10# - 1

12# - 1

16# - 1

Rivet hammer - 2

Setting hammer - 2

Split head - 1

Mystery name - 2

I hide most of them from the wife. This list doesn't include those that people borrowed and I still waiting for them to return them.

Good Luck, Old Salt

What?No spark proof alum/bronze hammers for explosive atmospheres,like missile silos or coal mines?

No 2 pound lineman's hammer?

No blacksmith hammer/multi tool?

No ice-pick/ hammers for climbing glaciers or driving pitons?

(Just kidding) you have an impressive collection.

A friend once told me that the problem with loaning something was that after a while, it became theirs,and you had to "borrow" it to get it back.

The problem I have with borrowing them back is that I don't remember who I loaned them to. I tried making a list as each one is borrowed. I put it in a good place but I keep forgetting where I put it!.

I think one of the "engineers" hammers would be classified as a blacksmith's hammer. Maybe yes, maybe no?

Thanks for the complement!

Good Luck, Old Salt

"The problem I have with borrowing them back is that I don't remember who I loaned them to. "

What's even worse about borrowing your own tools back, is tracked down the people that the person you borrowed them out, borrowed them out to. And sometimes its a couple of levels deep.

Borrowed a horse trailer out once. that was 4 people deep of people that borrowed, from the borrower.

Found out, it took trips all around the Midwest and southern states, when we finally track the final borrower down, we had to wait until he returned from California with it.

The other thing is borrow out items like a cement mixer, people other then the original borrower never clean up.

Comments about 'water witching'...an interesting thing...in my collection of tool things I have a pair of 30" gas welding rods with a 6" L bend on the end...these are held by the short piece, one in each fist with the long end straight forward, parallel... when you walk forward and cross buried lines the rods cross ... I can't explain it, but this was shown to me by a contractor in N.Cal. in the '70's, and I have discussed it with 6 or so people I've met over the years in Alaska, Washington, Florida, Colorado, Maine, and I have been curious why this works.

Some may ridicule the methods, as I once did,and to them I say:

Try it.

A scientific experiment determined that certain people are very sensitive to infrared,and this is what is really at work with the divining rods.

An experiment was performed in England,whereas a scientist drew lines on the ground with an infrared beam,and then invited known "water witches" to divine for water.

About 50% of them found every infrared line and marked beside of them as water.

The other 50% found nothing, or random chance.

He then shielded the same area with lead foil and invited them back.

No one found anything .

This seems to me to prove that the movement of the rods is induced by subtle subconscious muscle movements of which the person is not aware.

Water below ground absorbs infrared and cast a "cool shadow" on the surface of the earth,to which certain people are sensitive.

The natural goal seeking mechanism of the brain gives feedback by moving the rods when there is a transition from the edge of an infrared shadow.

I have tried it using willow forks,grape vines or copper or steel rods.The material makes no difference.

I challenge you to try it with an open mind.

Interesting theory, I wonder if there is more to it than that, as I've noted other things than water lines located, including gas, sewer, buried phone cable in plastic and steel pipe, and some of those things are minimal producers of IR, although there might be a gradient due to their passing through the area.

"Water below ground absorbs infrared and cast a "cool shadow" on the surface of the earth, to which certain people are sensitive."

I'm sorry, I'm not buyin' it.

"Water below ground [200 feet +/- below the surface?] absorbs infrared and cast a "cool shadow" [If the water absorbs more heat than the overburden, would it not be a hot shadow?] on the surface of the earth..."

If the sales of the LynDoor Pseudosciences Virgula Divina start to dip like the tip of a divining rod, we'll contact you for some advertising copy, though.

The scientist's theory was that the infrared emanated from the Earth's core outward,with water absorbing the infrared,casting a cool shadow on the surface.

Okay, I'm with you.

It's not diurnal variations in IR from the sun, it's a constant source... but won't equilibrium... I mean, after a thousand years or so...

Never mind.

Witching for water.

Tinkerbell was here.

Infrared isn't too different from visible red, in its properties. How the heck is that going to shine through ½" of mud, never mind all the way from the Earth's core?

I agree 100% that you have to try it. Explaining it, though, is a different story. It is very interesting that infrared lines are confused with the presence of water, and that lead foil is able to shield them, and only half of the people who try are able to detect them. But saying that it is due to a "cool shadow" is pure speculation, and ought to be presented as hypothesis, not explanation. I want actual data. They have to go take an aerial infrared photo of the area where the dowsers find water and see if there is actually a difference in the infrared signature of the land there.

More hypothesis: Maybe the presence of infrared radiation is correlated with the presence of water, not caused by the presence of water. Perhaps electrical fields are involved somehow, since they may be able to penetrate the layers of earth better than infrared radiation. Perhaps magnetic fields are involved somehow, likewise. Perhaps the person is detecting flows of Chi, whatever Chi is. I've talked with people who work with chi, and it does not correspond to any other form of energy that I ever learned about, and yet it seems to work wonders. Maybe it is connected to whatever happens when we do lucid dreaming and can see things in a distant place, or maybe it has to do with prophetic dreams or premonitions.

We just have to wait for the research to catch up. Good to know someone is actually doing research.