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Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 10:24 AM

This has been a very sad day for me.

While on my way to work, I decided to tank up this morning instead of in the afternoon after work. After pulling out of the gas station, I approached an intersection and started across. The bus in front of me stopped and I had to stop as well inspite of being in the middle of the intersection. That's when I noticed something strange. It was around 7:30am.

On the opposing lane, people were moving into the middle of the road enmasse. Shielded by the bus, I had not witnessed that an accident had occurred on the other side (not caused by the bus).

Almost immediately, a man carrying a child in his arms ran up to me and asked to rush the child to hospital.

Not thinking twice, I unlocked the back door and let them in. I made a quick U-turn and sped for the hospital, about 500 meters away. The kid was in a bad way. I could hear her throat gurgling with blood. A head injury. The man, a bystander, tried to talk to her, telling her to stay awake and breath. I concentrated on driving while saying a prayer for the kid. The man kept deploring the lack of concern of the other drivers. No one wanted to take the child or the parents to hospital.

We arrived at the emergency entrance where the kid was taken to the ER. The man who had carried her immediately left, saying that he had left his bike at the scene and needed to get back. I stayed. The kid was alone, her parents still at the scene of the accident and I was her only link at the time. They took her into surgery immediately.

It was about 15 or 20 minutes later when another vehicle arrived carrying the mother. Her injuries were less severe than her daughter, a broken wrist, and a lot of scratches and small cuts.

I could have left then. But the memory of that child kept me there, wanting to know if she was going to be okay.

Presently the police arrived carrying her father. He was dead. His body practically ripped apart. His helmet had not saved him. His wife and child had not been wearing helmets. Everyone was cautioned not to let the wife know yet. It had taken more than 30 minutes to take him to hospital, just 500 meters from the scene.

I sat outside the ER waiting for news. Finally, around 9:00am the nurse came out and informed me that Kylie Marie, aged 8, had died.

I left, got in the car and cried.

I visited Kylie's mother at the hospital after work. She had learned that she had lost both her husband and child only an hour before I arrived. I had found Kylie's bag in the back seat of my car. It was filled with clothes and also had her school ID which is how I learned her name. Her uncle said that she was a second honor student.

I got the full story later.

A drunk delivery van driver had hit another vehicle in another part of the city and left the scene. He had sped through the city until he reached that intersection. A taxi, trying to get the jump on the vehicles in front overtook the line of vehicles at the intersection and met the on-coming delivery van. They both swerved to avoid collision but swerved towards the same spot, the motorcycle where the father, mother and child were patiently waiting for the light to turn green.

Why do people drink and drive? I'm sure they know that drinking impairs their ability to drive and yet, drink anyway. Worse, after drinking themselves drunk, they forget about this fact and drive like maniacs.

Why do people, trying to get ahead of the others, take risks with their lives as well as other people's lives? They think themselves as gods? That it will "never happen to them"?

Why do people, seeing other people get hurt, not lend a helping hand? I had truly believed that I had changed my decision to tank up in the morning instead of the afternoon because I would be there at that intersection at the right time to take little Kylie to hospital. But they had attempted to flag down other drivers before they got to me. Maybe it might not have made a difference, her injuries were so severe. But still...

If Kylie had been wearing a helmet, she might have survived. Her injuries were to the head. Her father had died not because he was wearing a helmet, but because his body had taken the brunt of the impact. Her mother was just fortunate.

As a Christian, I believe that things happen for a purpose. But God moves in mysterious ways. I may not know why this terrible thing happened and what my purpose was in being a part of it but things happen for the best. It just may not seem that way right now.

regards,

Vulcan

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#1

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 10:38 AM

Such a tragic story.

  • While doing what one can, others are not.
  • While living with high principles, others are not.

Pity the individual that has to break the news to the deceased people's family.

<...I left, got in the car and cried....>

Quite right, too. What else would one do <rhetorical question>? What a horrible experience.

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#2

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 10:54 AM

OMG,

Thank you for the good Samaritan act.

About the other people, I was told not to look (gawk) at an accident while driving by. For a number of reasons.... creating another accident. I was hoping that's what it was as I read your post.

But you know as well as anybody people do that.

As morbid as this is, I like to share an experience with you I had, not as cold.

I was driving up to see my parents over the weekend from Green Bay, Wisconsin.

Around a slow curve (Still 55 MPH speed limits) in the northbound there was a back up of traffic, which came to a stop. I said to my self what the hell. Only to see traffic started in the southbound lane...dam I thought. Only after watching the second vehicle drive by, it was a motorcycle that a pair was driving. He was shaking his head no....in despair and she was as white as a sheet with her hand over her mouth.

I knew then and made up my mind if my help wasn't needed, to just look straight ahead. Because I knew there was a bad accident and it just happened.

I drove and looked straight ahead; I could not believe the peripheral visions that I was picking up.

I found out later in the newspaper. It turned out an elderly gentleman (southbound) had a heart attack and drove right into a northbound lane. Killed the father, and two kids. That were traveling on vacation for the weekend. The mom survived.

But what I saw bothered me. Even at the short of time. Strangers had already stopped to assist. The driver (father was already covered with a blanket. with his left arm out the window. hell looking straight ahead I even saw the time on his watch. but what bother me the most.... is that I saw a stuffed animal (a child's toy) on the road.

Yes, I like everyone else that just witnessed this tragedy cried.

And witnessing things like that, remind you how valuable and delicate one's life is.

It hard to forgive or even to forget those who didn't care. But what you did was right. And those survivors need that, and not the negatives.

God bless you.

phoenix911

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#3

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 11:09 AM

Mr. Vulcan,

I'm very sorry that you had to endure this painful situation. I know that in a time of crisis we become very close, emotionally, to the people around us. As you did with Kylie.

Unfortunately people who drink to excess don't think that they are impaired. They lose all perspective. Sometimes something like this will wake them up and make them clean up, or in extreme cases they kill themselves. No body learns from this.

The punishment for this type of crime is not strong enough, in my opinion, to make others take notice.

As for those who just don't want to get involved, I would ask them if it were their child or sibling would they want me to just walk away?

There is a story that I heard many years ago about a man in New York city. He was driving home from work one evening when a speeding ambulance came up behind him. This man slowed down and continued on his way, taking his time. At intersections he would speed up so that the ambulance could not pass. Finally he got home and parked his car. he got out and headed up the steps to his home only to be stopped by the ambulance driver. The man was ready for a fight until he noticed that the driver didn't want to fight him, he still wanted to pass him. You see, the ambulance was going to the man's house to save the life of his wife. Unfortunately they were held up so long that she expired a few minutes before they arrived. If he had only moved out of the way for a moment to let them pass... I don't know if this was a true story or if the person who told me was just trying to make a point, but you never know.

I volunteer with Emergency Management in my town. There is no money involved and people ask me "why would you waste your time for that and not get paid?". I don't see it as a waste of time. I enjoy helping people, and in turn people help me. I could tell you stories of people coming up to me on the street and thanking me for doing something for them during a storm. Now, I don't remember all of these people, but they remember me and that is all the pay that I need.

In my book, Mr. Vulcan, you are a hero. Although the result of your action was not positive, you didn't sit back and watch. Kylie's mother will never forget you, and Kylie will be remembered by one more person who's life she touched, and by all of us at CR4 who read this post.

THANK YOU!!

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 11:22 AM

"In my book, Mr. Vulcan, you are a hero. Although the result of your action was not positive, you didn't sit back and watch. Kylie's mother will never forget you, and Kylie will be remembered by one more person who's life she touched, and by all of us at CR4 who read this post.

THANK YOU!!"

Seconded.

BTW - there's a lump in my throat.

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#5

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 12:05 PM

Mr Vulcan,

When i am reading your experience realy i got tears in my eyes, in my view you are the HERO,

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#6

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 12:12 PM

So sorry to hear of this tragic incident. I guess that everyone here would agree with me that some people shouldn't even be allowed to feed themselves (in case they get drunk), let alone drive.

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#7

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 1:45 PM

I have little or no respect for drunk drivers. My dad was a drunk, but he voluntarily gave up driving when he realized he was a danger to others.

Here's the punishment I would like to see for drunk driving:

First offense, no wreck, lose your license for a month. Get caught driving, even sober, during that month, lose license for a year.

First offense with accident, no injury, lose license for year, car impounded for a month if drivable.

First offense, injury accident, no fatality, lose license for 2 years, car impounded for 3 months.

First offense, fatality accident, charged with first degree manslaughter, ineligible for license until one year after sentence ends, forfeit vehicle.

Any offense, leave scene of fatality accident, charged with first degree murder.

Make the first offense hurt, and the more you hurt others, the more you hurt.

Vulcan, if I could give you a medal, I would!

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 2:09 PM

3Doug,

Off on a tangent.

I don't believe that will work.

DUI, DWI in Wisconsin are pretty strict and heavy fines. That includes jail time. Such as what you stated.

But there are still people that are going to court with 7, 8 offenses.

phoenix911

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#10
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 2:30 PM

Guys like these will drive even when their licenses are revoked. Best thing to do with them is to lock them away indefinitely. No, that's second best. Best thing to do with them is to lock them up with an indefinite supply of hard liquor. And let nature and Darwinism take their natural courses.

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#41
In reply to #10

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 9:00 PM

That's a damn sad story

Dvader1000 i don't agree take away their kidneys or liver? i forgot which one breaks down alcohol, they will be having their last drink soon

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#42
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 11:16 PM

I was suddenly reminded of an episode of Twilight Zone (or something similar).

A guy wanted to give up alcohol but didn't want to go through AA. A stranger gave him a pill to take which the guy immediately swilled down (with alcohol, what else).

The "pill" turned out to contain the egg of a creature that grows when fed alcohol. If the guy continued drinking, the creature would keep growing until it burst out of him. If he stayed away from alcohol, the creature would shrink and hibernate in his stomach. In the end, the "reformed" alcoholic was handing out "pills" to other drinkers as well.

I'm not advocating such a thing and I've no doubt that people (even non-drinkers) would consider it "in-human".

regards,

Vulcan

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#44
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 11:45 PM

nice an alcoholic chestburster.

I remember a similar story about smoking,

but this company was like the maffia torturing and hurting his wife everytime he secretly smoked.

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#46
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 11:58 PM

In the movie, "Eldorado", John Wayne and James Caan wind up helping a drunken sheriff played by Robert Mitchum. James Caan recites the recipe for a concoction that will make anyone sick if they drink alcohol. I remember it included hot mustard, and maybe gunpowder. I don't know if that was a real remedy, but it sounds like something useful.

Twilight Zone had a lot of episodes with a moral message that was more important than the weird plot. One had a man who was haunted by his car after a hit-and-run accident. Another had a street vendor who sold various items, and he always knew and had what someone needed. He sold a pair of shoes to a bully on a rainy night. When the bully found out the shoes had slick soles, he started towards the vendor to beat him up, but he slipped and fell down before he had the chance. If Rod Serling lived longer, he probably would have come up with a similar story about a drunk driver.

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#43
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 11:18 PM

Liver.

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#45
In reply to #43

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 11:46 PM

Thanks been a while since i open a biological textbook

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#12
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 3:46 PM

Well, I didn't go into subsequent offenses because of time constraints.

Second offense, one year minimum in state prison, not county jail.

Third offense, two years prison and one year in mental facility or treatment program.

I know enforcement will always be a problem. Prevention becomes a key then. New drivers will be required to know the laws against drunk driving, what the effects of drunk driving are, and the penalties, before they get a license. Make sure they know before their first drive that they know the consequences, and not leave it to public service announcements and ad campaigns by MADD.

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#29
In reply to #7

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 8:49 AM

"Here's the punishment I would like to see for drunk driving:..."

that's weak.

here in the UAE (where Islamic or Sharia law understandably prevails), it's tougher. it's the second top offense for drivers. for expats, that spells deportation.

IMHO, it should be equally tough in all countries, as well. old (experienced) drivers should be re-educated continually of their responsibilities behind the wheel, that it means life or limb for people around him.

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#9

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 2:28 PM

I can't answer you question, except to say that people are stupid.

Not everyone obviously, kudos to you.

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#11

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 3:41 PM

The drunk was criminally stupid.

The people who refused to help were criminally cruel/selfish.

Both played a part in the child dying.

You were neither my friend. Regardless of the outcome, you did your best to help. You may look in the mirror and grieve, but those others who could have helped, and didn't, will have to look at themselves in the mirror, and be ashamed.

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#13
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 7:46 PM

"The people who refused to help ... will ... be ashamed ... "

Hope I didn't twist your words too much, but sadly I don't think that they will (be ashamed). I'd like to think they could feel, but I'm struggling to convince myself.

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 7:52 PM

Agree with you........or thier making excuses trying to convince themelves on why they didn't stop.

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#37
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 6:50 PM

Me too. We can only hope.

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#15

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 9:11 PM

Hello Vulcan,

That is a very sad story. Our hearts and prayers are with the family and with you. I admire your compassion and thoughtfulness. Bless you.

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#16
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 11:43 PM

The government tried banning booze, and this led to a huge rise in criminal splly of alcohol. They then decided to use booze for taxes and so they do not put in place the stiff laws needed. Kill someone while drunk should be the same as killing someone with premeditation with a gun. That would soon cut the amound consumed.

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#22
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 1:03 AM

The government tried banning booze, and this led to a huge rise in criminal splly of alcohol.

Look what it did for the Kennedy's.

Hell England just knighted one.

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#17

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/03/2009 11:57 PM

well i can say i feel bad when here or such things ,The basic reason to this incidence is not just where you are located any where in the world its The Ego of self .this is my feeling Brain washing starts right from the child hood i am big and need not CARE for others life and in this part of the world in India the law also supports the erring drivers and take shelter under the common saying its destiny that killed or injured the victim if only elders in the family train the youngsters properly how to control the ego un specified Vitim's could have lived few-days more.

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#18

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 12:01 AM

Hi Vulcan - The world needs more heroes like you! I have a five year old girl, and if I ever were tragically killed like the dad you described, I'd hope someone like yourself would be around to help. It took a while, but here in New York it took a major cultural shift from the 50's till now for it to become socially unacceptable to drink and drive. Just check out a few episodes of AMC's "Mad Men" cable TV series and you'll know what I'm talking about. Maybe you could become an advocate against drunk driving in your country? Thanks for sharing your story here - hopefully you've got some family and friends in your home town to also talk to about this. - Larry

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#49
In reply to #18

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 7:34 AM

Hi April,

What happens on Christmas night in New York?. I have learnt hundred accidents due to drunk driving.For many people it is just sad Christmas?.

Suresh Sharma.

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#52
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Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 4:20 PM

Hi Suresh - You're right - it's bad on Christmas and New Year's Eve every year, in New York City and everywhere here in NYS (I live near Albany), but the rates have definitely declined since the 1950's. It's been a combination of lower blood alcohol content (BAC) laws, good policing, and the culture shifting away from tolerating this type of behavior. - Larry

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#19

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 12:09 AM

As sad as this story is, one must remember, everything is in passing in this world.

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#20

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 12:53 AM

Head off to you

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#21

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 12:54 AM

There is only one rule on earth that affects your status in Heaven.

"Do not remove choice from others."

Today's events were not about what you did specifically, but you can learn more from.

Bless you for your Love and openhearted giving. You can not change any of those circumstances. you did the best you could. You can only change your own choices and behaviours.

Even the 'bad' people need love and understanding too, regardless. Poor behaviour is often a cry for help, coupled with a sense of despair about their ability to change.. they may be lost... deep inside they also cry.

How would your thinking change if you get to Heaven, only to discover that your next life is to play the role of the drunk driver? Or maybe your last life was that role... and now you get to witness that scene from a different point of view...

While the body dies, the spirit never does. The purpose of these lives is to learn about the one rule, which embraces all knowledge, and thereby to evolve to a point where Heaven lives on earth.

I have been to the other side; I met beings with no bodies, no presence on earth, and yet were loving human spirits, so I know this is true. Be at peace. The ultimate reality is that Love is all that there is. There is no earth, no pain, no suffering... only Love.

Chris

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#55
In reply to #21

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/07/2009 12:45 PM

Well, while you are conscious here you are "in this world" -- i.e., the earth exists. When you are there, you are not. You have translated the second experience to your consciousness in "this world". Your attention is only one place or the other. When it is here in this world, this world exists. Experiences like yours allow us to bring the memory of that experience "into this world." But it is only a memory until the next time you have a supersensual experience. I'm sure you were deeply affected by your experience, but your statement about Love is only an intellectual statement for readers, unless they have had the same experience as you. Too often, people are satsified with these observations of others without trying to have the same experiences themselves. If only they would, then we would get much closer to heaven on earth.

Of course, there is much more to the creation than most people could dream of. A Negative power exists as well as a Postive power. All emanating from One power. These mysteries can only be experienced supersensually, not intellectually. So despite your comments on Love from "your" experience, it will not resonate with anyone who hasn't had a similar experience. Those who have not, can only try to visualize it, which is like night and day between your perspective and theirs.

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#23

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 1:36 AM

Why do people drink and drive? I'm sure they know that drinking impairs their ability to drive and yet, drink anyway.

I ask the inverse why do people that drink drive? Some people drink and they do everything under the influence of the drink; like it's their life style as weird as that may seem.

Unfortunate circumstance for the families and what culmination of the effect maybe is beyond comprehension.

You know the child is with Jesus, be thankful in all things...

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#24

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 1:45 AM

Thank you Vulcan for sharing that with us. Your actions warm my cynical nature.

The delivery driver was an addict. His brain is wired to consider getting drunk his favorite reward. He lies to himself to justify his selfish actions and they have now caught up to him at the cost of many others. (that's what makes me cynical)

Brad

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#25

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 2:28 AM

Mysterious ways for sure.

I believe that God setups decision calls from us, but some people still overshoot the risk. Others don't bother, and some tries to help to the best of their habilities.

Make me thing of the 20-50-30 rule some other poster broadcasted.

Never taught I would state it on an morbid story like this.

Thank you to have acted! Jean.

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#26

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 4:20 AM

Hey, you did all you could. The world is a sad place..
I'm always torn between feeling the suffering of the whole world which would kill me or selfishly just looking out for myself and my family.
I hope I would have done the same as you...
So sad that she didn't survive.
Philosophically, the only 'life after death' I believe in is the thoughs and memories we leave behind...in which case this poor girl will live on in our memories...hopefully we will all (by driving that little bit more carefully today) prevent some other missfortune somewhere.

You have my admiration
Del

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#27

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 5:15 AM

Thanks, everyone, for your words of support.

Kylie's mom is out of danger but I'm afraid that I might not visit her again. Seeing me would probably remind her of her loss and I do not want to be the source of someone's sadness. Perhaps someday we'll meet again when we have healed some.

Yes, I intend to do something about it. Maybe it will make a difference for some. I have a speech competition coming up in two weeks. There will be maybe 50 people in the room and that will be 50 people who will spread the story. I intend to tell Kylie's story. Winning is not the object. Getting the word out is.

I will also be speaking to the factory's technical safety officer, a traffic safety advocate. He constantly sends out driving tips, reminders, news and the like. There are about 700 people in the factory plus maybe 500 part-time workers. That's another 1200 people who will hear the story.

I don't know. Maybe this is the purpose for my involvement. Painful it is but I will gladly take up the cudgels if it will save other Kylies of this world.

Thanks guys,

Vulcan

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#28
In reply to #27

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 8:27 AM

Hi Vulcan,

You are our Hero. You have done your duty as good citizen and good Engineer.Here in Mumbai since one year traffic police is very strict about drunk driving, heavy punishments are given to such drivers.Checks are carried out in middle of the night. Some persons are sent to jails for repeated offences.Some have lost their driving licence. This has resulted in greatly reducing accidents and saved lives of innocent people. I suggest you should take up this issue with local authorities and see that deterrent laws are imposed on such Drunk Drivers.It will save lives of many innocent people.

Suresh Sharma.

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#30

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 8:59 AM

Hi Vulcan,

tough day for you, tougher for the mother.

in the grand view of things, it was pre-ordained for you to be exactly where you were that fateful morning. no doubt you won't forget it, ever. no doubt it, you've got some treasure in your heart now that wasn't there before.

in the greater scheme of things, Kylie is in the best place right now. we're still here to learn some more precious things from life's school of hard knocks. we weep, we laugh, we sow, we reap, we rise, we fall, and when all these things are over and done, for him who believes, it'll be a good night and a glorious morning.

cheer up, bro!

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#31

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 9:04 AM

Dear Vulcan, Your actions are truely admirable. So many people just don't give a damn.. Your actions touch upon your very basic nature to try an help others in need. I guess that is why so many of us love this forum. By answering posts of other in need we are atempting to help out, even if it is small or trivial.

Your action were not small nor trivial that day. You were trying to help someone in dire need in a moment of pure unselfishness. The fact that you did not care about things you needed to do did come into the picture when young Kylie life was in danger speaks volumes.

God bless you.

Bob

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#32

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 10:49 AM

Thank you for showing us that in challenging situations, humans can show real feeling and help however they are able. Thank you for sharing this with us. Since you post here often and in a beneficial way we know we can trust your words and consider this heavy experience.

I appreciate your Christian values. God does move in mysterious ways and is not the cause of some peoples bad actions. James 1:13 says "with evil things God can not be tried nor does he try anyone" and Ec 9:11 says "Time and unforeseen occurrence befall them all". Of coarse it is always best to read the whole chapter to get the context.

I am in hearty agreement with others calling you a good Samaritan. This teaching illustration that Jesus used as recorded in Luke 10:29-37 gives us comfort because it shows us the high value Jesus put on helping those in distress.

We all hope the best for you and our heart goes out to the surviving wife and mother.

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#33
In reply to #32

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 11:00 AM

DaveB

While he may have christian training, these values belong to every culture in the world. They have been part of human history long before christ or mohammed or siddhartha or whomever.... came along, and will be long after they are forgotten. it is simply compassion for the plight of others. It isn't appropriate to label it as christian only, as it isn't. It is this sort of action that exemplifies the postive side of humanity.

openmindedbeliever.

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#35
In reply to #33

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 11:31 AM

I agree with you that good values can be found in other religious training and also in the human conscience. Just because I was speaking about Christianity as mine and apparently Vulcan's values, does not mean I excluded others.

Lets please not make this thread a religious debate but if anything uplifting out of regard for the feelings of others.

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#34

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 11:26 AM

Vulcan think how you would have felt if you did not do something at that time. This speaks of your character and conscience. Irresponsible people can have children, drive cars, own guns, vote, drink alcohol, be a politician, etc.....that's an issue of freedom. Tough question, but you are an exception. An example that not all people "are like this". Like the guy who carried the child to your car!

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#36

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 11:47 AM

vULCAN,

Your timely humanitarian help to the injured kid is an act of concern and is an exemplary deed,in such critically needy conditions.

The influential factors made this accident are of multiple nature,the major culprits being the drunken driver and the taxi driver were literally responsible for the happening,which caused the loss of 2 valuble lives and injuries to the lady.

In developed countries,such incidents are estimated to be a rare possibility,because of the effective traffic control,systems,2 track laning,signals and people's co-operation to follow civis disciplines.

But surprizingly,mishaps take place inspite of better controls.

Vehicular population,speedy drive lanes,impatient drivers are our own impositions.

Such unexpected incidents have become part of our daily life,today to somebody tomorrow?

Peak hour handling of traffics,regulatory speed limitations in peak/city limits,collsion safety of vehicles,speed checks could be possible alternates.

Can I/we safely return home after departure?How kids/old people will sustain safety?

Cautious and being incontrolled disposition by all drivers towards mutual safety is the need of the hour.This incident could be a potential eye opener to one and all.

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#38

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 6:53 PM

Dear Vulcan,

Thanks for sharing your very tragic experience in CR4 forum.

There is a very promising help from technology to stop drivers under the influence of alcohol.

I request members to go through:

http://www.madd.org/Media-Center/Media-Center/Official-Position-Statements/Position-Statements/Enforcement-Related.aspx.

An organization promoted by Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD).

Please create awareness and campaign world wide for the mandatory installation of passive alcohol sensors with out exception on all vehicles to disable the same should a driver be detected under the influence of alcohol.

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#39

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/04/2009 7:09 PM

I was touched by your story and it seems that everyone else was. It would not do any good to speculate on the mental state of those responsible. They were in error as we all are from time to time. You can not depend on human nature even though your response was very commendable. The responses of others was not. We are not in a position to judge though and I don't think there is a thing we can do to change this.

However, since this is a post on CR4 where engineers communicate and try to solve problems, maybe we should concentrate on what it would take to remove the human equation from drinking and driving and prevent this type of thing from ever happening again. This will probably not become a reality because everything seems to be driven by money these days. Where is the profit in it? Are the lives of the innocent victims like Kylie and her Mom and Dad worth it? Would people be willing to submit to a test for alcohol levels before they can start their car or would there be a big business that would arise to remove such protection from cars illegally? Life happens and so does death and most people are too self centered to get involved in a crisis it seems. I am grateful for those with a sense of compassion that would go out of their way to help others in a crisis without regard for self though, and you are just that person. Thank you.

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#40

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/05/2009 9:27 AM

To everyone,

Thank you again for all your words. It is comforting to know that CR4 is not a community of people who hide behind userIDs and avatars. It's a community of compassionate people, friends one and all. I want to answer each post individually but I would probably just be repeating myself and that would not be fair.

I had debated with myself on whether I should post the story but I guess it was one way to get the message out and, as someone said, "it's part of the healing process".

It being Sunday, I debated with myself about sharing my story to the congregation just as I did on CR4. Unfortunately, my emotional state would not allow it. I did speak with my pastor later after the service. We prayed for the mom and her two remaining children.

Once again, thank you and God bless you all.

Vulcan

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#47
In reply to #40

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 2:40 AM

Vulcan..

First, let me say your actions are admirable, and we all have felt your concern and your frustration. But mostly we felt your compassion for these poor innocent people.

God works in ways that are not according to our understanding.

I am just a regular guy like all of us on here, and do not pretend to begin to understand his ways.

But, I am sure you were part of his plan, and simply for the fact that you are telling others of this, is a good thing.

I know some pretend to Not believe in GOD, however, just as Voltaire denounced atheism on his deathbed, I'm sure there will be some changed minds very soon...

Donald

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#48

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 2:52 AM

Hi Vulcan

I am not quite sure how to put this in words. I have had a similar experience but in my case the accident happened right in front of me. The driver that caused it tried to drive away from the accident. I had 2 choices to make. Stop and help the people in the car or go after the person that caused it. I chased down the person that caused it and me, being a voluntary police officer, managed to bring the person back to the scene of the accident. Turned out he had been drinking too. He was arrested for driving under the influence and for hit and run. People in the other vehicle luckily did not have serious injury but they never had insurance. Had this guy got away they would have really been in a mess.

I don't know why you were meant to be at the scene. But God knew you would be the one to help. He knew you would spread the word about this and already you have. If there is one person reading this and change their way of thinking when it comes to alcohol and driving, you might already have saved another life somewhere in the world. You just keep talking about this and don't look for the purpose. It's a very traumatic experience you went through, and just remember you are not alone. When you feel sad about this, talk about it. I do think you should see the mother though as I am sure she would like to speak to the person that tried to save her little one's life. That will be very hard but I am sure it will give you both some comfort. And I suggest that as my own opinion. Not a lot of people would have done the same if they were there. You handled it brilliantly and gave your best. You go well and may God bless you in everyway possible.

Conrad

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#50

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 11:02 AM

You are truly a hero even though it doesn't feel like it now.

Unfortunately drunk driver are not the only cause of accidents. Stupidity was the cause of the accident I came upon years ago.

A car had rolled three times tossing the children out of it as they were heading to the creek to go swimming. The father of the children driving the car had taken the curve to fast while having fun with his kids at the same time. When he over corrected and lost control of the car.

All the occupants of the vehicle were eventually ok but it was a tough fight for one of the little girls for a while. She was trapped under the car when myself and 3 others came upon the accident and one of the other noticed leggs sticking out from under the car. A nurse on the scene determined she was still alive and needed to be gotten out immediately. The 4 of us lifted the back of the car off the little girl and the nurse pulled her free.

I looked down at her (this is the weird part) and saw my sisters face. When I turned away tears in my eyes my phone began ringing. My brother was on the other end, My sister had just died, from a heart attack brought about from many years of sever mental retardation and the medications associated with it. At that very moment I new the girl would be ok. Unfortunately I had to leave for reasons I am sure you all understand.

That was just over a year after my oldest brother died from his own drinking and driving stupidity. He was drinking and driving and was the only fatality in a one car accident. From experience in my own family I can tell you they all think they are in full control even when they are not.

I think somehow God means for us all to be where we are needed when we are needed, and although we sometimes question the reasons why.

Kudos to you and all those out there that do the "right thing".

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#51

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 11:43 AM

Vulcan,

When I was in my early teens I whitnessed a tragic accident under different circumstances. It was the week before holloween and people where attending "haunted houses" and so on. My cousin and I went on what we call a "haunted hay ride" where a tractor pulls a hay wagon filled with people down a dark trail. Other people dressed up as monsters carrying chainsaws with no blades would jump out of the woods attempting to scare those on the wagon, etc. At the begining of the ride, when we climbed on the wagon, we were given specific instructions to keep our legs out because of the wagon wheels. I paid close attention because I had climbed on directly over the wheel.

During the ride, one man came running out of the wood, chainsaw roaring, making for a big distraction. Some people on the wagon where screaming, but others kind of chuckled at the cute kid who came out of the woods as well. He was wearing a mask yelling "roar!" and following about ten feet behind the grown up with the chainsaw. The adult with the chainsaw stopped and the child about, (who was about 5-6 years of age) was looking at the wagon while running and with the mask limiting his periphreal vision, did not see the man standing still infront of him. More laughter arose as the child ran into the man's leg and bounced off. Unfortunately, when he fell, he fell under the wagon near the front.

I immediately started yelling to those farther up on the wagon to grab him. My shouts where drowned out by all of the noise from the chainsaw, screaming, laughing, the tractor, etc. I kept yelling and momentarily thought of jumping off the wagon and helping the child (but at the beginning of the ride we had been instructed to stay on the wagon, no excuses). As the wagon rolled forward, I swung my feet out to the rear leaned forward hanging on with one hand, the other hand extended forward and down, prepared to snatch up the child whose tiny hand was stretch upward trying to upright himself. People began to realize what was happening and the noise diminished to just the sound of the tractor. Someone farther up who had watched the child pass beneath his feet yelled "someone grab him!" I yelled back, "I got him, I got him!" Stretching out as far as I could. Just as my fingertips where no more than an inch away from his, the wagon lurched upward as if it had ran over a rock, bringing my hand up and over his. His arms and legs stiffened and I immediately realized that I had been shuffled farther back on the wagon as people where climbing on, the wheel ran over his head. Blood spayed up onto the white shoes of the boy next to me.

Amazingly, the boy jumped up screaming, blood everywhere, and ran off into the woods toward the camp. The weel had torn off his ear and part of his scalp as it slid sideways off the top of his head. He was rushed by helocopter to the hospital and he made a full recovery.

The point of telling you this story.... Even though the boy survived, for years afterward I would occassionally relive the incident. "I should have jumped off the wagon." " I should have realized the wheel was further forward." "I could have saved him." In hindsight, what seemed like 10 or 15 seconds was probably only 2 or 3 and I may not have been able to jump off the wagon and reach the child in time.

As the one who took the girl to the hospital, you are close enough to experience some limited degree of survivor guilt. You might question, how you could have driven faster, or done something different. You could not have done anything to save the girl! Her fate was decided by the accident and the injuries she sustained. I know this may sound weird now, but if you start questioning yourself, if there was anything different you could have done. Reassure yourself, there was nothing you could do other than what you did. And you did the right thing!

God bless,,,

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#53

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/06/2009 5:14 PM

Vulcan,

You were magnificent and the family of that little girl will always remember what you did on that fateful day.

I wish that we could all be as caring in our response to such situations, if ever we are unlucky enough (or lucky enough) to encounter such a situation; but noone can predict how they will react in any such situation. We just pray that we can do the right thing - it sounds easy but "cometh the time, cometh the man".

You did more than anyone could expect and yet the child died - mortifying and so sad for you as well as her family.

I have never encountered such a sad event even though I ran a First Response scheme here for a couple of years - all volunteers and we were faced with emergencies where we could reasonably expect to arrive at a situation before the Ambulance. We often achieved the first arrival but generally too late to prevent the death that was pretty inevitable by the time that we got there. So whilst death was a pretty often occurence it was rarely a major event involving a child. Most of our 'patients' were basically worn out.

So back to your experience, please do use your experience to walk the talk to as many as possible. Only you can know what you went through and what the family went through and only you can proseltize the action sequence neccesary to save a life - and I am sure that you so nearly did.

Have faith and use the experience for others.

I commend you for what you did.

Thank You for your actions and for your ability to tell us what occured so elequently.

Sleepy

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#54

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/07/2009 12:23 PM

You missed one question:

Why did the drunk delivery truck driver leave the first accident scene?

This moral failure created the situation which then revealed the other moral failures you mention. The simple definition of morality being the golden rule. It requires no religion to support it, just honest introspection on each individuals part. "How would I feel if someone were 1)saying this to me 2)doing this to me?" Would this not cover all the actions in your story? If each person involved put themselves in the victim's (or other person's) situation the driver would not have left the scene of the first accident, would not have been in the intersection when the taxi was trying to beat the light (which he probably wouldn't have done had he thought about it in this way, too.) If passers-by thought of themselves as one of the injured parties wouldn't they want everyone within helping distance to be trying to help? The taxi driver overrode his good common sense to try to gain an edge in time. Surely, we all know that speeding through a green light is asking for trouble. In my driver's ed. course, some odd 40 years ago, we were instructed to look left and right when going through an intersection for this very reason. Do I always follow my own advice? Unfortunately, no. But stories like this are a good reminder to remember the golden rule as often as we can.

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#56

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/08/2009 8:59 AM

Vulcan,

Thanks for doing what you knew was the right thing to do and for posting your experience here. We all need to be reminded time and again that life is fragile, and our humanity can result in good and bad, depending on our actions.

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#57

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/09/2009 4:23 PM

Well my friend, first thanks to God and fate you were where you were and did all you could with the situation at hand, but to answer your question why do people drink and drive knowing they could kill someone or themselves? Simply put the law permits it. Killing somone while impared and behind the wheel of a car warrants nothing more than a D.U.I or wreckless driving citation to involve a $500.00 fine payable to the state court system.

Driving while in a drunken stupor that results in the death of anyone should carry the death penanty. They know it's wrong but what the hell if all you are going to get is a ticket? comm-on

As for why people will not stop to assist: Assisting someone while in a life or death situation is second nature for many people however, the laws of the governing states allow the assistor to be sued by any party or family member on behalf of the person who is deceased, mamed, mangled or looses a limb. You can be sued for assisting and not being a "licensed practitioner or not qualified by certian entities to save a life" even if all you did was drive a person to the hospital. One can claim you did not have adequate life saving apparatuses in your vehicle, or because you did not have asirene or communication device you wasted valuable time. In any event any person, attorney or court can hold you liable for the death of that child and only through the goodness of the person who sustains losses can your azz be saved. In essece the courts, attorneys, police, and the plaintiff all get paid and you get screwed.

Take it from me I own one of the largest law firms on the east coast but quit because of stupid laws. One day as I was pondering what to do with my life I kept seeing bumper stickers that said WWJD. So I became a carpenter. With my engineering past (which I am retired military engineer) and 37 years experience why not.......... no stress.

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#58
In reply to #57

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/09/2009 10:29 PM

As far as I know, there's no such law in the Philippines where the rescuer can be sued by the rescued. If there is, I haven't heard of anyone being sued.

Somewhere in the back of my mind, as I opened the back door, I was telling myself, "she shouldn't have been moved". Unfortunately, few people are trained in first aid and first instincts by well-intentioned people is to rush them to hospital. I've had some first aid training but never had to face a real situation until that day. But seeing the kid's condition told me that she needed better care than I could give and she needed it fast.

I have been seriously thinking of putting first aid materials into my car's trunk. A collapsible backboard/stretcher; bandages; splints; something that will enable me and a few hands to give first aid and transport someone properly.

Anyone with a design for a collapsible backboard?

I visited the mother last night at the hospital. She's able to move around already though she gets dizzy if she stands too long. She has a small hairline fracture of the skull but no clots or bleeding. She's been complaining of pain in her stomach which feel like cramps but scans and x-rays don't show anything, however. I suspect that these are after-effects of a concussion but I'm not a doctor. A specialist has been called in.

By the way, I need to make a correction. I had theorized that the taxi had contributed to the accident by overtaking the line. I had based this on my observation on the positions of the vehicles at the time of the accident. It seems, however, that this was not the case according to eyewitness accounts. Everything was entirely the fault of the delivery van driver.

regards,

Vulcan

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#59
In reply to #58

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/12/2009 8:22 AM

Very sad story, I'm sorry you had to go through this.

Vulcan, the next time you look in the mirror you can take solace in the fact that the world is a better place because of people like YOU.

Highest Regards,

Steve M.

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#60
In reply to #58

Re: Why Are People Like This?

04/13/2009 7:05 AM

Hi Vulcan,

Nice to hear that you visited the lady again.Tell her that people of whole world through CR4 Forum are with her. Her hair line crack in head will go away very soon along with internal cramps in stomach. She would be normal very soon. She needs some moral support to recover from this trauma. May God Bless her and you.

Suresh Sharma.

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